Re: Horsepower Adjustments are Posted
 

NHRA has listed a 327/250 reduced from 274 to 269. I can't find where that even exists(274 that is). The 250 is rated at 270 on a 65 in the GT section. It also states 62/67???? I called and got no where with this. Wesley at D4 said he has no idea where this came from. He doesn't understand this either. Ed

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How about those AHFS guru's missing the boat on the 265 ('55 Chevy), not counting some slower runs because they assumed that other '55 was a 283! Len's "simple AHFS" gets messier all the time. The rules "float" depending on human element that was supposed to be eliminated by a mathmatical system. The system is flawed and human bias and/or laziness contributes to the fact that questions multiple each time a revision comes out.

My "fix": take 3 major brand engine builders (Ford, MoPar, GM) add Wesley and Travis and let those 5 deal with HP and indexes with their knowledge and historical committment to class racing

Flame on

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randall hits the nail on the head... the Automatic Help For Slugs cannot and will not ever work... WE manipulate the numbers

thats why several posts on here are "bashing" someone for actually racing thier car ? stupid huh ?

we need a horsepower committee with intelligence (i know that may not exist in the current NHRA staff with minor exceptions for wesley and travis) but unless we can look at the numbers, the weather, the physical makeup of a motor we cannot adjust the horsepower intelligently... we just use those DUMB numbers we fake... you know the computer saying... garbage in garbage out.

i'm just beating a dead horse, i've said all this 100's of times even many on this forum

anyway randall good call !

jack mccarthy

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I didnt see any GT/AA 454 motor factors. Is that an issue? No good runs this year?

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And this the the biggest travesty of all:

Cadillac 350 170 183 196 78/79 GT Only w/AT

How anyone with half a brain would have ever allowed a 350 cubic inch V-8 to compete in SS at 170 HP in the first place is beyond me.

Farmer is indeed rolling over in his grave.

Has that combination not yet demonstrated it's ability to mock the sytem enough?

Forget about the CJ Fords, that deal makes them look over rated.

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Why were the '08 Mustangs not hit in this adjustment? Of the 2nd half of 2009, the SLOWEST qualified mustang was -1.151 ( Indy in AA/S) .

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The 08 Mustangs received 14 horsepower about six weeks ago. Where have you been?

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Has anyone done the math on this combo? By my method it's a lot more than 3 1/4%

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The simple truth is the old gross & net hp ratings. Remember when the factories started to rate the motors 'with accessories' to calm the insurance frenzy? NHRA neglected to add the gross rating on this motor.

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Hey Steve,

I sense a little tension here. Tell me, what was I supposed to do?

I was making fun of the fact that the CJ's completely kicked my *** by .12 while lifting which was well on its way to .20 ahead of me. They got 14 HP, we got 10 HP, which means they only got 4 HP compared to us. So what did that accomplish? Now they'll only be .15 ahead of me?

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We ? As in DP Challys ? I thought we got 5 ?!?

Or another combo ?

Chris

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64/65 NASCAR Hemi

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Hey David: doesn't it just make you laugh at all the guys that have never run next to a new Mustang? They've never seen the real issue up close and personal have they?. They don't know what it feels like to run 130 mph with your right foot on the front bumper, and to look over and have someone toying with you! It's a joke. When the new Challengers run 9.30's, the new Mustang will be the first stocker in the 8's. And that's a fact! JB

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You guys live for today. Where is your sense of legay or history. Stock and Super Super Stock as we know it will be gone soon and you ignore becuse of your personal egos. NHRA as it is currently structured could care less. Wake up guys. It is time to ban together. Where is the current format going from here?
NHRA could give a rat's *** as long as you pay the freight.
Just my 2 cents as an observer and a former competitor who sincerley cares.

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You guys crack me up. I understand about your situation with another car toying with you at the top end, don't it get you just a little upset. Sometimes you just have to make fun of it to save your own identy and insanity. But let me tell you what would send all of you through the roof.

1. Picture yourself against a car that has everybody in your class covered by three tenths.
2. Picture yourself against a car that has everybody in your class covered by five tenths.
3. Picture yourself against a car that has everybody in your class covered by seven tenths.
4. Imagine taking a .900 advantage on the tree and watching your opponent cross the
finish line while seeing his time on the scoreboard at the same time, while running .60
under yourself.

