Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I really enjoyed the PRI show .Sorry i missed some of you folks. Took my wife and it was her first time for the PRI and she was simply amazed . She had no idea it was as big as it was . All she knew was what we tried to tell her when we came home from the shows.. She loved it and now wants to go every year with me....Of course it did not hurt any making all the outlet stores and site-seeing,lol.........COLD bevs on the shuttle bus was good too.........

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Billy you know as well as I do that it can be done for less. These new cars just shows how stupid some are to throw that kind of money at a hobby that only inflates and strokes their egos. But its their money and decision to do so and I dont feel sorry for them. I dont care how rich you might or might not be this has gotten crazy. $100,000 for a V-10 Challenger or $70,000 for a Blown Mustang plus what it costs to set one up has gone to far for stock eliminator just to "Bracket Race" and yes that is all it is. I feel for the guys with the older combos as they are the ones who are taking it in the shorts. I almost fell into the trap myself and glad I didnt.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Some of you guys keep wrecking the intended topic of the posts. No I don't appreciate what is happening with the new cars in stock but I said it already......so have you!

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Well said!

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I'm betting they will win some races in 2011 but also they will lose races as well, based on looking back at results from 2010 I don't see it to effect anything after class runoffs. I would like an explanation as to how it effects eliminations after that. I mean how often did these headsup races with the CJs and Dps really happen once eliminations started?

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Alan, just ignore that fool. Maybe he will go away again.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Ask Larry Hill.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Maybe not the coolest thing at PRI but the most shocking thing I saw. Jesel now has solid roller lifters for the 5.7/6.1 Hemi for SS. These are drop in lifters, no keyed bushings or machining. Just 16 lifters and 4 tie bars similar to the plastic pieces the factory used to hold the stock lifters. Ready for this....$3200.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I'm glad someone's making money.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Well, it affects the ladder and even getting on the ladder (Indy).

Don

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Who wants to loose only a couple of rounds a season to a joke? Many run classes with very few heads ups. Not the case for B/SA, C/SA, SS/IA, SS/JA, SS/KA, and several others. Some people (maybe not the bracket racers) care about class run offs also.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Cheap at twice the price after spending over $100,000 for a Dodge that you cant even get tagged and registered.....LOL.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

A couple of very good racers with very good legitimate cars took a whipping from new cars in heads up races in later rounds, as a matter of fact.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I never said we were the fastest. I said we were reasonably competitive at most races. We have two class wins at national events, and two class wins at the Bowling Green Open race. So yeah, we have a legitimate complaint.

The new cars will not save Stock and Super Stock. The ONLY thing that will save Stock and Super Stock is for NHRA to be run as it was originally intended to be run. By the racers, for the racers. All this crap about the new cars "saving class racing" is nothing but a joke. They've caused just as many cars to be parked as new cars have been built. They've pushed long time racers to quit or cut back their schedules.

NHRA only cares about Stock and Super Stock with regard to how much of a cash cow they can be. They do not promote the classes, they treat them like bastard step children, Hell with the exception of a couple of announcers, they damned near tell the fans to go to the concession stands and the manufacturer's midway when Stock and Super Stock run.

Another year will not take care of it. Because in another year, there will be another batch of "new combinations" that start all over again with a nice soft bogus factor. There are already a dozen combinations that were never sold for street use, and could never be registered as a street car in the guide. In another year or two, there'll be a dozen more, so long as someone crosses the right palms with silver. The new rewritten rule that completely changes the character of Stock Eliminator guarantees that so long as one or more manufacturer wants to buy dominant performance in Stock Eliminator, they can keep right on getting bogus cars in the guide as long as they want to pay the price. Stock and Super Stock are for sale to the highest bidder every month. Just wait and see what happens when the cash stops flowing.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Pedigo, I and the larger majority on this forum agree with you.....

But I guess when you've got 1,400+ to 2,400+ posts you've really got a lot to say...
even if it's the same old ****, over, and over, and over. sarc!!

Sorry Mike, that your thread has taken such a ridiculous / un-intended turn.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Ok, so how is this different from those good racers and good cars differ from them against a so-so car?

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Easy, a legitimate combination is a legitimate combination. Some guys will always be faster, because they're able to do things better.

Example: if Sorenson, DeArmond, Shaul, DeFrank, Ficacci, or Koppien beats us heads up, I'm okay with that. They have a legitimate combination and they worked harder or smarter than we did. No one handed them a bogus factor that was 150-200HP soft. All of those guys are faster than we are, three of them run the same combination we do. They earned their advantage over us. No one gave it to them.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I understand, however wasn't it the same way when the L?-1's came out? For awhile anyway

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Alan, I'm not trying to agure( ? ) with anyone, just trying to understand. I run in NMRA assoc. with several friends from Div. 3 running both stock & SS I try to keep up so I can converse with them and not be tooo stupid sounding.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

They weren't 100 to 150 hp soft. Maybe 50, but they were registered, ran on pump gas, met Federal emission standards, and readily available to everyone even for the first 3 years. We are beyond 3 years for the Drag Pak/Cobra Jets.

