ID this honing machine

Paul Precht · 02-02-2016, 02:29 PM

I called the guy and he says it doesn't have a brand name anywhere he can see, I'm going to look at it Thursday as it's a few miles from my doctor that I'm going to see. Thanks for any replies, Paul.
http://scranton.craigslist.org/tls/5371603417.html

Alan Roehrich · 02-02-2016, 02:39 PM

Axe. Decent piece, uses Sunnen AN style stones. Takes some serious work and experimentation. If the right person develops a feel for it, you can turn out decent work with it. But you will absolutely work yourself half to death to do it. Don't buy it thinking you're going to turn out CK 10 or CV 616 level work with it, at least not without a super human effort.

Mike Pearson · 02-02-2016, 02:44 PM

Kwik Way or KW Products as it is now known. You have to stroke them by hand. One of my buddies had a machine just like that about 25 years ago. really not for high end performance work.

Paul Precht · 02-02-2016, 04:17 PM

The guy bought it a few years ago with a Van Norman 777 which he didn't know how to use, I have a 777 and they require some talent to master. He rehoned 2 blocks with it and never touched it again. I told him a Peterson air assist in clean condition can be had for that price with a little searching and if the price was not firm I would check it out and make an offer if I thought I could use it, he seamed very happy to have someone interested. If my old house sells this year I'll have a CK 10 and will get an old Stewart Warner balancer another great old machine that requires some user talent. I'll be retired later this year so I'm getting the shop ready to roll again, I'll be like a kid on an endless summer vacation.

carl hinkson · 02-02-2016, 11:14 PM

If your retiring you don't want that machine you will work yourself to death. Get your CK 10 you will be much happier.

Adger Smith · 02-03-2016, 01:55 AM

I'm a little reluctant to say this, but I'm going ahead. I think it needs to be said. First, Read everything you can about honing and honing procedures.
Well, Thanks guys. I guess I'm "Super Human" I bought a new AXE years ago and used it till late 90's and went to a CK-10, sold my CK 10 in 2005 and went back to the AXE. I sold the CK 10 to Frank Parks and he loves it. Then in 2013 I bought a Rottler with the diamond set up and Sunnen stone head...
Here is the deal. It takes time and patience as well as having a feel for what you are working on. I've been manual honing blocks since 1969( in a tank I built with a roll over fixture and a fluid pump and filter) and I (personal issues) would rather have the "Feel" than the automatic. It is total BS that these machines don't put out good work. The automatic CAN be more consistent in some cases. I still have my AXE and have taken MC cylinders out of it and blued them and "dusted" them in the Rottler with the same last grit and there is not a dimes difference. The Diamonds do make a difference.These machines are just like anything else, the person that uses it is the key. It is my opinion that the shop that has high volume and an employee needs to have the automatic machine. Let it knock the work out and go on. If you are a one or two man shop and have 4 hours to do a block right, get it. The real deal with honing Automatic & Manual is learning to control Speed of the stroke and load of the stone to get the proper degree angle & surface finish. There is a lot to it and I think every shop needs a good profilometer ( there are differences in those, too) to check work he is doing. I really like sitting and watching my Rottler work, but by spending so many years doing it manual it keeps me from making big mistakes that the automatic machine can do for you. (remember the operator) Don't let anybody scare you off if a manual fits your needs and your abilities. You can't be a hack or butcher with one and get good results. You have too have a feel for it. Ok, let all the experts flame away!! That includes you too Carl. I expect you know more about it than anyone.

richie 2 · 02-03-2016, 02:50 AM

I hear ya adger, well said. Ive had a manual (lateral air assisted) VAN NORMAN for 35 yrs. in a two man shop. the only reason it's for sale now is im cutting back on the in/house workload & finding more time for assembly to get the jobs finished and paid for.... $3500.00 if anybody interested.

Paul Precht · 02-03-2016, 10:34 AM

Thanks for all the info guys, I know the difference between the CK and an air assist but figured if the guy was willing to take a low offer I might grab it, he's been trying to sell it for about three months now and the fact that it's filthy isn't in his favor, Paul.

Mike Taylor 3601 · 02-03-2016, 11:22 AM

X2 on Adger's reply.
It takes practice and skill to use hones with AN sunnen hone head,but can do good work with them,I have used CV-616 it is more operator friendly,but I was experienced with AN head hone first.
I have peterson hone that has air powered stroke,when needed let off pedal and manually operate at times,I had one that had air assist you pulled down and air cylinder helped push back up.
Mike Taylor 3601

richie 2 · 02-03-2016, 12:08 PM

hey paul you could bore/hone lots of blocks and have some income. $325 around here for that. farm out the degrease/decking and your ready for assembly......I believe the 777 bar and the hone cleaned up (new sunnen head, that's good) is a great combo...

