Clutchless Stocker

Mark Yacavone · 07-21-2022, 12:08 AM

I'm thinking of trying to make one of my transaxles into a clutchless deal.
I know it's blatantly against the rules but I see guys on Facebook swinging away and never moving their left leg after launch. I guess it's a look the other way deal like heads and manifolds.
Bobby F sounded shocked when Jim Hughes said he uses the clutch to shift LOL

I know you couldn't do it with the old DNE T 10 style square lugs.You could probably pull it out of one gear but would surely burr up the next one.
I'm not familiar with Jericos.
Could someone post a pic of a gear shifting face and the slider?
Might as well join em' ;-)

TOSTO RACING · 07-21-2022, 08:12 AM

The clutchless trans will bounce out of gear when you rock the car in gear. A clutch trans will not come out of gear. I would look into face plating your trans if its possible. Tech will check this and I have been checked before. Just a heads up for you while you are building your clutch trans

ss3011 · 07-21-2022, 10:06 AM

We got a tour of Liberties facility and he builds most of the transmissions for Pro Stock . Those transmissions are truly "clutchless" , once the car leaves the starting line there is never a point on the run that torque is not going through the drive shaft . This is a lot different that a "slick shifted" transmission , that drops torque to zero each time the gear shift is pulled . The engineering involved with making a true clutchless transmission is quite impressive !

Mark Yacavone · 07-21-2022, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TOSTO RACING

The clutchless trans will bounce out of gear when you rock the car in gear. A clutch trans will not come out of gear. I would look into face plating your trans if its possible. Tech will check this and I have been checked before. Just a heads up for you while you are building your clutch trans

Yup. About 25 years ago, NHRA would check for clutchless by having you put it in each gear ,and they would rock the car back and forth to see if it would stay in gear.
Checked at Indy..Doug Nash 4+ 1 (minus 1)..No problem.
Anyone been checked by a ghost tech man lately?

Sean Marconette · 07-21-2022, 07:09 PM

Mark
The clutch assisted sliders and faceplates have different tapered angles so they lock together in my GF5R. The clutchless have a straight angle on the faceplate and the sliders have a ramp with a straight angle, so they do not lock. Just because someone is not using the clutch to shift means nothing. How they have the clutch setup and a trans that is face plated and enough leverage to pull the shifter out of gear, and into the next gear. Or hitting the rev limiter, will unload the trans and allow easy shifting.

A clutchless will not stay in gear unless kept under a slight load. A clutch assist will stay in gear without a load. My trans was clutch assist when my car was a stocker, I never used the clutch to shift going down the track. When I switched to SS I ran the same exact clutch assist trans, until I changed gearing and had it converted to clutchless for $250. The only changes were the clutchless sliders and faceplates. The picture is my trans apart for service last winter. 5th gear is not clutchless all other gears are clutchless and show the ramp. 1st, 3rd and 4th gear sliders are chewed up from the clutch being set too tight, and driver error over several seasons.

Pierce Jones · 07-21-2022, 09:03 PM

This season I put a re-geared clutch assisted

Liberty in the car that my dad has had for awhile. It picked up over my clutch assisted

GForce. The pictures below are a broken faceplate I just changed in the Liberty (first broken Liberty part). In speaking with Brad (great guy) at Liberty this is the stock 7 degree angle. He mentioned that they've made 5, 3, .5 degree faceplates which apparently would be marked as such. I believe that some sort of surface treatment was applied to this faceplate which is why it's shiny.

Mark Yacavone · 07-23-2022, 04:00 PM

Yes, I understand the clutchless set-up.
Now, those faceplates only have 7 notches. Assume the slider then has a matching number of engagement dogs?
What holds the plates on? Those pictured don't look like they've been welded.
Picture of slider, anyone?
See, I told you I don't know anything about this modern stuff. ;-)

Frank Castros · 07-23-2022, 06:50 PM

Herb McCandless is no longer a contestant.

Frank Castros · 07-23-2022, 06:52 PM

But...................He should be!

