Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Why not lighten up a little? The way I see this is that the IHRA let a lot of people down. Both the tracks and the racers deserved better. When the tracks switched to the NHRA they worked together to build this series. I think it will be fun and will have at least one COPO at as many of the races as I can. The crate motor racers will get a chance to run in the series this year. That means they have somewhere to race without making a drastic change to their cars. The NHRA has made no long term commitment at this time. I really don't feel that the NHRA is going to add crate motors. Mainly because car counts are good and it adds complication to tech.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

How much of a difference from what started out as Crate Motor Stock are the new factory cars and the variety of engines they are allowed to run.

Look at the CJ's with the 352 or the 428, the COPOs with the 350 or 427. Mopars with the variety of engines the factory offers for them.

If you take delivery of a COPO with a 427 then decide you want to order a new 350 supercharged engine for from GM, and you take it to Barton's and have it built and blueprinted and put it in your car. What exactly is not "Crate Motor" about that?

how is that really that much different than ordering a 502 or 385 Fastburn from GM performance, re-building and blueprinting it and slipping it into your 69 Camaro.

No disrespect for anyone who runs these. Cars. It is simply comparing Fiji to Red Delicious to Gala to Honey Crisp Apples. They are all still apples.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

The IHRA already has a place for these cars in their new Bracket Racing series.
Why should the NHRA give them another place to race?
By doing so, they have turned the NHRA races into nothing more than IHRA Bracket series.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I don't know, maybe the intent was to put something nice together for some of my IHRA friends who just got dumped by an organization that they supported for years. I don't get all the complaining. This has zero impact on the National or Divisional level. Except of course the opportunity for local NHRA racers to get easy grade points. That realization should bring out more tears.......

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Ya know, this D-2 1/8 mile N.O. series has no more to do with NHRA races than the local S/SS Association does. OTHER THAN a place to get a grade point without traveling great distances. Most of the local associations welcome NHRA, IHRA and even NSS cars. What's the problem? There's no Tech to speak of anyway. It's a bracket race, period, with a chance to get a grade point. I'm quite sure that the organizers of the local S/SS events WISH that they could offer their participants a grade point for participating!

Now, ya want to talk about the ridiculous expense of racing? Ya want to talk about "entry level"? Ya want to talk about what to do with the "crate motor" cars? Get someone to come up with a viable "heads-up" eliminator using minimum weights and "crate motors" where the final 4 cars can be "claimed" at the end of the day. But that will never happen.

Or just race good junk like I do and stop complaining.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Yes it is, and I really cant figure out why everyone is scared of the crate motor cars. Its really pathetic to sit here and listen to all of the bickering. :cool:

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

What a Snobby and Fickle statement !!
PS, GT and CM are all legit Stockers whether you like it or not.
All the associations accept them so they will live on.

Regardless there is nothing Stock about the current Stockers.
The concept long lost with the unlimited Spring and Duration Rule.
Few Tech people who knew how to measure a cam.
Today a simple to attach tool could do that now.

NHRA would not have put on the 1/8th mile series if there was not something there.

NHRA is looking at adopting CM.
The documentation has already been developed.
When they do expect three tenths to be cut matching current Dial-Ins.

In my opinion NHRA needs to give the Stockers a Hair Cut.
A lot of tracks had to convert to 1/8mile because of the higher speeds and the insurance companies liability insurance.

NHRA needs to limit Stocker Spring Pressure to something like 120-130lbs and leave the Lift Rule in place.

Think SS needs a similar rule to slow them down a bit.
Such as a Lift Limit Rule..that goes something like this.
350 cuin * 1.8 = limiting lift to .630 lift
454 cuin * 1.8 = max lift .817

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Dan,

You are reading way too much into this National Open series. I will be shocked if the NHRA has any interest in adding the IHRA classes to their regular program. It is my feeling that an IHRA racer wishing to run the real deal should be looking at building a combination from the NHRA guide. For now they have been given a place to run what they have.

