Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Although my 85 Mustang is carburated, I also elected to retain the factory gas tank. Like Charlie said, its a good way to adjust the weight easily, plus the tank is at the very back of the car. Also, if you did add a fuel cell, and removed the stock tank , it looks like the rear bumper cover would tend to grab some air, even more so with the GT rear bumper on your convert.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Hmm...you got me thinking on that one. Maybe run the straps and poly tank cover down there to slipstream the air? :cool:

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

One thing you should consider.
It's a heck of a lot easier to get old or contaminated fuel out of a cell , or to do a fuel brand test.
One good reason to remove the foam too.
White plastic cells work well to see what you've got and to wipe it out to change fuels.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich.....how's the build coming?

Sorry to see you slipping to the Dark Side with a Blue Oval product (grin).....though I have to admit to a fondness for Fox bodied cars.

My '93 notchback was a real sleeper with the Powerdyne centrifugal supercharger. Surprised a few of the local 'ricer street racer types ;). -Al

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...pse01e1f0b.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...ps1c037b20.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Beautiful Mustang Alan...my first one was a '90 GT coupe which I wish I had kept.

Feel like I'm just creeping along so far, but I did manage to get the housing back under the car today. Forgot to load the pinion flange when I left the house so I could not finish this evening. I still have to press wheel studs in the axles and seat the C-clip eliminators...barring any problems I should have the aft portion wrapped up tm. Roll bar due to be delivered Tuesday.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps36020b54.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps83fe333f.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps0f5fa270.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich, Are you going to use taller rear springs?

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Those are the factory GT springs Mark. From what I hear they are about what I need for the rear...no idea how the car will sit until I get it on the ground with weight on it. Tires will be 26" out back to begin with. I've been told four cylinder front springs work fairly well for this car...trial and error I suppose.

Spent an hour honing a checking pinion bearing for this 8.8 this evening only to realize once I finished I already had one...12-bolts use the same pinion bearings as the 8.8's lol. :o

Someday soon maybe...Brian Thompson's P/SA.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psa0a9e491.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psdeec3a47.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Reason I ask is because you are lowering the car, or raising the axle (if you prefer) in the car with that setup.
I agree with waiting till it's on the ground and weighted, to see where you're at.
4 cyl. springs work well, in my experience.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich, I can`t tell by your photos, but did you have the axle tubes welded solidly to the cast center. It may not be as critical with an automatic, but I have seen 8.8s rotate the axle tubes on stick cars.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

No, I have not Rory. I was told it wasnt necessary at the proposed hp level...it was also suggested a better alternative would be to drill/tap 3/8" bolts into the tubes. We shall see. Back to the grind this morning to see if I can finish the back of the car and move forward.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Great time for a few skip welds and easy too if you have a mig welder handy. Nice job on your cars btw

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Brian's car with the top down. That's him in the background. His trailer carries this car and his SS/MA Mustang. The truck camper is his motor home...(one of my heroes)

http://i.imgur.com/vyn6dYy.jpg

Rich is up there too. Two racers built at home and an open rig. Gotta love it.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Yep, I like the looks of that car for sure.

Finished up the back end today. I'll give the sway bar a chance at least.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps5e35a00c.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps09ec101a.jpg

Finished the 5-lug swap all around...need to find some 4-cylinder front springs or something similar along with some struts. Car sits pretty well atm...going to try to pull that engine out tm or at least get started on it.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psa64615ac.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psd6f2a61a.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Made a light day of it today as I'm pretty tired. Partner helped me finish up welding of the subframe connectors so that is now finished. I made an initial dive into the engine bay...boy, talk about 10 pounds in a 5 pound sack! The brackets alone look like they were designed for a dump truck...lots of weight to come off the front-end in this car. The only thing that will be belt driven when finished is an alternator.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psdd680658.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps6f7cbd1a.jpg

Oh yeah...found a set of 4-cylinder front coil springs on Ebay for $30. :)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Question for you Mustang racers - Are those factory tubular X-braces under the front of these cars really necessary with the welded subframe connectors and roll bar? I can't see those skimpy bars doing much at all in my mind and would prefer to do away with them completely.

