X /Stock ?
 

26 lbs. per.
RWD V8, 6, or 4
Stick or auto..100# extra for stick
Around 17.00 index.
Who would support it?
Who would build one?
Who just fell asleep reading this?

Re: X /Stock ?
 

I'm not gonna build one-or anything else for that matter but I remember having my butt kicked several times by the X/S "Horse sense" Pinto in the mid 70s in my B/S 396 L78 Chevelle. Man I hated that car! we used to call it the "horse-***** pinto" Of course this was when I raced a car that I loved, instead of studying the guide and building a car that could win-IIRC the hp factor for my iron head L78 was 415 hp at the time with stock axles and a Muncie 4 speed. I learned how to repair that 12 bolt and that trans in the dirt at midnight pretty quickly.....
it's an interesting concept though I would watch em and root for them!

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Why not? Yes! Rowing gears is more fun.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Yes I got my head handed to me by a Pinto at an AHRA race back then. Probably the same guy.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Derrick Elam runs a Pinto wagon around here in D6. I looked it up and he bought it from Marty Buth. So, there are two who don't laugh at the idea. It's a W/SA. Very clean. One of the first OHC engines in a production car (I think).

Re: X /Stock ?
 

I think that was Tom Rieder (Horse Sense) from Michigan I think he worked at ford or was a sub contractor for them those cars were way fast back then.




Jerry
Retired 3490 3492 STK SS SST

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Under this proposal, a car that was a natural W car , could drop down to X.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

X/S was a 23 lb class until NHRA eliminated X,Y,Z in 1983 to make room for the FWD cars. In 1978 Stan Welch (Hobby Horse ?) set the X/S record at 15.25 and I think won the Gators one year. Or, it may have been Dan Rockwell.

Tom Reider was a Design Engineer at Ford. He and Mel Wallace, a Mechanical Engineer at Ford, formed the Reider and Wallace race team .

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Huh?

(j/k Jerry, we know what you meant. Just got a chuckle out of what you said.)

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Come on Mark, you still have one more in you to build.I'm sure that your local junkyards have one in their inventory and in good shape.Claude R.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Haha.. We'll see , but it would be for our local S/SS group. No 6-7 g.p. tour....for sure.

I was going to put this in the main section, but I didn't want Perrone and his wife to see it and get all torqued off.

I can think of at least two good W/Stockers that are just too darn heavy @ 24 lbs.
One is EFI too.
Write me, only if you would actually do it, within a reasonable amount of time.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Does anybody know what happened to or where the Rieder n Wallace cars went ?



Jerry
Retired 3490 3492 STK SS SST

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Yeah, come on Mark. We could always use another car in the group. I'm sure you know of a car or two that could be an affordable rocket.



Matt

Re: X /Stock ?
 

So Mark, where did this come from?

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Mark---give us some some examples of combos that could fit this class please--FED 387

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You mean like a big 77 FFFFord wagon with a 302 2v? ..No , that's not it LOL

I'll call you ...

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Dick , see above.
On the other end of the spectrum, Ron Seibenick has a Fox hatchback that runs under in W/Stock. I haven't talked to him about it, but it has to be way heavy for the class.

How about a 1980 Cutlass Cruiser wagon with a 260 V8 @ 135 hp ?

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Actually guys,
The FWD thread got me thinking that some guys might not mind leaving first and being chased with a budget car, but want no part of a FWD car..Can't say that I blame them ;-)

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Sounds like this deal has "Dime Rocket" written all over it!

Oh, oh, wait a minute, umm............. this sounds like a real high dollar deal that would cost the Racers a fortune to get into. It would probably lead to lots of high end sponsorship involvement and make the NHRA BOD a fortune!!! As a little guy, I don't like it. ................

Re: X /Stock ?
 

How about a 3rd Generation Camaro or Firebird? I know the 1985's came with a Iron Duke 151 TBI Almost started the project years back, parts were collected, still have, like a Mini-Spool for a 7.5 rear with 4:56 gears..all types of blocks..even a couple with Chevy bellhousing bolt patterns. Would have fell into W , maybe a little heavy too..took to track once just as it was..ran 19.60's..slipped on a smaller rear tire, ran a 19.30..

Will Lamprecht
65 Impala I/SA turning into a I/Stick
1997 Mustang V6 T/SA project with brother.

Re: X /Stock ?
 

A bit high rated for W/Stock, but I'm sure it would run under the index. Qualifying at Indy would be a different story. You have your choice of a Vari-jet or TBI.

S10 134 might be good.
Who was the guy from Memphis , associated with RHS or Comp Cams that had one about a decade ago? He managed to get 5 hp put on the automatic (but not the stick ;-) )

Re: X /Stock ?
 

Mark, you're just itching to do a 4 cyl. Chevy II aren't you?

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Cannot tell a lie...
As soon as someone donates a 62-3 100 2 dr. or sells me one at scrap value.
I might even paint the engine Chevy orange :-)

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Is the S-10 134 a feasible project, just curious.

