Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
If I did my math correctly, doesn't 4-head bolts x (2) Vortechs = BOOM!!
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Probably.... :(

We may find out........ LOL!

That's one way to get rid of this P.O.S. time-bomb short block...

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
If you want a wild holeshot ride, I can go back to my fathers old machine shop and go in the basement, and pull out the de-stroked 340,
305 engine with 12.5 - 1 Arias pistons, and Kenyon-prepped heads.
Now, that would be one wild launch in that A-Body. Unfortunately, the Vortechs will not be "Required Components", unless you like
molten pistons:D
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Alan,
if you check out the "Mods for Mopar 273" article, Feb 66' Hot Rod,
with Tom Hoover and Mike Buckle (of the Ramchargers), you can see the first free-breathing intake manifold. A standard 273 cast iron intake, with the carburetor butterfly openings cut-out to 1 11/16" (primary and secondary) for the first Holley carb to be mounted on the intake, during
the early stages of the D-Dart. The first carb used was a 4160 #3116
600 cfm, off the 65' Race Hemi's.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,

Billy Nees gets his satifaction from turning an 18-second street slug into a 14-second race car, utilizing only class-legal methods. I think I must get the same kind of satisfaction out of seeing how much horsepower I can wring out of this (almost) stock, OEM shortblock (cam change, only) with a superchagrer and a 750 Holley, without damaging the engine.

I think I'm already walking a VERY thin line, now, and any more positive additiions to the B.M.E.P will likely push her over the edge....

Guess I'll work on the chassis for a while and try to take some weight off the front of the car.

I need this thing to hook up... Workin' on that.

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Are you going 'Old-School' on the front-end lightening?
You know; 6-cylinder torsion bars, V-100 shocks, truck-mounted battery,
drum brakes, remove the sway (anti-roll) bar.
Or modified 'Old-School', plastic front bumper support brackets:rolleyes:
Now who would do that? Wouldn't that be cheating in Stock Eliminator:rolleyes:
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
I have first dibbs on the destrokes 340........................

The intake in that article was developed during the 65 race season. The carb adapters that are on the D/Dart engines were machined in house. You can see along the sides that they were cut out on a band saw.

Got a question on Kenyon. As advertised on the front fender of "The Politician" the heads on the car were from Kenyon. Who was Kenyon and where were they located? I was in grade school in the Cleveland area when the D/Darts were produce so I'm sort of lost here.

Alan

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

It doesn't matter because I'm not running this car in any class-legal configuration; Brackets, only.

Insofar as what I'v done, it's minimal. at best:

Things already done:

90-10 shocks in front / 50/50 shocks in back
it never had a sway (anti-roll) bar
The K-H, 4-piston caliper, disk-brakes are going to be retained
The 340 torsion bars will remain, for the moment (318 4-drs with A-C had 340 bars)
Spring clamps on the forward portion of the leaf springs
Air Bag on right rear spring for pre-load
Auburn limited-slip
4-degree pinion wedge for proper rear u-joint angle
removed the OEM, spring clamps for leaf separation on acceleration
2 BIG batteries in trunk, on right side, in the rear portion
A-C compressor, condenser, and lines removed; evaporator remains, for the moment
Adjustable pinion snubber

For next season:
fiberglass front bumper and hood (pin-on)
Replace heavy-*** carpet with light, no sound-deadener, carpet.
lightweight front bumper brackete
replace heavy-*** bench seat with one (1) D-100 (cargo van) bucket
install driveshaft loop
install 4.10 center section (3.55 has been in there, until now
install 9" X 28" M-T bias-ply slicks on new, 7"-wide, 28"-tall, Ansen Sprints
Hopefully, all that will improve the 60-footers .3..... (from 1.81, prior)

Talk's cheap; we'll see... :)

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

post deleted; duplication.... sorry.