Also looking for the simplest, lightest and most cost effective way to run a alternator on this engine...it will be the only belt driven accessory up front. Sure don't want to use the factory alternator as it is a behemoth.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Those are called "export braces". They were added by Ford in the early runs of the Mustang because the frame was so weak that the car wasn't allowed to run in Europe because of the winding roads over there. They were the first things I upgraded in my 68 coupe but I'm not sure there are worth it. With subframe connectors and a full cage jacking one point now lifts the entire side off the ground. It used to just lift one wheel. At any rate, that's a bolt on item. Leave it for later and toss it in if you feel it needs it. Mine are from Chris Alston's ChassisWorks subdivision Total Control.

EDIT: I think I mis understood you. Do you mean under the engine or transmission? Export braces span the shock towers over the engine.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Dale - These are the flimbsy braces under the engine that run under the K-member to the radiator support and backwards to the rocker panels. Sorry I don't have pic's of them atm...may be just a convertible item.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Convertible item. Call Team Z and ask them to be cetain but I think you could probably pitch them with the improvements you've made.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Like this?

Mustang GT Convertible K Member Brace

Can't say if they are important on the strip. Lots of nice aftermarket front ends for these cars...$$$...$$$...

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Here is the rearward brace... http://www.ebay.com/itm/271646620707...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

The front one is similar and just attaches to the radiator support. They are so thin I can't see any benefit to running them. Don't think those aftermarket K-members would fly with NHRA in Stock.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Yes, you have to have them, Rich...Now that you put it on the internet.
TMI

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Information is what I am after Mark...if I have to run them so be it. The two pounds in weight is not a concern...the reason/need for them being there is.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Unfortunately, Mark may be right. Stock requires a full factory front end as does SS except for the conversion cars, for that matter. When I rebuilt the front end of my 68 for GT I used aftermarket stock replica parts piece for piece except for brakes. There are solid bars similar to those on my car that run from the lower control arms to the front of the chassis under the radiator support. They are responsible for part of the alignment and are adjustable. The whole front is different from yours.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

A pic of the front brace attached...

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps46afb595.jpg

I know some use these parts, but I never envisioned it would be illegal to delete or modify said part. What exactly constitutes "factory suspension"? I can substitute aftermarket rotors/calipers but can't touch this junky bracket? It looks like a bandaide fix from Ford to me. When I installed the subframe connectors I had to cut the factory braces at the rear that the back braces bolt to...does this make the car null and void now? It sure isnt going to be as Ford produced it.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich, You ask a question like this on the 'net, and you'll get 10 answers ...5 for , 5 against..
including some from folks who have yet to ever make it to their first NHRA nat. or divisional.
All you've accomplished is pointing out the item that you may not want to have on your car.

There are at least three Fox convertibles in Div. 3, including one guy who is in the Ford performance business.
These people are the ones who have your answer...in person.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I've photos of cars wheels up in ND that don't seem to meet these regs.

"SUSPENSION, Front
Must retain complete stock front suspension system as produced
by manufacturer for body used, aftermarket tie rods with Heim joints
permitted. Lift kits/travel limiters prohibited. Sway bar optional. See
General Regulations 3:4.

3:4 SUSPENSION
All cars must have a full suspension system of the type produced by an automobile manufacturer (i.e., springs, torsion bars, etc.). Rigid- mount front and/or rear axles are permitted when so indicated in Class Requirements. All rod ends must be installed with flat washers of sufficient outside diameter to prevent bearing pullout. Hollow rod ends are prohibited. With the exception of unaltered OEM production Can-Am Spyder three-wheel motorcycles, three- wheel vehicles are not eligible for competition in any class. Radius rods are not required on front axles that are rigidly mounted 18 inches or less from kingpin axis. Any front suspension using a beam or tubular axle must have radius rods attached to frame."

Aftermarket brakes are OK. If that thing counts as a radius rod, toss it. Since it bolts in, pull it out but hold on to it. If a tech asks for it, stick it back in.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Sway bar Optional,, Rich. The way that thing is bolted in, going from one side to the other,, it could be considered a sway bar,,, at least it looks like one when I squint my eyes! Good luck with this project,,, but I do miss the Camaro build.
Danny Durham

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Those tubular bars going forward from the crossmember in a v, aren't part of the suspension like the strut rods on my 70's cougar. While removing them, I don't believe would compromise much strength in the body and would make access easier, but I wouldn't remove them.