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Someone went fast enough with one to get some HP so I would guess that it's feasible.

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Bear in mind that the modern EFI , roller cam engines seem a little high on their hp ratings, compared to early model, 4 and 6 cylinders combos. Don't let that discourage you. They are designed for maximum torque, using a limited amount of displacement for, mpg and emissions reasons.

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Any drawbacks to running a stick?

Re: X /Stock ?
 

There wouldn't be any for me.
Use a 2wd V6 8.5 rear. I'd go with a spool and axles, but I've been known to break stuff that's not known to break with a 4 cylinder.
You could use a slick shifted T5 with 5th removed. Aftermarket shifter, and a good brand diaphragm clutch.
Of course, some would be tempted to want to use a Jerico and a high zoot multiple disc small clutch, and a steel bell, but that would kinda defeat the dime rocket course of action, the way I see it.

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Mark, I appreciate the info. Do you know any engine shops familiar with the 4 cyl.? The tech. specs. show it with a throttle body, what needs to be done with the electronics? Thanks again.

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If I was going to do one of these, and I didn't want to start with a complete truck, I'd look for a complete engine at the monthly U pull it engine sale. I'd take it apart and see what I had. There's no piston approved so I'd look for some OEM .020 over ones on Ebay. There's no rod and piston weight spec, so that's a big plus, if you get my drift.
I'm pretty sure it's a thinner mm ring set. I'd call Kevin at Total Seal and see if we could match something up for a low drag set.
Nobody is going to have a torque plate, so I'd fill the block way up there, and bolt the head back on and let it sit there. Then I'd have someone who knows how to hone a block, give me about .003 piston to wall.. Balance it, deck it, and your short block is done.
Have somebody that does currently legal NHRA heads, give it a work over..Nothing too fancy. I'd call Chris Padgitt @ Bullit for a cam.
Notice I'm telling you how I would do it, personally. To me ,that's part of the fun of building these lower class dime rockets.
As far as recommending someone to take on the whole engine build, I have no idea.
Maybe someone here will speak up..
I think you have to send the whole computer out to someone like Ed Wright, who will remove all the limiters and give it some more fuel and timing. You're going to have to keep the duration down and the vacuum up, if you want to keep within the constraints of an OEM computer.
From here, you know where I am,

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I just noticed this.
The throttle body spec is for the air inlet. However, it is not a wet throttle body.
It is PFI (port fuel injection)..Remember what I said about the modern, torque inducing design.

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There was one of these built and raced in the Memphis are way back in the 1990s. It was very fast then.

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See thread in S/SS section that used to be at the top of the pile on this site ;-)

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Oh yes... One more "tech" item.

Local, name brand pump gas allowed.

(This is supposed to be an entry level class..whatever that means)

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Best rule item yet...

You must show up with used 9" radials, bought from the guys with the 8-9 second factory "Stockers" LOL ;-) ;-)

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Late to the party, I was just looking for something that speaks to the rear axle in a modern 454 Corvette stocker after watching Rylie Trumble at No Problem Raceway today.

Long story short, I built a pro shifted 3 speed transmission for Doolittles X/SA Comet. Wanted to beat Rieder and Wallace for class at 1976 US Nationals, was tired of getting beat by him that year. That was the last year you could run flat out to win. Unfortunately I was not able to talk him out of the car. He did not want to run one of mine as they were all sticks. I should have had a plan to put an automatic in one of them. Anyway, they let me do it the week after Indy with Judy's similar car. Two weeks later there was a stock superstock combo race at Central Michigan dragway. We out qualified W&R by 0.15 seconds. I believe that after indy we were always racing on the brakes, I believe the rule changed the next week. Anyway, we put the trans and clutch set up in Harry's Comet and I drove thru the Summer Nationals that year. We were low #1 qualifier at the Winternationals and all that got us was the opportunity to pull a rod and a piston. Fortunately it was easy to do with a 200 6. I think the best I did with it was get to the semi finals at the summer nationals where I broke out.. and said no more. We used to put restrictor gaskets under the carb to slow it down and at E town we had put the smallest one we had in it before the semi final.

I assume that if one wanted to have a better chance of winning with a slow car, it would be to have one with feedback efi.. to improve the consistancy. We set the record a few times with the stick. I want to say we were around 15.20 or .30 at the 77 winters. I will say it was a fun car to drive. And we never broke anything. The ford 3 speed has the same cluster main drive vertical spacing so you can use 4 speed ford top loader gears, just have to narrow them a bit to get in the 3 speed case.

I don't think I would build a car below f/sa if one wanted to win National events on a fairly regular basis. And with the advent of the Factory stock cars that can go well into the 8 second bracket, that is probably a pipe dream the way they treat tracks today for traction.

My two cents on the subject. Harry's old Comet is still be run today believe it is running in W/S with the advent of front wheel drive cars. And it is still very competitive for class.

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Ummm.......... I can agree with that.

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billy,SS/X.!

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but Billy, YOU are the "slow" class WIZARD

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I believe Billty Nees said the mains cannot hold up on the iron duke 4