combo killers
 

Anyone else out there that's had to spend a season watching someone destroy your combo for no reason? Red lights, byes,doesn't matter just runs it out every pass.

Re: combo killers
 

I’m guessing the dude from New York with the 396-325
I won’t mention any names. He’s gonna kill the combo

Re: combo killers
 

How far under today. I know he doesn't care about how hard other people have to work

Re: combo killers
 

Mark I get where you guys are coming from. The real sad part for me as one of those guys that works hard on the combo is that Stock and Super Stock used to be a performance class. If you worked hard on your combo, had an idea how to make one run and spent some money we were all proud to show we had a fast car. Now it's how much oil do you have in your car? How far back is your timing? And how far overweight are you? To me other have ruined a big part of Stock Class that I enjoyed. I just pulled in line at Gainesville. Sitting here with my friend saying should we even bother trying to win Class. At the cost of HP to the Combo is it worth it. Now that's SAD!!!! BP

Re: combo killers
 

Already had one combo ruined. You can only get so much out of a stock combo. All us of just don't write checks

Re: combo killers
 

It's way to early to worry about getting horsepower for next year unless someone runs 1.301 under. Last year I kept track of all my Divisional and National runs per event. I knew when we could let it hang out for #1 or to win Class. THEN I'D FIX IT!!! Heard several times that a cpl of my friends got their undies all knotted up because of thinking the same thing,,,WE ARE GOING TO GET HORSEPOWER!!!
Time and rules have changed,,PERIOD! Sad part now is,,some don't save what they have because of that famous saying,,"Yea,,I've Got A Fast Car"! Did the World Champion have the fastest car in his class??? People win events and rounds cause they use their heads and don't worry about being the fastest.
Barry Parker go for a class win at the Baby Gators!!! I don't think you'll have to run so far under that you'll ruin your combo with your first event. Quit dicking around with your Camaro to go faster,,JUST RUN THE DARN THING!!
See you tomorrow!!!

Re: combo killers
 

combo killer ? , guys lets stop the drama , So if it got 5 hp, it would end the usefulness of all these cars with this engine ? lets be real, it would be 50 lbs. or take wt out and run a faster class. Ralph is a good man and he is RACING as in going fast. To top it all off, he has been going thru some real health issues and is currently on the good side of that.

Go get them Ralph, glad you are currently qualified first

Barry , step on it for class will ya

Tim, good reply, you got it right

Re: combo killers
 

Tell me if I’m thinking about this the wrong way. Combo Killers! If one person can do it hasn’t he proved it can be done and everyone should be capable of running that quick? If you are not maybe you are not working as hard as you think you are!

Re: combo killers
 

The past and current Stock champs both have Bad Fast cars.

Re: combo killers
 

It’s part of the game. A 1.02 under run at one of the fastest races of the year, early in the year is hardly crippling. There are quite a few cars in the 396/325 combo. Plenty of smart racers who go plenty of rounds with that combo as well. I’m sure it will work out. I wouldn’t start building 327’s and 350’s just yet. Have fun and race your combo

Re: combo killers
 

Terry not to make you feel worse I doubt that is all out every pass
He has alot left he hasnt shown.....

Re: combo killers
 

Right, and some just plain want to go fast, which is their business and nobody else's

Re: combo killers
 

He went 114.8 under at Belle Rose. If he truly wants to win class at Gainesville ….watch out. ..:):)

Re: combo killers
 

Maybe someone should pay the cash and see if he is not following the rules. I might even pitch in.

Re: combo killers
 

That pretty much sums it up.

