Re: Was it just me?
 

i was offened that he said I was hiding things.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Jeff...

Don't be offended...we apreciate you filling us in on the details of things we wouldn't normally hear....we need to inform you if we think something is wrong.....and I'm sure we will in the future....

thanks...

CBS
Rock Haas

Re: Was it just me?
 

I missed this thread at first,but I'm glad I read it. .......I video all my runs, so I know what the variance on frame count for the reaction times is for my camera. .....At the Atco points race I tested on Thursday,making 6 passes . ...Five were between .011 and .018 all at the same frame count, one was a .080! at the same frame count.........I initially wrote it off as a fluke untill I had a .079 light at the same frame count ,in the same lane ,at the same time of day! ............I know I heard several other racers with similar r.t's at the same time of day......... On Saturday after a .015 lite during time trials, I felt confident staying in the same lane, again I got bit by a .069 light.........The common factors on all the runs were that the sun was on that side of the track, and all the runs were within five minuits of the same time of day, 5 pm.............At this point, I suspect that a weak infared sensor can react to the low sun angle, similar to the shine back problem we had when we had photocells....... Jeff, can you comment on this? ... ..Tom

Re: Was it just me?
 

Wow I just seen this sorry for putting my 2 cents in late....

First off it is WELL KNOWN among local bracket racers that the timing system there is ..well...for a better choice of words...."iffy" at best. The rollout is .20 different between the left and right lane...nearly ALL BOX RACERS there have to swing the box to stay green....and you see it in the time slips on an avg day you are 1-2 slower lane to lane....which adds up with the rollout differance. I know I know its checked out every day...but im telling you first hand this is how it ACTUALLY goes down. Plus if it rains for beg, borrow or cheat your way out of the right lane!!!!! I have watched 10-12 red lights in a ROW happen and no one stops to wonder why.

I had a slip in my dragster from there last year where I was 14 mph down on the brakes, had the same 1000ft as my time shot and broke out by .035...HUH...and it said I took .05 stripe....I had a wheel on him at best!!!

For what its worth I was swinging my box lane to lane all weekend at the National except for 1 time shot and I was -.015 red....It was a self imposed test to see if they were using 66's timing equipment or thier own.

I still race there....but I will tell you It makes me real nervous when I get those slips some days.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Jeff,
I was just tossing out some random questions, I appreciate the frank response and I hope to take you up on your offer some day. I hope others racers will do so as well!

Maybe we can nip any issues beforehand, I think Tom is onto something.
Last year we had to halt a race for 15-20 minutes because the track said the sun was interfering with the timing system. Since the sun's rays are 80% in IR, it makes perfect sense that at the right angle it would make a sensor believe it isn't broken, and for sure delay the feedback.

They did this on the show Mythbusters when they disabled an IR security system by shining a light at the sensor.

You know what would be cool is if we didn't have invisible IR for beams, but had visible red laser beams for staging and or the finish line. Talk about cool data and great finish line shots!

-steve

Re: Was it just me?
 

Just wanted to let everyone know that RT66 replaced the IR on the left lane stage beam, and tested with cars that said they had problems with it and the showed everything is now good with the startline.
Jeff Foster

Re: Was it just me?
 

Buy backs anyone?Best outta 3?

Re: Was it just me?
 

I"m confused .:confused: The nose on my dragster is 2.75 high. If what you guys are sayingis correct I am tripping the beams at the starting line with the front tires and tripping the finish line beam with the nose. This would make a huge difference on how much stripe I am taking depending on whether I am running a door carthat is tripping the finish line with the tires or another dragster that is tripping with the nose.

Re: Was it just me?
 

I did not say you were hiding it, however, with ICARD I was able to identify these problems ASAP that a track could not dispute.

Every business, including mine, needs Checks and Balances. My checks and balances come from my customers who give me feedback on what works and what does not. I make improvements everyday to my system because of it.

ICARD was NHRA's and your checks and balance so to speak.

