Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I guess what some are saying here is leave well enough alone. I'm sure I don't want to go through a scale house even though I am not over length. My motorhome has a GVW of 10,500 and it weighs 13,400 without the trailer. Going down the road with my car and tailer, I'm at 21,000+. I have tried to ask and check on plates and such but get all kinds of answers. Guess it is better to beg forgivness instead of permission. This deal is like what we ran into this week with a local car show to benfit my automotive class. We have been working on it for 3 months and filed the paper work for a non-profit and got insurance and leased a facility and then we get a call from some guy that says he is the enforcement officer for the state of Tennesse and if we don't get a permit he will come give us a ticket that is many times the price of the permit. So we send a guy to Nashville to get the permit because we had to have it 10 days in advance and find out that no, in our case we don't need it. One hand don't know what the other is doing.
Jim N.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

The book mentioned is the Federal regulations book giving the definition of what type of vehicle usage is considered commercial. I believe Federal regulations set the legal standard.

How heavy is your former car anyway? My 3/4 ton truck has a GVWR of 8800 lbs and a GVRA of 6085. Does the tongue weight on a 26 ft trailer with your old car exceed that?

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I guess I'll have to go upstairs at work and talk to the truck enforcment people about this.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I have some friends who live here in WV who were ticketed on I-77 in NC two years ago. They were towing a 22ft. enclosed trailer with a 3/4ton extended cab. The officer was not interested in seeing what the gross vehicle weight iof the truck or the capacity of the trailer axles he was only concerned with determinig that the total weight of the truck and trailer exceeded the weight listed on the vehicle registration card.. That is why he issued the ticket. In other words it came down to paying an extra fee for the commercial pkate. Here in WV we can buy a "B" plate for our trucks and pay an extra fee for the additional weight of the trailer being towed. The WV DOT has been stopping rigs to check to see if their license registration reflects the weight of the truck and trailer. That was the case with my friends who were ticketed in NC. Is it a safety issue or a Dollar$ issue? You be the judge.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Ed, Your wrong in 3 years when you have to get a new physical you would have failed and they do not have to renew your cdl. You can ware glasses but within certain limits and if your blind in one eye your done and thats what happened to one of my drivers after being grandfathered.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Are you saying that you're legally blind in one eye which prohibits you from getting a CDL, but you can have a regular drivers licenses????

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

There are two publications that you'll find very interesting........one is the road bible " federal motor carrier safety regulations " & woodalls campers guide........................i believe that woodalls has a list of every states leagal length requirements.....its been awhile since i have looked at it , but i think that with the rigs we as sportsman tow with today.......there might be 4 states that we are actually legal in....................................as the cars go faster...the tracks are the same length..........................as the rigs get bigger, the laws from the 50's & 60 "s havent changed alot......................either way.......its costly enough just to get to the race & pay your entrance fee's..............no need to contribute to every municipality along the way......any information that is available is much appreciated, but i'm registered to go to nc, & if this is the real deal...we're canceling our entry......

Thanks for all the info

wayne

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Has any one heard any thing about a crack down on trailer lenghts at Piedmont last weekend

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Lou, I understand there were many tickets issued among other items. I think that is where this started.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I went up to the Motor Carrier section of Colorado DMV and asked them. They are not used to race car/pickup questions as they are mostly concerned with commercial semi's and large trucks. They told me my F250 would be legal towing anything up to a 10,000 GVWR trailer.

Federal regs define race car haulers as full trailers, meaning the weight of the trailer and contents are fully supported by the trailer axles, not the trucks. Truck and trailer total weight are used to compute loads for semi trailers where the weight of the load in the trailer is partially supported by the trailer and partly by the truck axles.

Of course the Federal reg's were written with the big rigs in mind at a time when car haulers for the most part didn't exist and motor homes were not there yet either.
So it is really difficult to find the parts of the regulations that pertain to us. It probably would be a good idea to keep a bookmarked and highlighted copy of the regulations in your vehicle (assuming you are legal).

NHRA should be leading the fight to change the regulations so they are easier to understand and get a lot of the larger rigs made legal.

