Alcohol dragster?

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Hagen Gary

Hey NovaSSDude,
Looks like SSDiv6 was compleatlly wrong about your idea. Here is a line from a statement released from NHRA.
"As an additional safety enhancement, NHRA is also working with manufacturers on a secondary tethering device for parachutes in the Top Fuel, Funny Car, Top Alcohol Dragster and Top Alcohol Funny Car classes. This is in addition to an enhanced specification for parachute mounting for the same four classes that was introduced earlier this year"

All this nonsense about SSDiv6 not posting his name because he uses a Govt. computer is crap. You must work for the current administration to think we are that stupid. They allready know whos computer its coming from if they cared. So why don't you post your name? I believe its because your smart enough to know how stupid you are. I don't believe you have a witch hunt against me, I just don't like people who don't post who they are, and then twist what someone posted to fit in what they think makes them look intelligent. Who cares if you look like your sooo informed about a subject? Nobody knows who to give the credit to. So I can only assume its a self serving agenda.

Whatever!!! By the way, I do not work for the government or the current administration and I never said that anyone was stupid. I work at a private corporation and due to my job I prefer to not have my name in internet sites and social networks...and just in case in do not work for the CIA either!!! ..and do not need to elaborate more about what I do for a living. If you feel I am stupid, that is your prerogative but those who know me in this board, know otherwise and the few times they have shared my name in a post accidentally and they have kindly edited the post to remove my full name because the nature of my job.

There are many that send me PM's asking for help and others ask when I am in the track; I always do it without expecting anything in return. I am not looking for any credit either. I just share tribal knowledge from actual experience from both the aerospace and motor sports with the aim of helping others.

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

That net was incredibly stiff. Probably far too stiff for a primary catch net. You can't slow a car down that fast and not do severe damage to the car and probably the driver, even if parts of the car don't get to him or her. You certainly cannot use nets that stiff to stop cars built for drag racing.

I agree Alan, you can see it on the video:

http://www.kirotv.com/video/24223718/index.html

[hemidup]

Engineer's put Man on the Moon back in 69. Today's engineer's should easily figure out a way to safley stop a runaway car going 300 mph plus.

[rx dealer]

I will stick with my original post about the brakes on the nitro and alcohol cars...does anyone have a photo of a nitro/alcohol dragster or funny car brakes and lets compare it to a formula 1 car brakes...let the photo's do the the talking...it's time to stop using outdated brake design...Luke SS 311

[Wade Mahaffey]

I was not there, nor am I a party to the investigation. I do know that an Investigation will be done by NHRA. If they find an issue where a certified component has failed, they will issue a rule for an upgrade across the board. We will not be told of what they found, but you will soon see it in tech. NHRA is not perfect, but I belive that there are "some" very dedicated folks within. No one can predict all types of mishaps. The key is to learn from them as to not repeat. I don't believe the two alcohol incidents are related by cause. I know the cars went into the net, but for different reasons. You can't stop a car from 200 MPH in 100 feet....in 200 feet...your eye balls will be in the sand. The sand and net are there to stop an almost stopped car. That is more favorable than a tree,pond,mound of dirt etc. The story I've heard is that the chutes deployed and came off of the car. If that is true, they will find out why. I do think something must be done, but I don't think we should blame it on the sand/net. I think they need to do something to slow the car down prior to the sand/net, so the sand/net can do what it was designed to do.

The crew chief needs to have an engine kill, chute deployment electronic device in his hand for a run away race car. They do it in monster trucks....hell, if you are to aggressive on the go-cart track they'll cut your power to idle with electronics. It can, and should be done!

Condolences to the family in each case
Wade Mahaffey

[Alan Roehrich]

Originally Posted by rx dealer

I will stick with my original post about the brakes on the nitro and alcohol cars...does anyone have a photo of a nitro/alcohol dragster or funny car brakes and lets compare it to a formula 1 car brakes...let the photo's do the the talking...it's time to stop using outdated brake design...Luke SS 311

Have you ever tried to stop a dragster really quickly from 150MPH or more without a parachute? You have more than enough brakes to stop the tire already on just about any modern dragster. The problem is when you try to stop the car quickly, the back tires will quickly begin to bounce, the more brake you apply, the more, harder, and higher it bounces. I've seen a dragster with 13x31 tires get 3 feet off the ground trying to stop quickly at 140MPH.