1. Mike Senia U/SA
2. Lloyd MacKay U/SA
3. Bob Dennis U/SA
4. Bob Shaw U/SA

I still have my mind, but it is really funny sometimes.
I believe the "newer cars" will create some laughter.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA unfortunately

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Just add a new class called "LAPTOP STOCK",then us old timers/ old school ( "REAL STOCKERS") would still be in the ball game instead of sitting on the bench(in the bleachers). lol

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Danny, now that's some funny *****, I don't care who you are !!!!! JB

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I would need at least a10 MB spot! Jim

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David B, I got one better than that, In the Class final at Indy I get out run by .17 -1.07 to 1.24 under. Now here's the good part sence I ran faster than -1.15 in Q and so did another Class thats the same combo, My combo hits theTrigger and we get 4HP. Even better he's running a combination no one else in the country runs hes the onlyTrigger, I get to add 50lbs now i'm .25 hun. behind. So now all i can do is sing a Christmas song an be happy, all i want for Christmas is another two tenths, another two tenths, Find another two tenths GEE,if icould only find another Two tenths then i could have a Merry Christmas TOO! MERRY CHRISTMAS HO HO HO !

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Why dont most of you (the ones who run the older combos) just set back and take a year (one season) off from kissing NHRA's ***** and let the new combos have at it? The lack of entries would get the ASSociations attention and maybe the newer combos would beat their own brains out and get some HP during the season. You could use that time to TEST and save a fortune in travel and entry expense. Would one season kill you?

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Terry: That's really not a bad idea! Buy the end of 2010, even with the new index, the Big Engine Mustangs, convertibles included, and the Big Engine Challengers should all be AA Stockers or SuperStock. (as they should be) It's going to be interesting to see how the "purpose" built cars with the smaller engine combos figure into the skeem of things!!!!!! I can hear the whinning now!!! Maybe Stock Eliminator (all classes) will be Mustangs and Challengers....Now that would be fun to watch! ... Spec Stock Eliminator ...The Cars of the future !!! That's when I quit! JB.

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Jim, look at it from a Ford fans view over the last 20 years or more what % of the field has been GM, NHRA has been pro GM for ever, maybe they are seeing this now and welcome some new blood in the sport. Just think for a sec. what if it was TOYOTA?

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Stand at the entry gate the next time your local track has a Test and Tune nite. I don't know about anyone else, but I sure don't see any 40+ year old Camaros, Belvederes, or Mustangs coming through. The young crop of racers for the most part are not into old cars with distributors and carburetors. The latest cars with the low hp ratings will help generate interest in the new cars, get them built, and get them on the track for all the young racers, (and kids) at the track to see, touch, taste, and smell. Don't get me wrong, my car as well is not competitive against the low rated newer stuff, but what else is going to get these youngsters out of their Hondas and Subarus and into Detroit iron?

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Like I posted in the other thread where you had a similar post, before you edited it, these $50K to $100K new cars aren't going to do it. The kids you're talking about do not have the money, the time, or the interest. We sell parts and services to them every day. They're not interested in class racing with all of the rules, all of the effort, and all of the expense. If they did want to run Stock or Super Stock, and they didn't want old iron, they'd be scarfing up all those LSx F bodies and building them, or the Mustangs, or the ones with money would get Corvettes. But they aren't. Because they don't want to spend the money, the time, or the effort, and they don't like all the rules. I hear it every day when we open the doors.

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I posted on the wrong thread before, so I posted here. These kids are already going to the drag strip every week, might as well put something on the track from Detroit for them to see. The kids around here (Charlotte) spend a ton of money (or their parents') on their imports. So where do you think the next breed of S/SS racer is coming from?

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I do not claim to know where the next generation is going to come from. I just know what those kids will tell you about NHRA (or even IHRA) class racing. They have no interest. And it isn't the cars that don't interest them. It is the rules, the format, and the structure. They like the "adrenaline drags" and all of that. They like nitrous, they like big cams, they like adding a supercharger to a normally aspirated car. They do not like RULES, they certainly do not like the idea of thrashing on the car, especially not teardown.

