Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Just about to pull the trigger on a 1990 Mustang GT convertible, 302 auto. Any glaring reasons not to pursue this? Natural class will be O/SA with a factor of 220hp. I'll be pulling the trailer behind me in the morning to go look at the car...if it's in decent shape it may be following me home. I'm open to all critics or supporters on this one.

Lord, look at my post count...this is not the sign I was looking for lol. :eek:

Just found an even nicer '89 model for less money...less weight and lower hp factor too! :D

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psa7edebb8.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Definite supporter here. Nice looking car. Did it follow you home ?

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

HandMan,

building a convertible body is the next best thing to a removable bed:)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Hmmm...something looks fishy...a chevy guy saying he's going to build/race a ford and his post count is the sign of the devil....coincidence????

LOL!!!

That's just proves you're coming from the dark side to the "right side" LOL!

So..did it follow you home?

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

That is crazy isnt it lol! I'm just trying to make certain this is a viable combination before I take the plunge...on paper it looks like I could get one of these cars to run well under the index (13.15) for far less money invested in our '67 E/SA Camaro.

The '90 model is located nearby...the '89 model pictured above is somewhat further, but it is completely unmolested and original and cheaper to boot ($2500 obo). The '89 has a slipping trans, but that is of no concern to me...I have yet been able to contact this party tho.

The only pic I have of the '90 is this interior shot...this car has a blown airbag, but no wreck involved supposedly. Again, this would not concern me as it would be deleted anyway. Of more concern is the shape of the body as that is where the real work would be for me with either car.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps1cb4e37f.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Jump in, the water is fine...................far less $ than a Camaro and race for the same purse, do the math. You could invest the left over $ in shoe polish, you will need it!!

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Still unable to contact the party with the '89. Headed north right now to view the '90.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

85 was the last year for a carb in these cars, Are you thinking Stock or GT? The 85 302/210 can run a 4bbl. The Blueprint sheet says "F/H" which I think is Ford/Holley.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Stay with the Camaro ... you are so close to racing. The Muscrat would be starting from $cratch !

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

He's a build addict looking for a new project now that the Camaro is about done (again). As for cost, go back through this thread. The Chevy has broken some big bucks parts that aren't supposed to break like Moser rear ends.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

The Ford won't break any parts ?

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Only breakage on mine was a ring & pinion.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Well, here we go...

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psfe239a7c.jpg

I bought the '90 model this morning from a nice young gal named Shelley...I'm sure she had her fun with it over the years. It was about what I expected to find...pretty much intact with no real rust issues. I still have not dismissed the '89 model and might travel to look at it if I ever get in contact with the seller.

Up on the lift I see no glaring defects other than it had taken a hit to the lower portion of the radiator support at some time in it's life...probably from a tall curb from the looks of it.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps46afb595.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps13969cc5.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psfda558cc.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps591df5b3.jpg

Interior is decent...

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps0b879d0b.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps55d6c0d7.jpg

Top and body are good, but it will need paint.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps9be9e57c.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps5e1754b8.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps7c3d44b5.jpg

That spoiler must go lol!

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Very subtle looking car. Quite a jump from your Camaro. Welcome to the Dark Side...

What drag racing needs is cars in the lanes. And the more badges and body styles the better.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Whichever car I end up with I will begin with the roll bar/subframe connectors and work my way down to suspension/driveline upgrades. I will try to garner the best info I can get on the best bang for the buck upgrades given the power levels expected. Being O/SA and the index at 13.15 with an automatic it should not be too harsh on parts...I hope. :p It will be interesting tuning with a laptop.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

This will be a fun build to watch. Subscribing to this thread.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Way WOW !!! A virgin Mustang, still has the OE air box and the distributor cap rubber boot. Nice score !! Welcome to O/SA.................

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I'll be needing you guys to guide me along on this one. ;)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Here's some sub frame connectors to look at, My 68 has Total Control/ChassisWorks connectors but they don't make them for the newer cars.

http://www.maximummotorsports.com/MM-Full-Length-Subframe-Connectors-1979-04-bare-P580.aspx

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Thanks Dale - Not sure how the weight falls on these cars when gutted...class minimum will be 3300 pounds. Don't know the pros or cons of a moly vs mild steel roll bar in this instance...not wanting to spend money on parts that don't make a difference if you know what I mean. This entire endeavor will be based on the best bang for the buck if feasible. I would also like to find out if it is possible to claim this car as a '89 and what would be needed to do so...would drop weight to 3225 and hp factor to 215.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

The Stock Car Classification Guide puts the 90 convertible LX at 3168 and the GT at 3197 shipping weight. 302/225, right?

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I've been using the stats here on the forum... http://www.classracerinfo.com/Default.aspx

Let me go check the NHRA site for changes...

Edit - It appears there was a hp hit across the board for the 302 (225hp). Whats confusing now is the weight is greater for the '89 than for the '90...was reversed. :confused:
'89 - 3394 pounds
'90 - 3312 pounds

I guess it was because the '89 gained 10hp from 215 whereas the '90 only gained 5hp from 220.