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Alan,
Kenyon Cylinder Heads
Fred Kenyon was the hot cylinder head guy for awhile in the mid-late 60's, and early 70's.. Trick-blending on the valve seat area, and flow improvements for the ports. Then RHS 'Racing Head Service' came into play, and kind of stole his thunder.
Kenyon Machine, still in business in San Diego. Alot of West Coast
Stockers and S/S guys used them. His cylinder heads were the hot ticket for 67'/68'.
I noticed in Mopar 273 article that one of the intakes (dual-quad) cut out the center section of the primary and secondary openings, and left the thin center-divider between the sections, shaped like the letter 'B' faced back-to-back. That's the way we cut-out our manifold, at first.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
I see you didn't mention the radio and heater. Do you really need to be warm and listen to "Communication Breakdown" by Zeppelin, while pounding the quarter-mile?:D
As mentioned earlier, by another Mopar head. Old school "body panel
chemically engineered" (Acid-Dipping) by Chrysler Factory Men is also a nice way to lose weight. (Sponsored by; Valerie Bertinelli)
PC

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,

Hot Rod (I think) also did an article about using the carb base from a 3705sa carb from a '64 Max Wedge and putting it on the 273 4bbl manifold then put the rest of the stock carb on this base so that unless you looked real close you would swear it was stock.

JimR

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,

This "project" (if you could call it that!!!) started out to be a street/strip car, and, as such, I have avoided removing the heater/defroster; A-C is gone, however except for the evaporator, and it's pretty light.

If I get desperate enough for some daylight under the front wheels, however, the heater will be history...

Acid dipping is more work than I have the desire to perform, seeing as how there are so many less labor-intensive ways to lighten up the front end...

Thanks for the ideas, though; I am ALWAYS open to sugestions.... ALWAYS!!! :)

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Thermal socks weight less than the heater/defroster:D.
Jim R,
I think the Max-wedge carb could be utilized, as long as you used the
Super Stock Carb. Flange part #2468451.
But, if you used the #3705 carb, wouldn't that be chea-ing? :cool:
Paul (It's OK with me)

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
Unfortunately, at my advanced age, the feet aren't the only parts that get cold.... :(

Gonna try a lighter fiberglass hood, and maybe a bumper, next.... That stock hood is HEAVY!!!

Happy New Year from not-so-beautiful Conway.

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Those old stainless steel 'pocket warmers' works wonders for those hard to get areas;)
A liitle weight-saving trick,,,replace steel fastening bolts (ie; hood, trunk lid, fenders, bumper-brackets and other non-structural bolts/nuts with plastic units). Easy to do, and suprisingly saves alot more useless weight than you think.
Paul, ,,,Happy New Year

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Good ideas, all, Paul... hadn't thought of any of that!

I have precious little spare time, for a retired guy though, so I'm going to concentrate on the easy (quick) stuff for a while, and see if I can get a 1.55 60-footer this year. I have a group of friends who all run turbo V6 Buicks, and some of them run high tens, when they're running. IF they're running...

If I can get this thing into the 11.20s or .30s, they'll still be able to outrun me, but they'll have to crank up the boost into a "DANGER ZONE" (25+ pounds of boost) to beat me, and they may not want to waste an engine on shaming my old clunker.... They're a proud bunch, these Grand National guys.... LOL!

I'm limiting my boost to 10 pounds, which doesn't seem to hurt the motor.... so far. I have band aids aplenty, with an MSD Bootsmaster Timing retard, alcohol injection from a Snowperformance Boost Cooler, Av gas (100+ octane) and an Air Gap-style intake manifold to help provide a cooler charge. It's just a 1,000-foot strip, where I run, so that helps keep engine temperatures down, too.

I don't run it over 6 grand (though it easily goes 6,500) in the interest of longivity... its, AND mine! LOL!

Thanks for the good advice; I'll probably get one of those pocket warmers.... :)

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Sounds like you have the right combo there. You can probably run 11.20's all day long, and not hurt the engine internals.
Air-gap style intake and those Ansen Sprints bring back nice memories.
What do you leave the line at?
One more weight saving trick...When the roll-bar was required, we
fabricated a PVC unit (central vacuum tubing) with foam over it. Of course that's crazy, but it saved weight. If I crashed, I know God would have not let ne into the Heaven Staging Lanes:rolleyes:
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
That's the plan (everything but the faux roll bar... LOL!)

