Ford vs Chevy Build-up - Page 39

Tony Corley · 04-30-2015, 06:17 AM

Here you go Rich. Copied straight from Aeromotives website.

Unlike a standard or “dead-head” carburetor regulator, which controls pressure between itself and the carburetor by stopping flow, the bypass regulator controls pressure between itself and the pump by bypassing flow. The optimum EFI regulator location is after the fuel rail(s) when possible. All pump flow, minus engine consumption, must always run to the regulator, wherever it is. Putting it after the fuel rail means all fuel must run through the fuel rail, and over the injector inlet, at all times. This ensures full flow is available to the injector in any instant. Most Aeromotive EFI regulators have two inlet ports, one on each side, and one bypass port, on the bottom. Either inlet may be used with a single fuel rail engine, both inlets with dual fuel rail engines. Any unused inlet ports must be blocked with the appropriate port plug. The ideal flow-path is: out of the fuel pump, into one end of the rail; out the other end of the rail, into the regulator side port(s); out the regulator bottom (return) port, back to the top of the tank. Dual rail applications should employ a Y-block to split the supply line before entering the rails, then individual lines are run from the opposite end of each rail into each inlet port on the regulator.

black88coupe · 04-30-2015, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HandOverFist

How does the regulator lower the pressure to the injectors if the rails see the pump pressure before it connects to the regulator?

Even though the regulator is AFTER the injectors in the fuel system in that configuration, the injectors are not seeing FULL pump pressure/ flow. The regulator is still allowing excess pressure/ flow back to return to the tank even though it is located beyond the injectors. The only way the injectors would see full pump pressure/ flow in this setup is if the regulator was completely closed off not allowing excess pressure/ flow to dump back into the tank. Basically dead heading at the regulator.

fordteacherguy · 04-30-2015, 08:12 AM

Back to basic EFI checks:

EFI injector wiring to correct cylinders/hopefully not ,modified? This is a SEFI engine if using stock processor and injector wiring /injector firing order must remain stock to proper injector in proper cyl at proper time.

Is Baro wired in? No baro = no altitude calculation . With key on signal wire should put out around 159 hz depending on you weather baro and altitude. Should be able to see on scan tool or programmer.

ECT reading ok? IAT Reading OK? If engine sits overnight ,,,,,both should read close to ambient temp

TP around 1 V at idle.

I'd confirm all baseline readings first/.maybe take programmer off and check running with stock processor. They are more adaptable than you think.

black88coupe · 04-30-2015, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordteacherguy

i'd confirm all baseline readings first/.maybe take programmer off and check running with stock processor. They are more adaptable than you think.

x2

Tony Corley · 04-30-2015, 08:27 AM

First step will be to connect the regulator correctly, as shown in the 2nd drawing you made. Then you can adjust fuel pressure.

SSGT Mustang · 04-30-2015, 08:57 AM

Check the connection to O2 sensors. There's a connection from the harness near the passenger side strut tower. Disconnect it, clean the inside well, make sure the connectors clamp tightly and reconnect using dielectric grease. Do the same where the wires terminate at each O2 sensor.

I have a convertible street car with heads, cam, etc. I had the same problem that you are describing. By chance, some kid told me about those connectors and that it's not uncommon for them to get corroded, preventing the O2's from looping back to the computer. I cleaned them up, put in the dielectric grease and the problem went away.

I use a moates quarterhorse to tune the engine. When you programmed the computer, did you change the variable for injector size to 24 lbs.?

Tony Corley · 04-30-2015, 09:19 AM

As long as the Mass Air Flow is correctly calibrated for 24 lb injectors, there is no tuning change required to make it run. Fine tuning, however is a different story. Checking the connectors, and all of the grounds is always a good idea, if still needed after fuel lines are corrected.

HandOverFist · 04-30-2015, 09:47 AM

Thanks to all for the replies!

First off, the Aeromotive recommended fuel diagram. I have seen it and it would be a horrendous maze to plumb...I can however easily modify to the second diagram I posted if it would be preferred to my current plumbing.

