worst red light debate, again!

[Jim Wahl]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Jim, we broke the orange car earlier this year, the green car is down for some adjustments and minor repairs, and the other stocker is getting some serious TLC and refining. We hope to have two cars at Bowling Green for both the Open and the NitroPlate Combo. Other than the Bowling Green combo, we have not been out this year. We hope to change that after next weekend. It'll be later in the year before the orange car is ready to go again.

OK. I do love that orange car!!! Jim




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[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by Jim Wahl

OK. I do love that orange car!!! Jim




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LOL, it will return. We just hurt it pretty bad trying some new stuff. We're working on it, the transmission and converter are done, the heads are in the shop. We've just got a ton of stuff on our plate, with three cars, and two houses being remodeled. Hopefully, this month will get us to the point where we can start a real comeback and finish the season on a high note.

You really should make the trip up for the Open at Bowling Green, it's always a great race, a good time for all. With the Open, and the NitroPlate $5K to win Combo, we should have a great car count, and the people at Bowling Green have been great to us.

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lee

There are instances when two competitors race under two parameters. For example:
1) SS is allowed trans brake with auto trans yet stick racers do not have same advantage. The trans brake user is afforded some adjust ability towards a better light.
2) Some classes are awarded a more favorable index factor than competitors with the same weight per HP factor. One example is SS/J vs. SS/JA.

Is this fair Bill? Oh, I forgot, this wouldn't affect you because you do not partake in the Class you have your nose in.

Once again, while you repeat your mantra dozens of times, You do not respond to my inquiries unless berated to do so. So once again, why are YOU not taking this to NHRA? Your commentary suggesting your calls would fall on deaf ears because you do not have an active license is meaningless. You have identified yourself as an active NHRA member (which surprised me) and receive ND publication. So you have as much voice as the minions you are trying to recruit. As their leader, lead!
You remind me of the whinny *****'s that complain about our country and politicians yet can't get off the couch to vote.

Are you suggesting that because NHRA is in the business of giving technical advantages to some cars, but not others, that should negate the efforts to equalize the rules regarding
red lights? What has one to do with the other?

NHRA can, and WILL do whatever they want, to hand out goodies that may or may not increase an individual car's performance, but that has nothing to do with the utilization of rules for red light protocol that affect everyone, equally.

Get another, more appropriate analogy; that one doesn't work.

Here;s a question for YOU:

WHO would be damaged, strategically, or, in any other way, by the implementation of a worse red light rule?

I am trying to figure out just what it is that you object to so vehemently, about a rule that would not cause a change in anyone's driving practices, would be virtually unnoticable to fans, would be the same rule for EVERYBODY, and would harm nobody's racing program. It's reason to exist is that for the first time, EVERYBODY would have the same chance to red light.

You have chastised me for not answering some of your questions from time-to-time.
Don't be guilty of the same thing, with this one.

Who would be harmed by the change to this rule?

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lee

There are instances when two competitors race under two parameters. For example:
1) SS is allowed trans brake with auto trans yet stick racers do not have same advantage. The trans brake user is afforded some adjust ability towards a better light.
2) Some classes are awarded a more favorable index factor than competitors with the same weight per HP factor. One example is SS/J vs. SS/JA.

Is this fair Bill? Oh, I forgot, this wouldn't affect you because you do not partake in the Class you have your nose in.

Once again, while you repeat your mantra dozens of times, You do not respond to my inquiries unless berated to do so. So once again, why are YOU not taking this to NHRA? Your commentary suggesting your calls would fall on deaf ears because you do not have an active license is meaningless. You have identified yourself as an active NHRA member (which surprised me) and receive ND publication. So you have as much voice as the minions you are trying to recruit. As their leader, lead!
You remind me of the whinny *****'s that complain about our country and politicians yet can't get off the couch to vote.

More to the point...
"Is this fair Bill? Oh, I forgot, this wouldn't affect you because you do not partake in the Class you have your nose in."

No, it's not fair, but we are talking about procedural rules here.... not "FAIR" in other venues.

The subject of this thread is matters pertinent to red light rules.... if you want start a thread about something else, have at it... but that's not "us."