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new class = " imports all out "

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There was a pretty good indoor car show in Rosemont,IL a few weeks ago.I went there on a Saturday night and was surprised that there weren't that many people there.Hardly anyone under 40.
I really don't think that today's generation,for the most part,is in to fast cars.If they were,how many can really afford some of the things at the show that were on display,like this?


http://www.nickeychicago.net/vehicle.php?id=251

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At the Atlanta national event Jimmy Ronzello was pitted about 5 rigs down from me.
There were 2 or 3 very nice looking older stockers or superstreet cars between us.
Well there was a crowd of people by Jimmy's car just about all the time. And there were a lot more people coming over to look at my car than any of the cars between us. I can't tell you how many people copme up to me and say I've got a Neon or my girlfriend drives one etc.
The nostalgic cars are not going to draw the newcomers. Why should they
We look at a fast A/SA car it goes in the nines. Well a lot of the "kids" out there can go just as quick and drive their cars to the track..

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A lot of "kids" today can afford more than you think.
When I was a "kid" you could not wait to get out on your own.
Now "kids" live at home, and mommy and daddy don't take a penny of their hard earned money.

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[QUOTE=Dale Shannon; maybe they are seeing this now and welcome some new blood in the sport. Just think for a sec. what if it was TOYOTA?[/QUOTE]

I would PUKE....................

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GAG, PUKE, Vomit, FART, Yeah.....sounds like an import with a fart can muffler.

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I wonder if the flathead ford guys felt the same way about the OHV V8's?

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Yep....they sure did.

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Same deal here... my Turismo gets a lot of looks and a number of people coming up to talk about it everywhere I go.

I don't know about the rest of y'all, but I bracket race my Stocker every weekend that I'm not at a S/SS event. I talk to a *lot* of people about the car and the sport, and have gotten several people -- younger generation -- interesting in class racing. It's not like we have to convert half of the Test n' Tune crowd in order to keep S/SS racing alive... a few here and there adds up, and everyone can help simply by making themselves accessible, and putting your car out in front of a different crowd now and then.

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The same happens to me at races this year at Zmax a lot of young people
looked at the car. And asking a lot of questions maybe because it has a turbo.

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Ding Ding Ding, and that is the answer , and one of the reasons we chose and focused on the new Hemi (I wouldnt care less if it was a flatop with the name) It gets people attention, and then what holds it in the case of people being able to RELATE to it is, "Thats the same engine Earl has in his truck" and on and on, Im glad to hear thats what you see at the track, thats what were hoping for.

Case in point, I like old cars, but im odd in my growing up around very old iron for my age (38) I about fainted last year at a show when I saw a 46 lincoln, all original and very nice, v12 car, 8500$ I about choked, drove it loved it and thought damm lets go to the bank, then I thought about it, why hadnt this car sold ? 20 years ago it would have been goooonneeeee in 5 minutes, but it was Sunday and there the car sat all 30k original miles....

MOST of the people that knew, could relate and appreciate the car are DEAD ! Same thing with my Model A Huckster and my kids their friends and most people I know looked at with about as much interest as an Olds Runabout or a Horse Drawn Carriage. Thats why the damm thing didnt sell but Ill tell you what an 86? monte SS that rolled in for sale had people tramping over and dealing on the spot for a car I wouldnt have saved from the crusher.

Your right Art, spot on......they cannot relate....but I understand relucance on people part to admit that, there is love in a car, and there is sweat and blood, and there is money, its hard to grow old, and its even harder to admit it.

Me Im young in body old in the head.....lol

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First thing anybody says in regards to the Turismo (well, after they say, "Hey buddy, yer tire's flat!") is a muttered, "Oh, turbo car." When I tell them it's not a Turbo, *then* they get really interested. "What?! How's it go that fast?"

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Michael, I had to laugh at the "your tire is flat" comment. If I had a dollar for every time I heard that while running the Caddy and the Spirit I could have paid for the new car! It's amazing how 14 lbs. of air looks "flat" on a FWD car! Jim

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We took a season off a few years ago and never came back--I get all the "racing" I need from DRC and class racer forum --