Tom Flowers
3860 E/SA

Re: combo killers
 

That’s funny. . Ralph would like that
Tilburg Power. That’s the problem buddy

Re: combo killers
 

James not only is it a Tilburg motor, but Jerry is with him. With Jerry there you guys might as well just go over and hand Ralph the Check. Ralph will be sitting inside watching the Stock Market. Jerry would work a 12-hour day and ask why we are done so soon. He is an animal when it comes to working on these things. Remember the air is great and he has been keeping it under 1.20. If you piss him off, he may want to see how fast it can go. My bet if they really get after it with some help, you might see a 1.30 under run in good air. Ralph is coming to Gainesville wanting to win class. I would assume he will leave it in the same mode. I have been good friends with him for a long time. I will talk to him at Gainsville, so he understands better about the AHFS. If you get to know Ralph he is a great guy and would give you the shirt off his back. They don't come much better. BP

P,S. He is racing his car the way all of us should be. To bad we lost the performance part of Stock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: combo killers
 

I wonder what the average et was on the 325HP Camaros when the current index system was iniated?

The elephant is still in the room.

Re: combo killers
 

If you need to protect your combo, it definitely needs horsepower.

I'm not being critical of your dedication and resources, in fact I have sincere admiration for that.

However I have and still believe the indexes are too soft.

Re: combo killers
 

Barry, as far as I know there was always a penalty for going fast in Stock. In the Jr Stocker days you ran off of a record .And if you went faster than the record it got lowered to what you ran. When I started in Stock in the late 70s you got horse power for just winning class or setting a record or even winning a race. And there was a NHRA committee that would adjust the HP at the end of the year. If they didnt like you, you could got hit. At least now it is all in black and white. Last year people were pretty good at protecting their combos. They were smart about it.

Re: combo killers
 

Combo Killer!!! Kinda sucks I helped the combo from horsepower at the end of last year adjusting the overall average to have 1 guy say F it the past two weekends in qualifying with nothing on the line. Not a class trophy Not a heads up elimination round. First two races of the year and the guy just doesn’t give a F.
This combo has never been hit with horsepower and it would be nice if all of us could keep it that way! I personally made sure to run between.85-.65 last weekend in Arizona not for some knuckle head to go out and F it up. We all spend tons of money and work hard on our S**T most of us for many many years not for someone to give little or zero F’s.

Absolutely Ridiculous just my two sense!!!

Re: combo killers
 

How can all these old carburetor combos' go this fast. Looks like the EFI cars need HP back, lol.

Re: combo killers
 

Pretty sure we have a soft index problem in stock and SS . To many rule changes with no index adjustments.

Re: combo killers
 

It's too soft for some combos but not all. Too many rule changes that benefit some but not all.

Re: combo killers
 

Not really sure how many rule "changes" have occurred since the indexes were last adjusted, but I think the leniency and absence of tech has caused the "index problem." Namely the "stock" heads and intakes that are deemed legal today versus what was deemed legal 15-20 years ago.

Re: combo killers
 

Young man that’s not it
Go to a reputable engine shop and get the best stuff
Hard work and $
American It’s your $ choose where and how to spend it
And you have a fast car.
Also crying about the problem ain’t solving it
What done is done so you gotta adjust to fix it or buy more lead
Sort of like comp 😂

Re: combo killers
 

The original post was about 1 man destroying a combo for 25-75 other racers for No reasonable reason! The guy who started this post has every right to be upset. Let me go spend thousands of dollars this week to pick up a tenth and watch this guy go F it up over one weekend. Can’t fix S****d This post is Not about index’s not being adjusted , Not carbs vs efi, Not a combo that’s too soft etc etc. someone stated If I need to protect my combo then it needs horsepower. Thats completely untrue! more than 3/4 of the field is doing the same thing and has done it for years! Weight, Oil, bias ply tires, timing etc. to protect their own combo. The guy hasn’t even done it when it matters the most. A Heads Up late in a race for a trip to the final or a bye to the final etc. Not even a class final!! 🤦🏼*♂️

Re: combo killers
 

Back when I was building my Camaro, Warren whipped the 4th gen LT1 into 358 hp before I had my car ready for the track. Was I upset, yes! Did I come to a public forum and raise hell about it, no. That hit was wide spread and pretty much put the 93-98 LT1's on the back burner unless you can write some big checks! Some of you guys need to pull up your pants and tighten your belts! This is the sport we voluntarily chose to participate in. If you don't like it, go play croquet or shuffle board.