And thanks Ed, I did have a nice day.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I don't think so !!!!!!
Better check that again !!!!!
That fifth wheel weight is HEAVY............:-)

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Utah has a whole set of other rules.
A few years back just before the fall Las Vegas national event everyone travelling in down I-70 from Colorado were being stopped if they were a pickup and fifth wheel trailer of any size. If the truck trailer combo was in excess of 12,000 lbs the Utah patrolman required a CDL. If no CDL was available from the driver tickets and shutdown was made on site. There just happened to be a CDL driver available for a price to drive the rig down the road to the state line. It was a setup from the word go and collected a lot of racers coming in from the east.
Some of the friends fought the tickets and won after the lawers fees. Others just paid.
If the states want to they can write the tickets for something. With public funds being short now those tickets are revenue.
My 2 Cents

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

It seems to me that the vast amount of differences from state to state is as much the issue as anything along with the states need for any revenue they can get right now.
I still contend that my state would not give me a CDL if I showed up to take the test with a vehicle with less than 26,000 GVW or some type of passenger bus. You have to take the test in the type of vehicle you will be "operating".

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

A tag along is what I was refering to. I should have been more definitive.
A fifth wheel is more like a semi trailer.

I could pull a fifth wheel but it would have to be really really light.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I Called MI department of truck safty today.And was told i need a CDL and all the other stuff all truck drivers need.
My truck has a GVWR of 11,500 the trailer a GVWR of 18,000= 29,500 LBS

They told me any trailer over GVWR of 10,000 needs a CDL
Anything with a Total combined GVWR of over 26,000 LBS needs a CDL

needing CDL includes log book and all the rest of the stuff Truck drivers need

Was also asked if i had a job Cuz if i work alot i my not even have the hours left to drive??????


forgot to ask about RV's

anyone in MI that wants to call and ask a few ?'s the number for Mich dept of truck safety is 1-800-682-4682

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I bought a diesel pusher 40 ft motorhome in 2001 and talked to the local DMV (Texas) about what kind of license I needed. I was told at that time since it was an RV all I needed was a regular license.
I questioned the GVW due to the fact the weight was 31,000 and setup to pull a 10,000 lb trailer.
I pull a 28 ft alum trailer with a GVW of 8,000. That gets the combined weight to a possible 39,000 lbs.
All I could get out of them was it is a RV and nothing extra was needed. I was familar with the CDL requirements and the GVW requirements but they kept telling me RV's did not qualify.
I drive it now and have not yet had a problem but that day may be coming. I guess I will just claim to be dumb if questioned about it and fund the local government. I guess they need the money.
My 2 Cents

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Sounds like these states are re-writing the federal motor carrier safety regulations...............0-26,000 lbs no cdl required.......26,001 & up cdl required.........26,001 & up with air brakes class b with air brake endorsement.........all pertain to commercial vehicles.........its not going to be legal to go camping pretty soon..........even the tolls are getting crazy...................years ago i pulled into a nj dmv check on rt #78 i had my suburban,2500 with a 24 ft. Haulmark trailer,with plackards, bills of laiding, ...carrying my own product, for non-profit racing & a log book..............the stateies got so flustered they didn't know what to do, and with an attitude, told me to get moving......

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

I talked today with the Indiana State Police DOT officer who is the head of our district. I wanted to find out what our state is looking at. I have a Dodge 3500 pulling a 48 foot Gooseneck with living quarters. The trailer is titled and plated as an RV. I have an 11000Lb plate on the truck. I need to weigh the truck but she said I was ok as long as the plate was above the actual weight of the truck. Being an RV the trailer was ok and exempt. But, hear comes the kicker. If you go to a race track and any money exchanges hands in anyway, that is considered commerce and you are considered a commercial vehicle. You must have Dot number, Class A CDL etc. As has been shown on here, if you are plating the trailer as a trailer, the 10000Lb GVWR of the trailer applies and you need all the DOT requirements. So it looks like we are as bad here as in any of the other states. The 10000Lb GVWR for trailers is DOT and has been on the books for some time now.
Not good news for sure. We'll have to hope that the DOT folks don't decide to look at all of the folks coming in next week. Good Luck!
Thanks!
MFR426

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Good point, once again the catch 22 bites you......................i was just reading the new dragster.........and the good ole "effective immediately " rules for pit vehicles smacks you right in the face....all the don'ts & no do's.............................................t he very next page has a mc cormicks add for golf cart rentals at national events................................how many racers today don't have some type of pit vehicle support..................when it states that only those particpating at an event will be allowed to have a pit vehicle.......i don't know who's rules are more confusing....... State & federal dot / puc, or n.h.r.a's either way if we don't get beat getting to the track, we'll get beat at the track........................and yet we always figure out a way to go back & give them our money again...............and its all for " the wally ".........what a way to go..!!