Mark Yacavone · 08-04-2022, 11:32 AM

Nobody wants to talk about this subject?
Understandable ,but c'mon..everybody's doin' it.. ;-)

07-21-2022, 12:08 AM	#1
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,418 Likes: 2,582 Liked 4,453 Times in 1,694 Posts	Clutchless Stocker I'm thinking of trying to make one of my transaxles into a clutchless deal. I know it's blatantly against the rules but I see guys on Facebook swinging away and never moving their left leg after launch. I guess it's a look the other way deal like heads and manifolds. Bobby F sounded shocked when Jim Hughes said he uses the clutch to shift LOL I know you couldn't do it with the old DNE T 10 style square lugs.You could probably pull it out of one gear but would surely burr up the next one. I'm not familiar with Jericos. Could someone post a pic of a gear shifting face and the slider? Might as well join em' ;-) __________________ We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for..... Will Rogers

07-21-2022, 08:12 AM	#2
TOSTO RACING Senior Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: DRAGSTRIP Posts: 809 Likes: 605 Liked 472 Times in 137 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker The clutchless trans will bounce out of gear when you rock the car in gear. A clutch trans will not come out of gear. I would look into face plating your trans if its possible. Tech will check this and I have been checked before. Just a heads up for you while you are building your clutch trans __________________ 5664 AA/SA 1970 NOVA

07-21-2022, 10:06 AM	#3
ss3011 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 885 Likes: 63 Liked 221 Times in 102 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker We got a tour of Liberties facility and he builds most of the transmissions for Pro Stock . Those transmissions are truly "clutchless" , once the car leaves the starting line there is never a point on the run that torque is not going through the drive shaft . This is a lot different that a "slick shifted" transmission , that drops torque to zero each time the gear shift is pulled . The engineering involved with making a true clutchless transmission is quite impressive !

07-21-2022, 07:09 PM	#5
Sean Marconette Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 958 Likes: 618 Liked 165 Times in 60 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker Mark The clutch assisted sliders and faceplates have different tapered angles so they lock together in my GF5R. The clutchless have a straight angle on the faceplate and the sliders have a ramp with a straight angle, so they do not lock. Just because someone is not using the clutch to shift means nothing. How they have the clutch setup and a trans that is face plated and enough leverage to pull the shifter out of gear, and into the next gear. Or hitting the rev limiter, will unload the trans and allow easy shifting. A clutchless will not stay in gear unless kept under a slight load. A clutch assist will stay in gear without a load. My trans was clutch assist when my car was a stocker, I never used the clutch to shift going down the track. When I switched to SS I ran the same exact clutch assist trans, until I changed gearing and had it converted to clutchless for $250. The only changes were the clutchless sliders and faceplates. The picture is my trans apart for service last winter. 5th gear is not clutchless all other gears are clutchless and show the ramp. 1st, 3rd and 4th gear sliders are chewed up from the clutch being set too tight, and driver error over several seasons. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Sean Marconette 84 Mustang 5060 SS/N Last edited by Sean Marconette; 07-21-2022 at 07:13 PM.

07-21-2022, 09:03 PM	#6
Pierce Jones Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Chatham, ON. Canada Posts: 19 Likes: 15 Liked 15 Times in 9 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker This season I put a re-geared clutch assisted Liberty in the car that my dad has had for awhile. It picked up over my clutch assisted GForce. The pictures below are a broken faceplate I just changed in the Liberty (first broken Liberty part). In speaking with Brad (great guy) at Liberty this is the stock 7 degree angle. He mentioned that they've made 5, 3, .5 degree faceplates which apparently would be marked as such. I believe that some sort of surface treatment was applied to this faceplate which is why it's shiny. Attached Thumbnails __________________ Pierce Jones 1995 Camaro D/S #3102

07-23-2022, 04:00 PM	#7
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,418 Likes: 2,582 Liked 4,453 Times in 1,694 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker Yes, I understand the clutchless set-up. Now, those faceplates only have 7 notches. Assume the slider then has a matching number of engagement dogs? What holds the plates on? Those pictured don't look like they've been welded. Picture of slider, anyone? See, I told you I don't know anything about this modern stuff. ;-) __________________ We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for..... Will Rogers

07-23-2022, 06:50 PM	#8
Frank Castros VIP Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Lowcountry. Posts: 2,642 Likes: 2,155 Liked 2,082 Times in 769 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker Herb McCandless is no longer a contestant.

07-23-2022, 06:52 PM	#9
Frank Castros VIP Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Lowcountry. Posts: 2,642 Likes: 2,155 Liked 2,082 Times in 769 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker But...................He should be!

08-04-2022, 11:32 AM	#10
Mark Yacavone Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Miles From Nowhere Posts: 7,418 Likes: 2,582 Liked 4,453 Times in 1,694 Posts	Re: Clutchless Stocker Nobody wants to talk about this subject? Understandable ,but c'mon..everybody's doin' it.. ;-) __________________ We are lucky we don't get as much Government as we pay for..... Will Rogers