The Drag Paks will soon be in the same class as the Cobra Jets and rendered ineffective in a heads up. The Cobra Jets have them covered by as much as they want. A small specification modification by the factory on one of those combos and here we go again....F or G classes on up will be affected.

I am still laughing about whoever made the comment of the Cobra Jet fitting pure stock. That was great!

Don

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Billy, you're living proof that it isn't like that. And you do a damn good job of it too.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

The LT-1 was in a regular production street car, sold to the general public, for use on public roads, certified for street driving with all the necessary safety and emissions testing and equipment. It was not a purpose built race car combination that did not even have safety or emissions equipment required for street use at the time of sale. In fact, the LT-1 was never offered in a special "stripper" car that was 800 pounds lighter than the street legal version. So trying to equate the new cars with the LT-1 deal isn't even a valid comparison.

Everyone keeps bringing up the LT-1. Here's the lesson that SHOULD be learned from the LT-1, the LS-1 and other cars like it: They belong in a class of their own. NHRA knew for a fact that these new cars were factored extremely soft, even softer than the LT-1 was. NHRA put those LT-1 and LS-1 cars in their own classes until they were brought in line with the rest of Stock Eliminator. But now, NHRA steadfastly refuses to do the same thing (the right thing) with the new cars that are factored even softer than the LT-1 or LS-1 ever were. There are only two explanations. Either they're extremely stupid and do not care, or they are extremely corrupt and intentionally allowing a dozen under factored combinations that were never street legal to run all over the rest of the racers.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

As I said you guys cant see the forest for the trees, without factory involvement you are nothing but a dead side show, we all know we have been a side show for years but now at least our future is there for a while and chevy will get in just give it another year or so. If chevy doesnt get in and ford and chrysler get out stock and ss will be be HISTORY. Top Sportsman here we come.

Yes its not right RIGHT NOW........but in 5 years Drag Pack and Mustangs have helped the future or Stock and Super Stock. Besides we are only bracket racing anyway for the most part now as in grudge racing we say "get in where you fit in"

Herb Jr

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

The factories have had their new cars in for a couple of years. When do you think we'll see all this wonderful improvement we keep being told about?

I haven't seen any of it. Same purse, higher entry fees, fewer contingency sponsors, less ink, and less TV time.

You want to help Stock? Stop perverting it and start promoting it instead.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Alan- that's probably the best interpretation of what caused the state that we are currently in.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Will cars and classes like Top Sportsman and Top Dragster replace Stock and S/S in the future like Herb Jr. seems to believe? Will the back bone of NHRA's sportsman program go the way of Modified Eliminator and the Doe Doe Bird with the stroke of a pen? Its a fact that Stock and S/S has become a pain in the NHRA's ***** and it it wasnt for the numbers and the money they currently generate they would no doubt be history. To much to police and the keeping of specs to maintain the current classes. To many tech officials who know how to inspect an engine are needed and that costs the NHRA money. Scales and fuel check will still be required until after qualifying is over but thats it. When eliminations begin such inspections are not needed due to the bracket dial in system. Will enough T/S and T/D racers fill in the void in the future to take up the slack between the Fuel Queer's elimination runs at national events? Will some of the current stock and S/S racers change over to this type f racing if it was to happen? I doubt it but maybe a few would so they can keep racing but I doubt any of the old loyal regulars would. No doubt the spectators like watching these two original IHRA catagories better than a slow 8, 9 or 10 second stocker and S/S. T/S and T/D far more interesting than the .90 classes to a spectator due to the lack of a throttle stop for the "Barf and Puke" runs made today in S/C and S/G not to mention the S/ST guys who dont even get to run for a championship or many National events. The AHFS and bogus HP factors would go away. No more bitching. The $$$$$ to build one of these cars (T/S) would be about the same as a current DP, blown Mustang or S/S FWD conversion car. Where is stock and S/S's furture going after the factory dosent supply trucks, offical cars to the higher ups and they dont grease the Associations palms anymore when the few who can afford a new combo today get bored and decide to play another game? Just "Food for Thought" !

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

In 5 years the only cars running will be all these new bogus SS cars, running themselves. Most will move to IHRA by then.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Actually the sanctioning bodies have been the biggist killer to S/SS in the past 8 years or so.