As for an alternator, I'd just use a lower amp 70's style unit. But I have a few laying around to choose from.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

On my 85 Mustang, I used the original alternator, and mounted it where the smog pump used to go, down low, to the passenger side of the harmonic balancer. I also cut away much of the large aluminum bracket that wasn`t doing anything anymore.I used an aluminum Moroso alternator pulley, and a factory V belt crank pulley from a 1970s 302, and modified some old adjusting bracket I found at a wrecking yard. It works fine, is out of the way, and in 11 years, has never pitched the belt. Cheap and simple.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I waited and went to work thinking about this Mark so I could be sure of being polite and respectful.

That statement infers that doing something out of the scope of the rule book is alright as long as it isnt spoken of...at least that is how I interpreted it. I don't exist in a grey area nor do I wish to...I'm the most black and white person you are likely to meet and make no apologies for it. The only reason I post on this forum is because I thought this would be the best place to gather information from like minded racers on subjects or issues I have with ongoing projects.

I understand this is a open forum and I appreciate information and suggestions from all regardless of experience...you never know what ideas might prove beneficial until you hear them. I like to think I'm savvy enough to sort through and consider all input. Those that follow me here know I am not prone to opinions nor do I usually comment on subjects unless I have personal experience with them. Btw, I do have contact with and consider advice from some of the racers you mentioned, but I do not limit myself or censor information from all other sources.

With that off my chest let's continue this build. Hoping I can take delivery early enough tm to allow me to at least set the hoop in the car to measure clearance with the ragtop. :)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

What trans are you going to use? I have a transbrake solenoid for a c4 that won't fit my case. I have a 72 push in case and this modulator is thread in. Fairly large threads, too. It's from a company in the South. Georgia, I think. BTE?

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

That's the kind of help I'm talking about Rory. I don't have much experience with Ford's and I also don't have a stockpile of spare parts lying around like I do for old Chevy's. It's a bit of a struggle not knowing what bolts up to what, parts interchange, ect.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

99% sure it will be a C-4 Dale, but I can't use a transbrake. Going to talk to Thomas Arnett soon to see if he has a C-4 lying around...or if he even wants to mess with one lol.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Does your home track run under what we call box/no box or footbrake rules?

I'm told a c4 is simple. Don't believe everything you hear...

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

This one is being built to NHRA Stock Eliminator rules Dale.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Understood. I took it to mean you were not allowed to run a TB.

Goodnight, Rich.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Roll bar showed today and it fits like a glove thank goodness. Got it tacked in with the exception of the rear support bars...contemplating a different approach to those rather than the recommendations. I'm going to turn the full welding over to a pro as I just don't feel confident in my welding abilities. Entry and exit is pretty good even with the large steering wheel.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps110c139d.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps4f577ede.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps37bb1873.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps29bcfb0a.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich, I'm not sure how to reply to this, as I'm not really sure you got my original point.
Let me ask you this; Do you think you could leave the under hood fender braces off of your 67 Camaro and nobody would notice ?
Conversely, how about the under chassis front braces on a convertible only Fox body?

I suppose I should have answered like this:
No you can't take the brace off. It's part of the car ...just like the Camaro fender braces.

Doing a nice job..Carry on!

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I will argue the point with logic Mark. To compare those flakey brackets under the Mustang to a Camaro fender brace is apples vs oranges. At least the Camaro brace serves some purpose...I can think of nothing those flimbsy pieces of metal under the Mustang could possibly contribute.

They are most certainly not a suspension part, so that is out of the way. Let's see...they are attached to the lower portion of the radiator support at the front and to the subframe/rocker panel at the rear. What does all this have in common? Why everything is joined at the crossmember...hmm. Ok, I shall deem it part of the crossmember...we can call it a crossmember brace if you like. The NHRA rule book says I can alter the crossmember for oil pan removal. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. ;) Oh yeah...I can easily replace those brackets with something of my own design that will actually serve a purpose if the need arises.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Hey Rich, if you look at how flimsy that core support is, that's probably why Ford put that brace there.