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Try this thought ...
IRS says its a hobby... Cops & DOT say its a commercial venture... If you get a ticket & get found guilty
of operating as a comercial vehical because you can win prize money.
Now you have proof its not a hobby....deduct all racing exspenses from your taxable income!!!

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Try this thought. I take my motorhome with my trailered (get around town) car and go to the casino and win some money. Then am I a commercial vehicle? Very gray areas.

Greg

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

As long as the race you are going to has a Best Appearing trophy (and if it doesn't, start doing it), tell the cops you are going to a car show with a trophy for a prize and no money. Bingo, you are no longer a commercial enterprise. (I am a 26yr LEO and that would work for me!).

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

There is a specific exemption in the DOT regs about prize money. I have put it out here for years. It is for cars, boats, horse trailers etc. Anybody want it, email me and I will fax it to you. jefft@southlanddodge.com. Now you can't have your trailer and truck or motor home titled Joe Jones Racing. Then you are commercial. My motor home is titled in my personal name and so is my trailer.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Guys ---the basic problem here is either length or weight!!! For example if you have a 36-40 motorhome you can only have a trailer that has an overall length (thats right the enclosed box AND the drawbar) of
28-20 feet --- That means a box length of about 24-16 foot box !!!!! sorry but that is reality!!! If you have a crew cab dually and a 5th wheel trailer any longer than say 32-36 feet you ARE TOO LONG! !!! also if the TOTAL weight of both the truck and trailer is over 10000 pounds you weigh too much--You will need a CDL in almost every state OTHERWISE you are ILLEGAL-- So quit your bitching get your legislators to change the laws--They are on the books and since every state & municipality is crying for $$$ they are going to enforce these antiquated laws--Comp 387

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Also DOT, CDL, and Weights & Measures are three different animals. I think in all states your plate should be enough to cover your total weight. Over 10k, you could be subject to DOT regs if you are a commercial user. CDL comes in over 26K GVW. All the truck manufacturers make a truck that has a GVW of 25999 or 25900 and it is completely legal. A trailer manufacturer could rate a trailer with triple 6k axles (18K) at only 14k and completely legal. GVW is determined by axles and frame. That is a federal deal. If you are pulling with a truck, just keep the title in a personal name, and have enough plate to cover what your truck and trailer weigh and you should be ok. Motor homes normally are just licensed without regard to GVW except maybe NY I think. You always want to create a gray area if you are stopped.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

The GM of ZMAX Dragway is now involved in the problems in NC, as well as Steve Earwood. I would expect a resolution or temporary fix shortly. More as it is available.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

You all might want to take a look at Federal Motor carrier safety administration Rule 390.3 (f) (3) Occasional transportation of personal property by individuals not for compensation nor in the furthance of a commercial enterprise. If you go to fmcsa.dot.gov and then search for rule 390.3 once it comes up click on the box to the right that reads interpretation then go down to where is says question 21. You have to meet the criteria which are
1. A. you are not racing for a profit any income is reported as regular income on your personal taxes and B. you are not deducting the costs as a business right off

2. corprated sponsorship is not involved.
I keep a copy of this in the truck with me so if I let someone else drive and we get stopped we will have it to show the officer. I have a A CDL but I keep it in there in case I let somebody else drive.
Hope this helps
Rob

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Glad I live in Texas. Not as bad here, maybe I shouldn't start anything or say anything,LOL. My trailer is 3 axle,18000 gvw, truck is 26000 gcvw, wiegh 11,000. I'm also 7" over length of 65'. Havn't been pulled over yet. But then again, I don't win much either. so I guess that makes my not commerce?

I know all of people around here that are more over length and weigh more than I do and havnt' ever been stopped.

Re: DMV Crackdown
 

Heard there was supposed to be a meeting august 26 th...............hopefully those minutes will be available.........& we can put this to rest until another state is heard from