Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Great idea.

Run IHRA rules since they are stronger in the East and would add to car count. plus there are a lot of cars that won't fit NHRA and you're going to end up with shoe polish times anyway.

Anywhere is a long way for FL but I would attend Bowling Green or Atlanta or Bristol.

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Not at all. I think something like this could be HUGE!

I'm planning on being at the CCRA race @ Fayetteville, if you would like I will pass out some cards to the racers directing them to this thread to see what kind of feedback there is.

As for location I think either Columbus or Bowling Green would draw the most cars. Glad to see you want to do this when it isn't super hot!

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Mike,

Sounds like a great idea!

I would agree that the Columbus racing surface seemed much better this year than it has been in years past. I also agree that it is a very centralized track that should draw a good number of cars. Plus close for you and I.

Having class with a large top heavy pay-out will likely draw the most cars. More chances to race the better.

We will definatley support with a few cars.

-Aaron Allison

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I'm with Jeff, I can take off more time from work to help! Bill Cassill, would Earlville be interested in this type of race?

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Mike it's great that your working so hard at planning this event. I know some are worried about pay, which is a issue for regular events we attend. Not very many racers are doing this for a living, but when you make the semi's it would be nice to cover more then just your entry fee. Sometimes we racers have to go to a race every now and then just to have fun and come to the realization that money isn't everything. Having a class national ever 5th year should be one that people are willing to support just to keep stock/superstock alive and healthy. An event like this at a track that appreciates racers will make a successfully event especially when the numbers (entry) reflects the pay so no one thinks anyone is getting fat off the racer. I think only one race should be had and made as central in the US as possible. Coming from the west myself, I know that even though to make this successful more racers are probably going to be out of Divisions 1,3, or 5. With that knowledge or educated guess I understand why you say Ohio. For us in the western portion of the US I hope you shoot for something near the Mississippi river north of I-70. Topeka I think is about the most central location but the majority of racers are east and north of there.
Good luck and hope to be there myself!

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Here is what we did at Byron, if it wasn't a NHRA class we would use IHRA class, now that the index's and hp setting are a bit different, we might have to sit down and figure it out a little, but i'm figuring we will use IHRA index's for sure. We have plenty of time to figure this part out.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

This sounds awesome but my budget won't allow me to tow 900 miles for a race(Earlville) But thats my problem. Good luck to everyone who can go.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Sounds good here... I hope to be home and have our car ready to rumble by then. I would also agree that Div. 3 would be the most ideal location for all. Whether it be C-bus, BG or even Indy. I don't think anyone could argue that these locations would be the best for drawing the most cars.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Before calling for certain locations, consider NHRA's putting roadblocks in using their facilities. I believe a National Event Track as well as any NHRA owned track will face "objections" from Glendora.

Location and tech was impacted to some degree at the first US Class Nationals if my memory serves correct. Maybe things have changed.

I do think it may be possible to use a Divisional track as long as their are no competing NHRA events close by....for example, during the west coast swing, eastern LODRS tracks maybe would face less roadblocks

I think one big draw would be to hold the event when weather conditions are suitable for fast runs that we all would like to see, or participate in. Byron's 100 degree heat was not conducive to performance or participant enjoyment.....although surviving became a badge of honor, and kudos to Red and officials for a constant hook in those conditions

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Make sure it's not in a dry county. And make sure it's got some kind of river or stream or puddle of water, pond, or something so I can get something to cook. And I can put my pets there too.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Matt,

Rather than cutting into the overall purse maybe we could have a Gambler's race, winner takes all?

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Michael,

The tracks you mentioned are a little far away for Southern and probably some East Coast racers, can you look at someplace a little farther South and East...KY,TN,VA,WV, etc. Heck, I'd even travel to Atco just to see the place where it all started for me.

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I never mentioned dividing the purse. I suggested a third race, in addition to class and the eliminator. Call it a gamblers, combo, or whatever you want, to run the same day if there is a test day.