O2 sensors - I have the factory O2 sensor connected on the passenger side and a aftermarket wide band on the driver side. By not having the other narrow band connected is that causing a problem?

I think I know what the "Baro" is and it is located in about the stock location on the firewall...yes it is still hooked up. I think it is what you can see in the upper right corner in the image here...

TP voltage is correct. Not completely familiar yet with all the efi terminology...ECT and IAT? (Ok, IAT = intake air temp)

I had a damaged injector harness originally and bought a good used harness. I guess it could happen and I will re-check, but it appears near impossible to get the wiring wrong due to the length of the injector connector pigtails. I'll go back today and check again on all these tips and make needed changes.

Here is a link to the PMS controller if anyone cares to look at it... http://www.mediafire.com/view/u2ptoj..._IV_7-2004.pdf

Tony Corley · 04-30-2015, 10:17 AM

ECT= Engine Coolant Temp. Connectors only plug one way on Ford harnesses. Hook up both o2 sensors and move the wideband to a new location. The 2nd diagram you made will work. Fuel from pump to rails, from rails to inlet on regulator, bypass from regulator to tank. Once you get fuel pressure to where you can adjust it, you can drop it a couple of pounds. Car should run fairly clean without the PMS if everything else is correct. As stated earlier, the factory ECM on a Fox Mustang is fairly adaptable on it's own. The PMS just allows for fine tuning and raising the rpm limit.

HandOverFist · 04-30-2015, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Corley

ECT= Engine Coolant Temp. Connectors only plug one way on Ford harnesses. Hook up both o2 sensors and move the wideband to a new location. The 2nd diagram you made will work. Fuel from pump to rails, from rails to inlet on regulator, bypass from regulator to tank. Once you get fuel pressure to where you can adjust it, you can drop it a couple of pounds. Car should run fairly clean without the PMS if everything else is correct. As stated earlier, the factory ECM on a Fox Mustang is fairly adaptable on it's own. The PMS just allows for fine tuning and raising the rpm limit.

ECT - I assume that would require a sensor which is no longer on the engine lol. I'm betting it screwed into a port in the lower intake on the driver side...you saying I must have it for the engine to run properly? Is this the sensor here? Can it be installed in the intake instead of that tubing?

Not having both factory O2 sensors hooked up is causing problems I am experiencing? I guess my basic question now is what is the minimum amount of changes I can get away with right now. The PMS can control everything over 2000rpm...all I need is to get it to run/idle cleanly atm.

04-30-2015, 06:17 AM	#381
Tony Corley Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 264 Likes: 42 Liked 61 Times in 25 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Here you go Rich. Copied straight from Aeromotives website. Unlike a standard or “dead-head” carburetor regulator, which controls pressure between itself and the carburetor by stopping flow, the bypass regulator controls pressure between itself and the pump by bypassing flow. The optimum EFI regulator location is after the fuel rail(s) *when possible*. All pump flow, minus engine consumption, must always run to the regulator, wherever it is. Putting it after the fuel rail means all fuel must run through the fuel rail, and over the injector inlet, at all times. This ensures full flow is available to the injector in any instant. Most Aeromotive EFI regulators have two inlet ports, one on each side, and one bypass port, on the bottom. Either inlet may be used with a single fuel rail engine, both inlets with dual fuel rail engines. Any unused inlet ports must be blocked with the appropriate port plug. The ideal flow-path is: out of the fuel pump, into one end of the rail; out the other end of the rail, into the regulator side port(s); out the regulator bottom (return) port, back to the top of the tank. Dual rail applications should employ a Y-block to split the supply line before entering the rails, then individual lines are run from the opposite end of each rail into each inlet port on the regulator.