Send an email to Billdedman@hotmail.com if you want to see a picture of this relic... Ansen Sprints and all...... LOL!!!

Might even include a picture of my (defunct) 340-powered '64 Valiant 2-door sedan... :)

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Thanks, I'll forward an e-mail address.
Our 69' 440 Cuda is pictured on the "Original Hemi Dart Info" post.
Page 10, post #94. Photo from 1988/89.
The 64' Valiant, and a high-reving 9500rpm 305 = 30" wheelstands:eek:
paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
Thanks for the info; that's a very nice-looking 'Cuda! Was it ever a class car?

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Thank you. Since it is difficult to download photo's through my current network in North Carolina. I have mucho photo's of our a-Body cars.
If you like, send me your mailing address (through a private message), and I'll forward photo's...That 69' 440 cuda in the 'thread' was when my father had it, in 1988. I owned the car in 74', at the age of 17. I knew what I had (a rare car) and didn't want to hack up the inner-fenderwells to put on headers. So I built it for stock class. In 74', NHRA kept the stock classes relatively pure, no headers, as the stock system had to be retained, except for free-flowing mufflers, and 8" grooved slicks.
It ran in C/SA. 12.28 @ 114, and on the street. Raced only one Sunday, October 74'. Won the class trophy. Dover Drag Strip went to brackets-only the following week, and I never went back, along with a ton of other racers.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Thanks, Paul; sounds like a way fun car!!!

I am in the process of trying to simplify my life through the elimination of as much physical minutae (spelling?), and I have WAY too many race car photos, already, so I'll just say thanks for the nice offer, but no thanks for the pix (which I am sure I would LOVE, but I have to stop, somewhere...)

I appreciate your generous offer!!!

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Bill,
Yes, I know. This thread got a little convoluted. Off the subject of the
D-Dart. Someone should start another A-Body post.
Here's one thing. Those 65' and 66' 273 racers were having cooling problems, with that 4-blade fan. Chrysler recommended the fluid fan drive (viscous) and aluminum blade fan unit. A factory bulletin was sent out in mid-66', recommending the 2291-D assembly, for D-Dart owners.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
Maybe Travis could change the name of this thread to '66 D-Darts and other early A-Bodies --- or something like that.

Do you have a copy of the cooling bulletin for the D/Darts? I'd like to get a copy of it if you have it. I've got the ones from the release of the car and the parts available from service to build one.

I'm still trying to get confirmation on the Hurst shifter being shipped in the trunk. You might be right on that one. I'll never doubt you again.

Alan

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

I don't know if this was already posted, but I found this on a website from another thread:

http://thumb3.webshots.net/t/73/173/...3PbQLsK_th.jpg

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Jason,
I currently own Ted's old D/Dart. Bought it off of Al Adam 7 years ago.
Alan

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Alan,
Thanks. I'll have to search for that bulletin.. Your Dart "The Politician", did that have 6-leaf springs in it (Heavy-duty towing package) or modified 65' Super Stock springs.
As for cooling improvement bulletins. Besides the fluid fan drive unit, I think (memory jog) there was a recommendation for a station wagon
H.D. radiator, a fan mount-spacer kit (moves the fan 1" closer to the radiator), and deep grooved pulleys.
Hurst Model #'s started out as DP-FX-65 which were used on the 67'
RO/WO factory Hemi Super Stock cars. But these units were not shipped with the D-Darts. Still searching for the correct DP# unit.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Ken,
The D-Dart would have been classed in F/S at the 68' Winternationals
(10.50 - 10.99 wt/hp). Yes the 340 was factory rated at 275, but NHRA re-factored it to 300. The 68' 340 Cuda's were classed in E/S.
Jim McFarland won E/SA with a 68' Cuda prepped by Sox & Martin, and was Runner-Up in Stock Eliminator. F/Stock cars out there were running 12.70's to 12.90's. Not sure if anyone ran a 66' 273/275HP D-Dart out there, or at the 68' Springnationals in June. Too little cubes to match up with the 67' 390 Comet Cyclones/Fairlane GT's.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Ken,
The Super Stock classes went from SS/B thru SS/F in 68'. The D-Dart was classed in F/S with the 65'/66' 289/271HP K-Code Mustangs.
Local tracks it would have been somewheat successful with the right
tweaks, but at Points Meets or Regional Events, unfortunately not a
champion. In 69'/70', the D-Dart would have been classed up to G/S, though some tracks did put them in H/S (11.00-11.49 wt/hp break). Not sure on how that happened, unless NHRA did a mid-season re-factoring,
which was not uncommon, as to allow some cars a fair break against the newer factory purposely underrated HP cars.
As for Super Stock, don't think anyone with a D-Dart in 69' or 70' would be crazy enough to run in SS/J, against 69' 428 CJ Ford Fairlane Fastbacks. You would have to run 12.00's back then.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Paul,
In the SS&DI article on my car, it said that Ted was running 7 leaves on the right side. The rear spring number on the D/Dart broadcast sheet is 804. I think the entire P/N is 2403804. When I had both D/Darts, I had Eaton make a set of new springs for the Mecum Auction car. Kept the originals just in case I want to restore "The Politician" to as delivered condition. It currently has a set of the original SS springs on it -- P/N 3412002-3. No "P" in front of the number. They also have an "X" number on them. I believe they were on the car when Jon Rasbach and Tom Flynn bought it from Ted.
Alan