You could put another 4 piston caliper on each rear wheel with a 12" rotor. It would not matter, you cannot use that much brake. The back tires will go 3 feet in the air.

The front tires on dragsters and funny cars are designed to steer the car, not designed to exert or withstand a great deal of braking force. They have neither the contact area nor the strength necessary to generate any real stopping force. The front suspension and the frames are not designed to withstand that sort of force either.

You simply cannot just hang some great big brakes on a car without first designing the car and the tires to use the brakes. Drag cars and the tires used on them simply are not designed for big brakes and the forces they generate.

[Ed Fernandez]

Originally Posted by SSDiv6

Ed, I see the humor, however, if I use my real name, I could not post here from my office in a timely basis and would be restricted only when I get home. Most of the times is late in the evening and when I get home, I do not feel turning on the computer after putting 10+ hours of work at the office.

Yes, the computer is monitored when I am at work and I do work in programs related to the US Government and military so that will give you an idea of my clearance.

Many in this board know my name and when I get PM's, I do identify myself when I respond from home. They even monitor when you access your personal email accounts such as Yahoo and Hotmail which I do from my smart phone and not from work. Also, all access to blogs are blocked at work.

So,you is one of those dern fangled govt. workers,cooping on company time,indirectly on the taxpayers nickle.Bit,that's only between me and you.

[Ed Fernandez]

Originally Posted by Alan Roehrich

Have you ever tried to stop a dragster really quickly from 150MPH or more without a parachute? You have more than enough brakes to stop the tire already on just about any modern dragster. The problem is when you try to stop the car quickly, the back tires will quickly begin to bounce, the more brake you apply, the more, harder, and higher it bounces. I've seen a dragster with 13x31 tires get 3 feet off the ground trying to stop quickly at 140MPH.

You could put another 4 piston caliper on each rear wheel with a 12" rotor. It would not matter, you cannot use that much brake. The back tires will go 3 feet in the air.

The front tires on dragsters and funny cars are designed to steer the car, not designed to exert or withstand a great deal of braking force. They have neither the contact area nor the strength necessary to generate any real stopping force. The front suspension and the frames are not designed to withstand that sort of force either.

You simply cannot just hang some great big brakes on a car without first designing the car and the tires to use the brakes. Drag cars and the tires used on them simply are not designed for big brakes and the forces they generate.

I'll bet if someone developed an anti lock system,to keep the brakes from locking,they would stop these cars safely.
Quote: I don't believe the two alcohol incidents are related by cause.
Wade,this incident and Alexis DeJoria's were the same.The Kalitta and the other were simular in that both cars didn't decelerate because the engines were still under power.That's two avenues for Ca. to get outside help to correct.

[Alan Roehrich]

Ed, the back tires do not have to lock up to make the car bounce. It just makes them bounce worse.

The biggest problem, other than the bounce, is the fact that there's nothing on the front of the car to support heavy braking action. When you're hard on the brakes, weight transfers forward. There's not enough wheel, tire, spindle, or axle to support both the weight transfer and the forces generated by the braking action. At best you'll just slide the tires, at worst you'll tear something up, and maybe make a bad situation worse. You aren't going to stop an 1800 pound car going 250MPH with an Anglia spindle.

Putting front brakes on a 300" dragster with a flexible slip joint frame and 2" wide tires is probably not going to be a good idea, either.

An ABS system is going to be extremely difficult and cost prohibitive to develop and install. Sure, the F1 cars have ABS. But those teams have hundreds of millions of dollars to spend. You're talking about teams that have a dyno that not only replicates the engine speeds of a lap, but also the forces exerted on the drivetrain through the chassis during that lap. NASCAR doesn't have ABS, for various reasons, and they have OEM backing.

An ABS system is going to require at least 3-6 sensors, reluctor wheels, wiring, a computer, a power supply for the computer, a brake distribution block, servo motors, a power supply for those servo motors, all the extra plumbing, and programming. Then NHRA is going to have to police it to keep it from being used as a traction control device. And the drivers won't like it because they won't have the control they like to keep the tires from spinning.

Ideas and suggestions are great. Don't get me wrong. But the wrong idea could make an already bad situation worse.

[SSDiv6]

Originally Posted by Ed Fernandez

So,you is one of those dern fangled govt. workers,cooping on company time,indirectly on the taxpayers nickle.Bit,that's only between me and you.

Ed, did you read my previous post? Being selective on your posts to create more bashing? I do not work for the government.