We run one on Sat. the day before the Lee Sherman race at MD with/after the test and tune, and it does not take any money from the guaranteed purse for the LS race on Sunday. Put up $50 per racer and run for the money.

Mike B's response makes perfect sense to me, the number of anticipated racers would not cover his costs for another days rental for even earlier parking for the event. You can't expect a promoter to take a days loss for our enjoyment, our fun is someone else's business.

My suggestion was, if there is a test and tune, schedule and run a combo race for the same day and track rental if possible. IT could be racer's entry is the pot or entry plus $5-10 to cover the costs.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Mike:

National Trails would be a good place because it is centrally located so, it will draw cars from a wider area of the country. Norwalk would be a nice place but would probably be hard to sqeeze in an event at an acceptable date for everyone.

Good Luck it's a great idea and a huge undertaking.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Lots of support from racers here at the IMIS show, and Redman's on board for the starting line!

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Just thought I would try and help out with a map so when people are deciding what is centrally located they can see the whole country.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I meant to comment when the thread started but somehow it slipped off my radar.

I've been to a bunch of tracks across the country, and there are a very few where you instantly feel the difference between the operations of simply a promoter and someone who loves racing.

Earlville is the most racer friendly track in the country as far as I'm concerned. No Problem is right there but I haven't been to the track since the management change, plus it's not nearly as central.

In my experience promoting events many years ago, I'm acutely aware the entire thing involves juggling a bunch of pros and cons. Earlville might be more distant for a lot of racers than Columbus and without entrants there's no reason for the race.

But then I think of the downhill staging, all-concrete track, racer barbecues, tree-lined pits, RV park. and the staff in the tower enjoying the action as much as the racers - and I keep coming back to Earlville.

You can't get much more central than Gateway, but I can't see the event there for a lot of reasons. Yes, you could physically do it, but I'd bet a whole lot more racers would have smiles on their faces Sunday night if you held the event in Iowa. So even if you're juggling variables I think it's a mistake to base the decision because of an over emphasis on one of them.

Whatever you decide to do, good luck. I think it's a tremendous idea.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Michael, having Redman is a HUGE plus. At the original Class Nat'ls in 2001, when it was 101 degrees, he kept the track HOOKING all three days. Would be great also to have one or two qualified, respected tech officials, also like the first Class Nat'ls.

Meant ot write some stuff earliuer this week, but was busy with dad's surgeries for cancer. Now that he is home and doing well, I can.

I always said that trying to copy the original Class Nat'ls format would be perfect (since it was, then or since, the greatest event EVER for Class Racing cars, outside of Indy or the good old days at Bowling Green, G-ville, etc). However, I understand that getting a track for three to four days might be cost prohibitive).

Using a three day format (just a few ideas) :
~Track operated test and tune with some type of Gambler (seperate S and S/S) or a Combo race, with x-amount payback, depending on how much the promoter, track, or both, are looking to make off of it. If not, just use it for parking and tech.
~two Qualifying Runs and Class Eliminations on Saturday; if there was time after to do it, and had sponsor money to do it, maybe a CIC-style race or something similar.
~Eliminations on Sunday.

A central location, near a great number of cars would be good. Probably somewhere in Division 3 (Ohio/Indiana). Using Columbus as an example, you're about 550 miles or so from NJ, and less than 500 miles from St Louis; not far from the Michigan/Canada crowd, or the northern Div 2 crowd. A good area to draw from. Every so often, a Class nationals-type discussion comes up, and when people suggest places to hold it, many use a track(s) that are two hours or less for THEM. You need to have a location that better suits a LOT of cars, not just the select few who want a race like this, but only if it's in their own backyard. You can;t be that narrow minded. Byron IL was 500 miles for us, and we went to spectate (and gave up racing my street car in brackets at the IHRA race at my home track 25 miles away; didn't have a Stocker yet) because I wanted to be there to help support it in any way I could. And yes, no matter where you have a race like this, people won't go, for whatever reason (I've seen it first hand every year since 1999). The best location to have it is to have it at/near somewhere that can draw the most cars possible, which, again, would be somewhere in central Division 3.