Re: combo killers
 

Thank the Lord you talked to him Barry OR it could have gotten real UGLY !!!!!:):)

Re: combo killers
 

Well said and dead on with a zero.

If we decide to race stock, I promise I will kill the combo we run.:D

Re: combo killers
 

This class and type of racing has sure changed alot in the 40+ years I have tried to be competitive.
It make no sence to me as a guy that spent 2-3 years trying to make the index in the beginning that now 95% of the racers(that probably been doing this as long or longer) are talking about saving thier combo's rather than talking about a better way to show what they got!


The whole appeal in all this ais just going the wrong way

Re: combo killers
 

At least for slow guys like me most of the rounds of racing we have are not heads up anyway. And money can’t buy good driving.

Re: combo killers
 

Hoo Boy!

Re: combo killers
 

There are no awards given to the " most stock" engine in class racing. The rules are what they are and you work within what passes tech. They are never going back to the valve spring rule, or any other rules that people feel have gone too far. If you don't take advantage of where we have gone and what's allowed, its a personal decision. Bitching about it on here will not change it. Either work harder on your stuff, or work harder to make more money to pay someone to make your stuff faster. Money has brought this about, and it's like that in every sport. It's been going on in Nascar since the fist car went around the track, and it has been going on in NHRA just as long. "Being competetive" was a term labeled in Nascar for people like Junior Johnson, Smokey Yunick, and many others. It applies to every sport, not just racing.
The AHFS even though some don't like it, gives you a clear cut path to get hp. I wasn't around, but hear stories of cars randomly getting hp by tech inspectors with no real explanation. Alot of people have said there sometimes was no rhyme or reason to it. Nowadays, there are combos that are at an advantage that there are enough cars to keep the average down to counter some fast cars who don't care to play the game. Others are less fortunate, but that's the way it is.

I understand its frustrating to get hp after you have worked hard with what money you have to only be set back again, or to be at a disadvantage when you show up at a race with the slowest car in your class hoping for a miracle on a heads up run, but for alot of class racers, it's what we enjoy wether we have the fastest car or not. I don't have the fastest combo in my class, but was able to pull a class win at Indy on the other cars misfortune, will I be the fastest car this year, maybe not, but I'm still going to Indy to try again this year. I would still rather go to Indy and lose class than race a weekly 1/8 mile program at my local drag strip. And I am not putting local racers down. I did it most of my life, and still have many friends that still do it.

Re: combo killers
 

So a guy decides he wants to go fast and play the game his way, so he writes Tilburg a check to help him do so.
Still not sure why this is still being discussed?

3 things that can be done,

1. Write Tilburg a check
2. Avoid races said fast guy enters
3. Add/Pull weight to change your class

Re: combo killers
 

4. Build a combo which fits into a class that doesn't have dozens of cars in it and own it

Re: combo killers
 

I guess there ain't no bragging about sandbagging!! The older you are the less you care. Smokem while you gottem! 😉

"I Run it like I stole it" (Gary Ewing) 🤣

Re: combo killers
 

To fix the problem you have to run E/SA.according to TerryHebree
Who is the only guy racing E /SA.
Terry’s runs against Ralph the average is about 86 under

Sooo to all effected MUST USE YOUR BRAIN

And stop bitching and run. E/SA
Complaining will get you HP
Racing FSA. DSA does nothing to help
So smarten up people

Re: combo killers
 

Really smarten up and use your brain
1.05 under on a BYE run does the dude no
were the 1000ft is
.or just hold his foot to the rad support until he
gets to the time slip shack!! WTF

Re: combo killers
 

WTF is correct!! 3 weeks in a row!! The guy has had 2 singles via red light or a single 1st rnd this weekend and can’t kill it at the 1,000 or damn somewhere before the finish line ?? The guy is killing the combo for everyone running a 67-69!! C/SA-F/SA!! At least use it in a Heads-Up not a damn bye run!!!