Daren

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Dan,
The NHRA does not need to do any of the things that you say they need to do.
The NHRA is doing just fine without doing all those things.

The IHRA, which you supported, is not doing well. That is why they changed their format.

Again, someone please explain to me why the NHRA should change anything or accommodate anyone, just because the IHRA changed their format.
Go complain to the IHRA or whatever, but stop trying to justify why the anyone should change the rules to accommodate a bunch of racers who could not make a go of it in their own association.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I agree with Gump, I have no problem at all with them doing these NO races to give them somewhere to race but I would put money on it that if you want to ever cash in your grade points you better get a current NHRA legal combo. This was a good deal Rich put together but I wouldn't read anything else into it. As far as being scared of these cars I don't understand this comment, why would anyone be scared its not like I would have to run one heads up? Next I'm waiting for " I know you are but what am I"?

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

NHRA isn't "changing" anything!

1) The "Opens" in Div.2 didn't exist before.

2) Most if not all will be 1/8 mile, which many NHRA racers don't like anyway.

3) The series is SEPERATE from NHRA national and divisional points, so that won't affect any racers chasing those.

4) NHRA racers should be happy that they can get grade points there for national events.

5) Some people who are most vocal against the plan are outside of Division 2 anyway. What does it have to do with you? What purpose does the bashing serve besides stirring things up? Don't like it?...Don't go to them. The rest of NHRA hasn't been influenced by crate motors.

A side note - today's NHRA Stocker's are MUCH closer to Crate Motor cars than the class that they started as - Pure Stock!

Right now I have an IHRA Crate and a NHRA Stocker. I'll race both or whichever one I can do well with. I'm thankful for the option.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I find it amusing that there are racers, (NHRA) that think to run a crate motor class that you just buy a engine from the suppler and put it in as is. No need to take it apart or buy any pieces or work on it. Magic.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

WHY ?
Because they can and will!

Bet you a Dollar !!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

YEAH because they can.
It is REALLY Nice to Start off with .......BRAND NEW PARTs !!!!!
Racers will go through the engine to make sure all is good.
Add Cam, Intake and Carb and you are off running with the big dogs.
Plus if they meet another same classed car they have to run heads up.
Just like the other Stock Eliminators cars !

$5000 is a lot less than a $10,000+ Stocker Engine.

NHRA has already approving new AFTERMARKET Heads.
Holy Crate Motor Captain Kirk !!
More Di-Lithium Crystals ...Scottie !
But Captain !! ...........Our Communicators will Blow up !!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I call BS. A "Big Dog" crate motor will cost as much or more as most "Big Dog" production motors.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Those are some pretty ignorant remarks considering how many IHRA cars run in the same association as you. Those cars help make the race day payouts, year end payouts as well as the level of competition of the series for the better. Doesn't matter if you agree or disagree with the matter, you shouldn't be publicly pissing on your fellow racers that you line up with every race. Maybe you should tell some of them in person 3 months from now in the lanes about your thoughts about their cars and where they should be racing.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Comment deleted.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Thanks for explaining all that and thanks for sending me a PM as well with the same message so I could read all of it again.

Again because you have a hard time understanding, maybe respect your fellow racers instead of flicking your nose at them and saying how useless their car is now just because you aren't effected. Others have stated why they built their cars the way they did including myself. I'm not asking for NHRA to change, I'm asking you to think about your fellow racers that it does. No matter what the cost was, people have still invested time and money into their setups and don't need d ickish remarks how they are just good for bracket racing now. I dont think you would talk like that to a guy that ran Modified when it was dropped and you tell him to just go bracket racing.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

The Modified cars were simply moved to Comp.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

And Super Stock
And you missed the point Racer was trying to make!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

No, ed.....not all of them...Some notable racers simply moved them to the GARAGE ......never to be heard from again.....