Lol...this is all wrong dammit...there were no changes for Stock.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Looks like a fun project, good luck. You might want to contact a friend of mine who is on this forum. He has a 89 mustang convertible that he runs in P/SA. He also has a 92 lx coupe that he runs in SS/MA. The stocker is usually around the .500 under mark and he does it on a budget. His user name is fordteacherguy and his real name is Brian Thompson. PM him and he will help anyway he can. Brian is very knowledgeable and a very nice guy to talk with. Can probably give you some advise to help save money. Good luck.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Thank you sir...I already have a pm waiting in his inbox as we speak. :)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

If you are going to put subframe connectors in that are worth putting in, they need to be through the floor. Not under the car, especially a convertible. These cars flex a lot with a full roof. You may want to search the forum, as there has been a lot of advice on rear suspension and how to fix and support it too.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I figure a roll bar will help with chassis twist/flex as well, but I'm open to all suggestions. Keep in mind the intended class and likely power level. I have searched the forum but came up with little detailed info on these cars. I have found some useful info on Corral.net tho. Does anyone know what the exterior differences are between a '89 and a '90 GT convertible?

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

When I started working on my 68 coupe, I could jack the right front torque box and just lift the right front wheel. Now with a full cage, weld in sub frame connectors and a bolt in x brace, the same jack point lifts the whole right side of the car. Stiff as a board. The connectors aren't through the floor, either.

Do a google search on "Mustang roll cage" and click the Images tab. you will find a lot of builds that include connectors both under and through the floor.

Some Mustang Forums:

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/

http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

99.9% sure that they were the same. Except for the switch to the bigger brakes/ 16" Pony wheels in 1991 I believe the styling remained the same.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

You can compare Mustangs by model year at the site below. Click the "Timeline" link to select the year.

http://www.mustangspecs.com

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Limited photo's there Dale, but I have been on YouTube and I see no external body differences...'89 it shall be. ;)

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Based on the timeline and text, the body style remained unchanged for base models from 87 through 92 or 93. Just pick the motor, I guess. 89 sounds good.

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

I have owned a handful of fox mustangs,the only thing I remember is the body side molding is black on an 89 and body colored on my 1990 lx convertable.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

This video is where I determined that there are no differences between the '89 and '90 model GT's... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pB6Q-e-j6x0

The '90...I can't tell any difference at all. Remove that hideous rear spoiler and it looks identical to the '89.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps7c3d44b5.jpg

I have to wait on the repair of the lift in the back shop before doing any major disassembly of the car. I have not received any detailed feedback as of yet on specific parts, but from what I have seen thus far I'm leaning toward the MM full length subframe connectors and 6-point rollbar. I'll fabricate my own driveshaft loop and weld to the subframe connectors instead of the usual bolt-thru the pan variety. I'll need to talk to someone in the know about specifics like upper/lower control arms, springs and reinforcement of control arm mounting points.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

There are Info Guides on this link that might help with your suspension questions.

http://www.americanmuscle.com/7993-suspension.html

Dale

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Been really busy lately but here is the biggest bang for your bucks. Start with these 3 camshaft, rear gears and low gear set in a C4 is a must with that heavy of car these will be your biggest gains on et. Yes the roll bar, front springs and rear suspension are a must also. Could type more but it is lunch time.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Appreciate any input James - I'll contact Bullet Cams when the time comes. I'm sure Thomas Arnett can help on the C4...I know squat about Ford transmissions. Right now I'm trying to garner info on control arms and springs...also wondering about 26" vs 28" rear tires.

Still awaiting repairs on the lift I just eyeballed the car a bit more this afternoon. I focused on the steering wheel with the blown airbag and began to mess with it a bit. The previous owner had taped the face up with some duct tape...effective, but it left a mess of glue residue when I peeled it off. A little WD-40 and a rag and it began to clean up and come back to presentable. I believe I can salvage the wheel after all...might even use the built in horn button for a linelock switch before it's over.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps0b879d0b.jpg

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps0b6ec07c.jpg

I need to formulate a plan for the console as far as switches and aftermarket shifter go.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...psc2e4146a.jpg

Even with the back seat deleted the roll bar appears it will be a tight fit. Still leaning towards the Maximum Motorsports 6/8 point kit for convertibles until I hear better otherwise.

http://i434.photobucket.com/albums/q...ps2ec3c717.jpg

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Question for those in the know - Am I going to have any problem getting this car down to 3225 pounds with a mild steel 6-point roll bar installed? It will have the usual Stocker parts removal process.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

The difference between a mild steel and chrome moly rollbar is exactly like the difference between a good foundation and not so good foundation under your house. Works good for now, but REAL hard to change later. Mild steel is for trailers.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Rich,

It depends? First you need to weigh the car as it sets, also need a good idea of how much fuel is in the car, this gives you a baseline. Being a convertible and needing a roll bar and sub frame connectors, I'd want to know their weight. That is compensation weight, you will take weight out but putting those in adds weight back, I'm sure you know this. I prefer a track scale or one of the digital setups the circle track guys use.

I like to use a common bathroom scale, weigh everything and record the weights as I take it out. That includes wheels and tires and record the difference. Modern aluminum wheels weigh a bunch. Using stocker thought, there are a lot of unnecessary items in a car. Don't forget the underneath of a car, undercoating sucks but it's weight. Changing from power to manual steering, manual brakes, can get rid of that booster. Then you can work the interior, since it's getting a roll bar, it all has to come out anyway.

Good luck, hopefully I can get my "U" car together and meet you at a track someday.

Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up
 

Probably a poor choice in wording on my part...what I meant was 0.134 wall DOM tubing. Reasoning is I will be doing this on my own and don't have the expertise or equipment to TIG weld Chro-Moly. Btw, finally got a ring package for those CP pistons and I'm just about ready to re-assemble the engine for the other car...thanks again!

No, I have not weighed the Mustang as it sits yet. When we were working on the Camaro I had access to wheel scales and it proved to be accurate...may try to borrow those one more time for this car. I was just fishing for answers from others who have/had similar cars concerning weight.