04-30-2015, 08:12 AM	#383
fordteacherguy Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Federal Way, WA Posts: 238 Likes: 38 Liked 160 Times in 51 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Back to basic EFI checks: EFI injector wiring to correct cylinders/hopefully not ,modified? This is a SEFI engine if using stock processor and injector wiring /injector firing order must remain stock to proper injector in proper cyl at proper time. Is Baro wired in? No baro = no altitude calculation . With key on signal wire should put out around 159 hz depending on you weather baro and altitude. Should be able to see on scan tool or programmer. ECT reading ok? IAT Reading OK? If engine sits overnight ,,,,,both should read close to ambient temp TP around 1 V at idle. I'd confirm all baseline readings first/.maybe take programmer off and check running with stock processor. They are more adaptable than you think. __________________ Brian Thompson NHRA Stock / Super Stock Class P/SA 6665 SS/MA 6665

04-30-2015, 08:27 AM	#385
Tony Corley Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 264 Likes: 42 Liked 61 Times in 25 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up First step will be to connect the regulator correctly, as shown in the 2nd drawing you made. Then you can adjust fuel pressure.

04-30-2015, 08:57 AM	#386
SSGT Mustang Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Jersey Posts: 359 Likes: 35 Liked 204 Times in 54 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Check the connection to O2 sensors. There's a connection from the harness near the passenger side strut tower. Disconnect it, clean the inside well, make sure the connectors clamp tightly and reconnect using dielectric grease. Do the same where the wires terminate at each O2 sensor. I have a convertible street car with heads, cam, etc. I had the same problem that you are describing. By chance, some kid told me about those connectors and that it's not uncommon for them to get corroded, preventing the O2's from looping back to the computer. I cleaned them up, put in the dielectric grease and the problem went away. I use a moates quarterhorse to tune the engine. When you programmed the computer, did you change the variable for injector size to 24 lbs.?

04-30-2015, 09:19 AM	#387
Tony Corley Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 264 Likes: 42 Liked 61 Times in 25 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up As long as the Mass Air Flow is correctly calibrated for 24 lb injectors, there is no tuning change required to make it run. Fine tuning, however is a different story. Checking the connectors, and all of the grounds is always a good idea, if still needed after fuel lines are corrected.

04-30-2015, 09:47 AM	#388
HandOverFist VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Gulf Breeze, FL Posts: 1,651 Likes: 8 Liked 33 Times in 16 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up Thanks to all for the replies! First off, the Aeromotive recommended fuel diagram. I have seen it and it would be a horrendous maze to plumb...I can however easily modify to the second diagram I posted if it would be preferred to my current plumbing. O2 sensors - I have the factory O2 sensor connected on the passenger side and a aftermarket wide band on the driver side. By not having the other narrow band connected is that causing a problem? I think I know what the "Baro" is and it is located in about the stock location on the firewall...yes it is still hooked up. I think it is what you can see in the upper right corner in the image here... TP voltage is correct. Not completely familiar yet with all the efi terminology...ECT and IAT? (Ok, IAT = intake air temp) I had a damaged injector harness originally and bought a good used harness. I guess it could happen and I will re-check, but it appears near impossible to get the wiring wrong due to the length of the injector connector pigtails. I'll go back today and check again on all these tips and make needed changes. Here is a link to the PMS controller if anyone cares to look at it... http://www.mediafire.com/view/u2ptoj..._IV_7-2004.pdf __________________ Rich Taylor I/SA - 321 Last edited by HandOverFist; 04-30-2015 at 10:00 AM.

04-30-2015, 10:17 AM	#389
Tony Corley Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 264 Likes: 42 Liked 61 Times in 25 Posts	Re: Ford vs Chevy Build-up ECT= Engine Coolant Temp. Connectors only plug one way on Ford harnesses. Hook up both o2 sensors and move the wideband to a new location. The 2nd diagram you made will work. Fuel from pump to rails, from rails to inlet on regulator, bypass from regulator to tank. Once you get fuel pressure to where you can adjust it, you can drop it a couple of pounds. Car should run fairly clean without the PMS if everything else is correct. As stated earlier, the factory ECM on a Fox Mustang is fairly adaptable on it's own. The PMS just allows for fine tuning and raising the rpm limit. Last edited by Tony Corley; 04-30-2015 at 10:20 AM.