Michael, I'm in tohelp in any way I can. You know how to get ahold of me.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I don't know if it is actually a fact,but when I stayed at a Hotel in Columbus,Ohio in September,there was a sign on the wall that said; "Welcome to Columbus,Ohio,where 50% of the population of the United States live within 500 miles."

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mean_ce...tes_population

The center of the country based on population is in south-central Missouri.

It would be interesting to know the population center for racers, I wonder how much it would change.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Guy's,

You need to think a little farther South if you want Southern racers to attend, Columbus is 1000 miles from Florida, Norwalk even farther!

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

And if you move it far enough south, you'll lose many racers from the most populous parts of the country.

This is what I was referring to in my post on the previous page of this thread.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Very well said.There is not one place that would ever make everyone happy.Probably just one of hundreds of reasons why there has never been another Classnationals event.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I think part of the success of the original event was the fairly centralized location it was held. You move it too far east or too far south and you eliminate a good number of cars. One problem with our country is it's vast size.
I used Cordova as a base and you could draw racers from as far west as Denver 850 miles, south as dallas 880, or Atlanta 800, east York pa is 820 Rochester is 750. That is a really broad section of the country that is within a 1000 miles. You could use Earlville or Byron and those figures wouldn't change much as they are pretty close together.
Before anyone thinks well I'm just wanting it closer to me. Well I guess you'd be right. But everyone wants that. Besides Cordova is almost 700 miles for me. Most would still be closer then me. I hope it can be pulled off as I had a good time at the first. Just hope it doesn't turn into a division one or three only race do to location. Because we do have cars out in this part of the world they just don't race all over all the time. We had over 50 cars at our S/SS combos in little Marion SD.

Rick

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I just checked Drag Strips on www.staginglight.com and all the 1/4 mile strips are under one of the HRA's, only 1/8th mile strips don't fall under and of the HRA's. That means we will have to deal with one of them to get a good place to race.

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

So what you are saying is that YOU won't travel very far but it OK for us Southern Boys to drive around the world, how very gracious of you!

It doesn't where to population center is, trying to be fair to all who want to support this program.

How about we hold it in Gainesville and you can travel 1000 miles?

JimR

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

If it was up to me,Route 66 would be a great place to have it.National event facility,and if I drive fast,I can be there in an hour.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

It seems to me that the fairest way to go would be to locate it as close to the population center (of Stock and Super Stock racers) as possible.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Route 66 Race Management & Promotions Coordinator....... Randy Simpson

He just happens to be a Stock Eliminator racer.Might have the connections to put the deal together.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I live in Cozad Nebraska (100th Meridian) exact center of the United States!! closest big tracks are Denver (300 miles West) & Topeka (300 miles East) so Earlville or Topeka seem closest to the center with tracks big enough to handle large events

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I'd drive a thousand miles to race a Class Nat'ls, if I still raced (drove 500+ for the other one, just to spectate). Raced in Stock at over twenty tracks in twelve states--travel doesn't bother me. Drove 1,100 miles, twice, to race the Orlando Nat'l Open. And would drive further than that for another Class Nationals. Again, how bad do you want to race? If a racer wants to, they will. If not, they won't. Move this race to Florida, you won't get 125 cars combined between Stk and S/S. Have it centrally located, you'll get 200+ easy (the first Class Nat'ls had 187 (yes, one-eighty-seven, eight rounds to win) Stockers and 110 S/S.

It's only common sense (yeah, it's not so common anymore in life) to put a race such as this in a location that has the BEST chance to draw the MOST cars.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I looked it up today. The central point of the US is located Lebanon,KS. That being said I have seen suggestions as far east as WV,Maryland,NJ etc. Now come on we need to be a little more considerate than that. IMHO

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

of coures they wont help but nhra can put the zip codes of stk / ss number holders into a program will tell you where the geographic center of the PEOPLE most apt to participate in the event not the center of the country... we do it all the time for bowling events and it HELPS entries a bunch !

jack

i'll be there

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

When they ran the US Class Nationals. Fuel and gas was a lot cheaper. It took a lot more grade points to get into Indy then to.
You have to position it for the most attendance. Not the center of the country.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

I couldnt have said it any better.......