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Alan,
Ted's car did sit nicely. Especially in some of the photos with the tall front tires, to improve off-line roll-out.
Have been to some Mopar events, and see some guys claim they have a D-Dart, or a 273 Commando G. Look underneath, and see a 4 1/2 band leaf-spring unit.
Paul

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

I think the D-Dart thread can be extinguished now.
Last bit of info for you D-Dart historians.
The 273/275HP car came through with a factory modified dual-point
distributor. No vacuum advance and centrigugal advance re-calibrated.
PC

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Amen!!!!

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

ddartdude,
I cannot find info on factory testing for the 66' D-Dart.
Only estimated calculations.
And the famous Car Craft test.
PC

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Thanks Paul,

Since it was a Chrysler drag racing program, and Ted Spehar had a car campaigning in the class, you'd figure more stuff would be out there on the car. Ted's car was featured in the May 1967 issue of SS&DI. It does have some performance numbers in the article. I have copies of about a dozen time slips to validate the times. I was able to get them from Ralph Costa, the driver of the car. He actually gave me about 6 of the actual slips with Teds notes on them.

According to Ted, he doesn't have anything, documentation, on the car.

Alan

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Alan,
I do believe the times Ted posted with the D-Dart.
It was a properly prepped and set-up car, unlike many of the other
D-Dart cars, which were more-or-less, Buy-n-Run-n-Gun cars.

Low 13.00's seems reachable, when you consider several F/Stock
273/235HP 65' Cuda's were running 13.60's in late 1965, and in
G/Stock in 1966. (The Golden Commando's F/S 'Goldfish' , 1965
Nationals F/S class winner 13.44 @ 103.68, and Doug Pattersons
'Brand X' F/SA Stock Eliminator Runner-Up at the 65' Springnationals.)
With the bigger lift camshaft, heavier valve springs, and Holley #4160 700 cfm
carburetor, the Dart surely would be at least a .50 quicker.
Hard to figure out the lack of performance documentation on the
D-Dart.
Info on the 273/235HP Commando engine is all over the place.
ranging from 15.80's to 17.60's.
PC

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

That D-Dart that got classed into L/SA in 1970 (12.50-12.99 wt/hp).
1) Simple, obviously he pulled the 4-speed and put in an automatic.
2) He pulled off the Holley 700 cfm carburetor, and put on a 273/235HP
Carter 500 cfm AFB.
* He must have claimed a 273/235HP engine.
* No way you could tell the difference, unless you measured the camshaft
lift, or checked valve spring pressure.
PC

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Not a 1966 D-Dart,,,,,,,,,,,but a 1965 in D/MP,,

http://66.154.44.164/forum/attachmen...7&d=1238799756

Re: '66 Dodge D-Dart at Mecum auction
 

Look at these parts,,,,,,,,,did we forget something,,,???

http://66.154.44.164/forum/attachmen...9&d=1238799756