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Like some IHRA cars now.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I've had a couple pretty good crate motor car's and I can tell you it runs around $10,000 to build a fairly good one. Not the $15,000 plus for an NHRA small block. What's the difference, it's racing and supposed to be fun. I don't understand the hate I read here. If NHRA let's crate motors in is it going to cost you anything? NO, then why all the hate ! We're not here long enough to worry about the small things in life.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Many in stock believe that diluting the ranks with crate motors will lead to the end of unique combinations..........and they're probably right.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Bingo! Now die thread, die!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

You only speak for yourself.
Just look at Factory Stock in NHRA..
CM, GT and PS worked fine in IHRA
So did the FI, Truck Classes, FWD.

As for Stockers being Stockers.
The dilution came from the morphing Class Rules.
Not from a new class car.

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

It worked so good in IHRA that it no longer exists, think about it.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

The rich guys don't want to run their $120,000 crate motor cars against $20,000 crate motor cars simple as that. Nobody wants to add more classes because it "dilutes stock eliminator", until they are getting their doors blown off by fi car or a factory car. Then all of a sudden we need new classes. The people who think IHRA getting rid of the sportsman classes wont effect them are wrong. The smaller the pool of racers the less healthy the sport is.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Bingo!!! I do miss IHRA

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

You know it is so hard to have a rational conversation with folks like you.
The reason IHRA dropped Class Racing is because too many racers did not support IHRA's Class Racing.

Cars that could run both NHRA and IHRA didn't show up.
So much for that argument !

Seems when Mr. Bader ran IHRA it did well.
He moved on and things changed.

IHRA was quite innovative bringing in new types of classes.
Classes that NHRA glommed on to.

NHRA, NMCA, IHRA, AHRA can all do what they want.
They are all competing for our business.

It was the fickleness of Racers that stiffed armed IHRA Class Racing.
If you had shown up there would be IHRA Class racing.
It is a Lost Opportunity because of your behavior and attitudes.
You did not support the sport !!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Stock was diluted in the late 70's when they changed the cam & valve spring rules. There's no more stock,. It's modified stock.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

No hate here. You may remember that I ran with the IHRA for quite some time. I ran some goofy combos from Pure Stock to Stock GT. It was a lot of fun. I even started to build a front wheel drive crate motor car until Baker killed my combination. Things began to go down hill when they started doing the double headers and turned it into a bracket race. Before that the car counts were pretty good around here.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

How dumb. There are lots of low buck cars running NHRA. I don't remember anyone complaining about them.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

No Dingbat Dan its hard to have a conversation with you! IHRA invented those classes to try to get people to come race with them plain and simple. They thought they could fill races with glorified street cars like yours but instead they ran off the few class racers they had left. No 1/4 racing, no contingency, no nothing was the demise of IHRA amongst other things. Yep I didn't go the last 4 years because I was busy racing somewhere else!
I support the sport where I want to race and don't really give a damn about what you think. Many of the same people who thought IHRA was more racer friendly, or didn't want to take an extra day off to go race, people that race NHRA are a bunch of snobs with big toterhomes blah blah are some of the same people who want these cars added now that they have no place to play.
Last comment I will make on this useless thread.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

[QUOTE=KEN BUGAJ;556369]Stock was diluted in the late 70's when they changed the can & valve spring rules. There's no more stock,. It's modified stock.[/QUOTE

Ken......Stock as we knew it died in 1985. That was when NHRA allowed any valve spring pressures and any duration and overlap specs.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Thank goodness !!!!!!!!

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

There you go again being insulting and immature comments!
IHRA failed because of what I wrote.
If you took it personal that is not my problem!
What I had to say was clear!

D

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

How dumb. There are lots of low buck cars running NHRA. I don't remember anyone complaining about them.
Then you don't have a problem with crate motor cars running in NHRA, or do they need to be $120,000 crate motor cars like yours. Because other than the price they are the same thing.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

I took it personal because you said "you did not support the sport". I do support the sport I just did not support IHRA. See you at the races when you get a legal combo.

Re: Crate Motor Class
 

Nope. I actually thanked some senior NHRA people for giving my crate motor friends a place to race this year.


That's a special comment. Are we a little butt hurt?


I disagree. But, you are welcome to your opinion.