This is not against you, it is against unfair competition. If something is wrong how do racers know without real information?

Re: Was it just me?
 

Don you keep saying you could find it. Only the racer who knows what his car should and usualy does would know if there is a problem, And this is what you said "Now they can hide the problems because nobody knows any better" well I am "they" so you accused me of hiding things!

Re: Was it just me?
 

Jeff:

If there is a technical issue at our local track or a divisional race, do they have the availability to check for lazy infrareds or other posibble irregularities? For instance at a division 5 race there were approx two hundreds difference between lanes, react and e.t., and some people new that while others like me were left to think there were t-stop issues or chassis probelms. Without looking like a cry baby what does a racer do when they tell you there is no timing or track problems? Thanks again or all your technical input.

Craig Anderson

Re: Was it just me?
 

Craig at D5 take slips to DD, Rob is good at checking things out and not affraid to call me.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Hey Jeff....can you pm me with the brand names of the photoeyes....I will investigate some testing methods....maybe we can come up with something easy that you can do each morning...so you can fix them before the race....

Rock Haas

Re: Was it just me?
 

I've been in this buissnes for 15 years our company 28 years, our IRs are custom built for us, we know all there is to know about them. They are tested and checked at the start of events but unless you can come up with something that replicates the vibration and harmonics of a car on the convertor at 5000+ RPM, we probably allready have it.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Jeff, all those years of experience is good for one thing The Experience. If something new needs to be done to level the playing field for everyone lets try something new. Do Not Defend Something Just Because It Has Always Been Done That Way!!!!
My 2 Cents

Re: Was it just me?
 

Maybe mounting them on on something like this to test them could replicate close to what your asking for?




http://www.dragracingonline.com/itsn...clutchdyno.jpg

Re: Was it just me?
 

I wasn't trying to fault anything you have been doing.....I just thought maybe the manufacturer might have a piece of test equipment that measured the speed and repeatability of the eye....but in place at the track...

this situation rarely happens...but in the case @ Joliet...it sounds like its been there for a while....surely you checked the eyes there and they passed your procedure....otherwise you would have changed them....

maybe we can provide you with a car when you check them to simulate some vibration....I'd sign up for a morning....I'm sure we could get enough volenteers....

We all know Compulink is the finest....but if we can help to make it better...we are all interested...

Just so you know where were coming from.....

When we spend what we do to do this "Hobby"...and travel x amount of miles....and can't cut 2 lights within 4 hundreds of each other....because something might be failing on the timing system....
makes us unhappy...

So if we can help in any way....to make the system better ....let us know....there are all kinds of characters on this site....engineers to floor sweepers ...I'm sure...maybe somebody can help....

Rock

Re: Was it just me?
 

I was not, as stayted "Do Not Defend Something Just Because It Has Always Been Done That Way!!!!"

I was just statting we work with the manufacture of our IR sensors to develop and have them custom built, they arent off the shelf units. We have all equipment available to test them, but things change with the harmonics of the cars that cant be seen in the testing.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Is there anything we can do to help you...if there is don't hesitate to ask....

CBS
Rock Haas

Re: Was it just me?
 

Hey thats awesome news thanks Jeff!!!!!!

Re: Was it just me?
 

Shooter....maybe you can give us a report after you bracket race there next time.....

Re: Was it just me?
 

I will be out there this month....will do!

shooter

Re: Was it just me?
 

Rock

We are testing there tonight and will let ya know what happens.

Re: Was it just me?
 

Went to Rt 66 last night and was told both lanes have new IR's
Everything went great last night ... need to see what happens in the day light

Re: Was it just me?
 

Jeff:

Thanks again for taking the time to respond to my questions. You have a tough job and I would not to be in your shoes when there are problems. Hopefully in the future with some cooperation between the racers and track management we can work through some of these timing issues. Hope you and everyone else had a beautifull and safe 4th of July.

Bighead