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

This is easy... Michael set up a pre-registration account and have people pre-register to determine the best location of those that will support this race. Pre-registration of $100 or whatever by March 31, '13 cut off date to decide the geographical location for those that will support the race. You can still keep the pre-registration open for obvious reasons after that date. Just make the geographical decision with this info and give the option of a refund for those that would be 1,000 miles or more away from the final location. Everybody that pays will have there zip code registered this will give Michael very use full numbers to negotiate with for track rentals as well as other things. Just my .02

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

The very best place for car count would be Bowling Green. We routinely get 60 cars for combo races. That being said it probably would be difficult to find a good weekend because they are so busy. You would get cars from D 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5. Plus everyone likes Bowling Green.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Ohio is and can be a very very good geo location for this race. I think Columbus at the right time of year can be good also. Especially with the proper support and input.

Michael, I agree, there is Earlville, Cordova, Bowling Green as wonderful, class racer tracks. There are some real target rich areas out east.

West is tougher.

I think the one thing to consider heavily is your location. In my mind, if you are very close to Columbus and the track is acceptable, that should be your choice.

Obviously, no one else has offered to take on this role. If it was easy, we would be talking about the ClassNats 10 by now.

I would suggest locking in a location and date.

The racers, ( and fans) need to do our part. Get the cars ready, save gas money, help get sponsorship and or contingency to kick in. Help park cars, tech, whatever.

So, my vote would be for Michael to pick it and the restof us kick in to a real positive mode where we don't bitch or complain about where or when it will be. We either go race, go volunteer, or send sponsorship of some kind to support the movement.

Last time, this race was awesome! The weather was hot for sure, but it was something that NHRA actually took notice of.

One thing that needs to change I believe is the attitude of some racers that went to the last one or didn't go and still had nothing to say that was positive about the organizers.

Understand that if a person or persons do this, we need to support them. We need also to understand that negativity will not help make improvements.
The internet is a great forum, but we need the comments to be above a well behaved 5 th grade level.
Constructive criticism is fine, but try to understand that no matter where and when a race is, it is hard to get there for some, it won't be perfect, but it can be one of the most exciting and enjoyable races that we have going.
It also can guide changes in NHRA. There are many good people at NHRA that love this kind of thing, but their superiors don't have a clue.
If they can point to successful formats that are well done, it is more likely that they would be willing to follow suit.
The contingency platform that NHRA currently has is so unflexible and riddled with cost for little return when it comes to the small to mid size business. I know that is our opportunity to help a race like this get some real fun class and event support.
If we work together, we can use this race to offer great opportunities to partner with interested parties at a level they can afford. We can offer tremendous advertising value when we partner with Ken Miele and Classracer.

This will take some participation from the many and not just the few.

Finally, we could consider breaking out the new cars into their own classes and let them race each other in a Non AHFS environment so the world will know which racers really are fast with this new iron and which ones hide behind the velvet curtain of half track passes and 70% throttle, etc. Let them really, and I mean REALLY race! That would be worth watching. In fact, if it could be done, I think anyone that complains about them or has been doing so, take a positive spin on it. We want them to go all out, rade each other with no ugly half track passes that are still waaay under. Well, step up and throw some cash into the pot for the class winners. Everybody seems to agree that they are very cool cars. Lets show some love for the new cars and support some FX classes! Face it, we all cannot afford the new stuff, but some of the best racersout there have them. I for one love a good heads up race! This format could really provide the racers and onlookers some real competitive heads up races there.
Maybe I had too much coffee this morning.

Jim

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Jim, if that's what happens when you drink too much coffee, then brew another pot.
I'll be there no matter where you have it, Michael. When you get to the point where you're starting to delegate tasks, count me in.

Re: Class Nationals event planning
 

Greg is right, Bowling Green is about as good as you are going to get. You have a ton of racers in that general area (250mile radius), and its not terribly far for lots of others.