02-02-2016, 02:29 PM	#1
Paul Precht Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Elysburg, Pa Posts: 690 Likes: 281 Liked 224 Times in 89 Posts	ID this honing machine I called the guy and he says it doesn't have a brand name anywhere he can see, I'm going to look at it Thursday as it's a few miles from my doctor that I'm going to see. Thanks for any replies, Paul. http://scranton.craigslist.org/tls/5371603417.html

02-02-2016, 02:39 PM	#2
Alan Roehrich VIP Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Murfreesboro TN Posts: 4,915 Likes: 996 Liked 1,043 Times in 274 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine Axe. Decent piece, uses Sunnen AN style stones. Takes some serious work and experimentation. If the right person develops a feel for it, you can turn out decent work with it. But you will absolutely work yourself half to death to do it. Don't buy it thinking you're going to turn out CK 10 or CV 616 level work with it, at least not without a super human effort. __________________ Alan Roehrich 212A G/S

02-02-2016, 02:44 PM	#3
Mike Pearson VIP Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 2,321 Likes: 546 Liked 1,629 Times in 502 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine Kwik Way or KW Products as it is now known. You have to stroke them by hand. One of my buddies had a machine just like that about 25 years ago. really not for high end performance work. __________________ Mike Pearson 2485 SS

02-02-2016, 04:17 PM	#4
Paul Precht Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Elysburg, Pa Posts: 690 Likes: 281 Liked 224 Times in 89 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine The guy bought it a few years ago with a Van Norman 777 which he didn't know how to use, I have a 777 and they require some talent to master. He rehoned 2 blocks with it and never touched it again. I told him a Peterson air assist in clean condition can be had for that price with a little searching and if the price was not firm I would check it out and make an offer if I thought I could use it, he seamed very happy to have someone interested. If my old house sells this year I'll have a CK 10 and will get an old Stewart Warner balancer another great old machine that requires some user talent. I'll be retired later this year so I'm getting the shop ready to roll again, I'll be like a kid on an endless summer vacation.

02-02-2016, 11:14 PM	#5
carl hinkson Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: NORTHEAST Posts: 287 Likes: 1 Liked 18 Times in 10 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine If your retiring you don't want that machine you will work yourself to death. Get your CK 10 you will be much happier.

02-03-2016, 01:55 AM	#6
Adger Smith VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Texarkana Ark/TX Posts: 2,348 Likes: 434 Liked 677 Times in 261 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine I'm a little reluctant to say this, but I'm going ahead. I think it needs to be said. First, Read everything you can about honing and honing procedures. Well, Thanks guys. I guess I'm "Super Human" I bought a new AXE years ago and used it till late 90's and went to a CK-10, sold my CK 10 in 2005 and went back to the AXE. I sold the CK 10 to Frank Parks and he loves it. Then in 2013 I bought a Rottler with the diamond set up and Sunnen stone head... Here is the deal. It takes time and patience as well as having a feel for what you are working on. I've been manual honing blocks since 1969( in a tank I built with a roll over fixture and a fluid pump and filter) and I (personal issues) would rather have the "Feel" than the automatic. It is total BS that these machines don't put out good work. The automatic CAN be more consistent in some cases. I still have my AXE and have taken MC cylinders out of it and blued them and "dusted" them in the Rottler with the same last grit and there is not a dimes difference. The Diamonds do make a difference.These machines are just like anything else, the person that uses it is the key. It is my opinion that the shop that has high volume and an employee needs to have the automatic machine. Let it knock the work out and go on. If you are a one or two man shop and have 4 hours to do a block right, get it. The real deal with honing Automatic & Manual is learning to control Speed of the stroke and load of the stone to get the proper degree angle & surface finish. There is a lot to it and I think every shop needs a good profilometer ( there are differences in those, too) to check work he is doing. I really like sitting and watching my Rottler work, but by spending so many years doing it manual it keeps me from making big mistakes that the automatic machine can do for you. (remember the operator) Don't let anybody scare you off if a manual fits your needs and your abilities. You can't be a hack or butcher with one and get good results. You have too have a feel for it. Ok, let all the experts flame away!! That includes you too Carl. I expect you know more about it than anyone. __________________ Adger Smith (Former SS) Last edited by Adger Smith; 02-03-2016 at 01:59 AM. Reason: sp

02-03-2016, 02:50 AM	#7
richie 2 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 918 Likes: 321 Liked 157 Times in 73 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine I hear ya adger, well said. Ive had a manual (lateral air assisted) VAN NORMAN for 35 yrs. in a two man shop. the only reason it's for sale now is im cutting back on the in/house workload & finding more time for assembly to get the jobs finished and paid for.... $3500.00 if anybody interested. Last edited by richie 2; 02-03-2016 at 07:53 AM.

02-03-2016, 10:34 AM	#8
Paul Precht Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Elysburg, Pa Posts: 690 Likes: 281 Liked 224 Times in 89 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine Thanks for all the info guys, I know the difference between the CK and an air assist but figured if the guy was willing to take a low offer I might grab it, he's been trying to sell it for about three months now and the fact that it's filthy isn't in his favor, Paul.

02-03-2016, 11:22 AM	#9
Mike Taylor 3601 VIP Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Somerset,Ky Posts: 1,303 Likes: 198 Liked 116 Times in 48 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine X2 on Adger's reply. It takes practice and skill to use hones with AN sunnen hone head,but can do good work with them,I have used CV-616 it is more operator friendly,but I was experienced with AN head hone first. I have peterson hone that has air powered stroke,when needed let off pedal and manually operate at times,I had one that had air assist you pulled down and air cylinder helped push back up. Mike Taylor 3601

02-03-2016, 12:08 PM	#10
richie 2 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 918 Likes: 321 Liked 157 Times in 73 Posts	Re: ID this honing machine hey paul you could bore/hone lots of blocks and have some income. $325 around here for that. farm out the degrease/decking and your ready for assembly......I believe the 777 bar and the hone cleaned up (new sunnen head, that's good) is a great combo... Last edited by richie 2; 02-03-2016 at 12:14 PM.