-can afford to raise entry and add on bogus charges but can't afford to raise payouts (ihra did increase a small amount at some point)
-run off contingency sponsors by charging huge amounts for parking rigs, booths and in most cases just to be a contingency sponsor
-Allowed tech to be over turned with a call to home office
-calls to home office turned into illegal being made legal
-rule change of the week (see above)
-refusing to factor combos as correctly as possible but use a system (ahfs) that will never work and makes racers want to be "average" and not excell in the performance department
-charging gate prices to spectators that are way out of line
-Allowing the rule book to become "just another piece of paper"
-pulling rulings out of the air or supposedly from the (super secret procedures manual)
-track prep in some cases not up to divisional or national event levels
-Now allowing factory produced race only cars to run at laughable hp ratings even when they were not street legal. I do however, welcome any positive factory support.
-At some nationals, running S/SS at times when spectators are not likely to even be at the track
-Very little tv coverage ( i can kind of understand to a certain extent) if time is tight. but if the worthless interviews were not there time would be there for more sportsman exposure
-Lack of consitantly in enforcing the rules


I could go on but you get the message......don't care attitude. And the the old saying: If you don't like the way its done, don't come back. Hell of a way to run a business.

*I may be way off base with IHRA as I have attended very few races since the Robert Leonard days/Bill Bader owned tenure. Mostly due to the changing tracks in the divisions several years ago.

Sorry to get off topic so here is my take on PRI. I noticed less booths, less worthwile seminars. If it wasn't for seeing people that I only get to talk to in person once or twice a year probably wouldn't take the time to attend.

Oh....and I do the degree thing in my head...basic addition/subtraction/division. That must not be part of 2nd and 3rd grade teaching now.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I didn't get to PRI this year. Wish I could have gone. How's that? lol

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Anybody price anything down there that might be a deal? I could not go, but I am a real fan of "Boat Show Specials" and have bought at PRI before and most manufacturere will still make deals at this time. Maybe a V10 car for under $90K. Could not pass that up.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I don't think anyone's said anything about not wanting or appreciating factory involvement. Are you suggesting that if the 'factory race cars' were designated as Super Stock only or could only have been included in the classification guide if they were rated 50-75 HP higher that the factories would've just taken their toys and gone home?

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Believe it or not there is new interest in Stock and Super Stock Racing.

Was at PRI had discussions with several that think we are great show.
S/SS is one of the best car shows in the USA with performance to match the good looks and perceived as a good value to promoters and fans.

Booked in shows with properly prepped track and schedule that puts emphasis on SS/S.

Coming your way soon.
Support it and make it successful.

There is interest and it's growing.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

I have to agree with Signman, we are alive and well in Stock and Super Stock.

Our Can-Am Stock/Super Stock Association has been and was again this year, well accepted at the PRI show by the manufacturers.
We count on them to support our series and as we continue to grow (22% per year for the past 2 years), it makes it much easier to get that support.

As was once said by Mark Twain, "rumours of my demise have been greatly exaggerated"

FJ Smith

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

NOBODY supported Stock and SS racing as a track operator like my brother and I did when we ran Piedmont Dragway, we ran combo's on a regular basis. Terry what I was trying to say in my long post was NHRA doesnt need our aggervation, there are enough high roller bracket racers to fill that void at a race with no aggervation. If they took 40 cars in 3 different classes (bracket) they have a 32 car show for Sunday to fill the gaps. I'm not bitching anyone but I can tell you if I got bitched at as much as NHRA has over this stuff I could care less what happens and that is what has happened. This is my last post on this but just think about what they did to Modified and the class was strong. Just 3 years earlier they had 20+ cars in some classes just for class runoff at Indy. It would be so easy for them to combine Stock and SS and have one class, just think about it. We need to try to do something different what I dont know, but I dont see my youngest kid who is 11 ever running Stock, I just dont think it will be around in 10 years. sorry just my .02.

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Nothing else has to be said, this makes the thread.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

What the hell does any of this have to do with the original thread?? Nothing. I have to say I'm getting alittle sick of some people taking every opportunity they get to Scream about the Mustangs a DP cars. I'm as frustrated with it as anyone. But now you have resorted to Taking over other threads just to bitch about it. Call or write NHRA about it Don't HiJack a thread about the PRI show just to bitch! I was looking forward to seeing what every one thought was the best new product and right off the hop someone starts bitching about the DP and CJ cars. 1 post about the best stuff at the PRI and 8 pages of bitching about the CJ and DP cars. =(

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Hi Steve. How was your trip home? We thought about you when we saw the weather on TV
My highlight of the week was the dinner at Bahama Breeze.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

The coolest thing I saw there was the V-10 Dragpack. Just a sore issue though. Don't agree that it should be in stock as it is equipped. The throttle body had Wilson machined on top in plain view. What are ya gonna do?

The 2nd coolest thing was the Intek Trailer with the Icon package. You can get a nicely made well equipped aluminum trailer for under $20K. With similarly equipped Hallmark Edge priced out at $13K.

Re: Coolest new Thing from PRI
 

Way to go Steve, tell it like it is

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I liked the TRAAXXXX radio controled off road toys (high $$$$ ) . I stood there over 45 minutes watching those guys play with them . Jumping ramps ,wheelies ,and crashes along the way . Now that was cooooolll.......