Your comment that, "Once again, while you repeat your mantra dozens of times" ... LOL! I repeat it because you don't seem to comprehend when I say, "I run a Bracket car, which follows the letter of NHRA law when red lights are prosecuted. That makes ME, Bill the Bracket Racer, a victim in exactly the same way it does you, Jeff, the Class Racer whenever there's a first red light issue.

Get it? Your comments, like, "this wouldn't affect you because you do not partake in the Class you have your nose in" make me think that you don't.

Your "red light experience" is EXACTLY the same as mine. Why WOULDN'T I want it changed? Why wouldn't YOU, for that matter...

[Mile High]

This has been entertaining reading for sure but maybe the moderator could move this thread to the bracket racing forum so some of the S/SS racers won't have heart failure. Work on getting it changed in bracket racing first then the others will follow.

Jeff

[Pvt Parts]

Originally Posted by SStockDart

Pretty simple: The one that cuts the best light and runs closest to his/her dial, wins 100% of the time. What is not fair about that. I'll call that "Winners Logic", and as I stated before, I believe that each of us class racers intend to cut a good light and run close to the dial each and every time we run. Now, this is what I'll refer to as "Losers Logic", Oh Sh--, I went red and lost......OH maybe, with a lot of luck, the other guy will screw up more than I did!

I always liked to work on my car and my driving so that I was good at it, damned good at it. I don't believe in luck. Luck is where preparation meets opportunity. I believe that you have an active role in your destiny. I always took the attitude that as my opponent, I was going to do my best to take the round away from you. If you prevailed, you earned the win. I'll choose good, damned good over random luck anyday.

David Nickens is a good friend of mine and helped me immeasurably in Comp. I remember the first points meet we ran together. We were looking at my computer print out in his trailer and he said "You need get it right because in the 3rd round your gonna run one bad S.O.B." I said "Who's that?" He said "Me".

[Ed Fernandez]

OK Jim and Mark,since you seem to like Bill's proposal why don't you either get a petition or send an email or call to HQ and make a proposal to change the rule.You might as well since he won't.
Maybe it will finally put a fork in this thread.
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[Pvt Parts]

Originally Posted by Ed Fernandez

OK Jim and Mark,since you seem to like Bill'sroposal why don't you either get a petition or send an email or call to HQ and make a proposal to change the rule.You might as well since he won't.
Maybe it will finally put a fork in this thread.
.

Mr Ed. You read my mind. I was contemplating the same response. I just wasn't sure when I wanted to jerk the noose.

[Mark Yacavone]

Originally Posted by Ed Fernandez

OK Jim and Mark,since you seem to like Bill's proposal why don't you either get a petition or send an email or call to HQ and make a proposal to change the rule.You might as well since he won't.
Maybe it will finally put a fork in this thread.
.

Ed, I never said I felt strongly about it changing the rule. I said that with my current car , I can put up with it, whether they ever changed it or not.
All I'm trying to do is stimulate meaningful dialogue. I think we may need another 3-400 posts to get there..
Besides, I can't petition anybody. I'm not even an NHRA member.

[bill dedman]

Originally Posted by Ed Fernandez

OK Jim and Mark,since you seem to like Bill's proposal why don't you either get a petition or send an email or call to HQ and make a proposal to change the rule.You might as well since he won't.
Maybe it will finally put a fork in this thread.
.

More likely, it will put a fork in the whole idea,because, NHRA is now run by bean counters who only understand ONE THING: The bottom line."

Having to come up with a million dollars a year JUST to feed the two top druids (Uncle Tom and his accomplice) in the face of declining revenues that are the result of the general economy, declining car counts, poor attendance, LOTS of anti-NHRA sentiment, and gas and Diesel fuel prices, they (NHRA) are likely not in the mood to enact a rule that is NOT going to earn them a red cent, EVER, while costing them whatever it takes to get the proper software installed and working on all those NHRA computers. Add to all that, the likelihood that the poor bastard that would have to make a decision on this rule, would undoubtedly have the classic "deer in the headlights" eyes, after trying to figure it all out...

No, to hit NHRA with a petition on this idea at this time, would be suicidal.

Even if they supported the idea 100-percent, they're VERY UNLIKELY to make such a change, given fiscal conditions and their foreseeable financial future.

Petition???

Not a good idea. A good way to BURY it, probably.

That doesn't mean we can't talk about it.... LOL!