Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

In all of these posts of new vs old performance, I have not seen one person mention AERODYMAMICS of the new vs old cars.
If new vs old engines and HP were all that mattered, then why are almost all of the SS/GT cars new body vehicles with mostly old engines ?????

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

I haven't heard TRACTION CONTROL mentioned either,to run dead on your dial.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Traction control does not make a car run dead-on. It is really only useful in heads-up categories as a stopgap measure to minimize E.T. losses due to spinning. All traction control does is take power away, not promote consistency. Traction control would have to be coupled with a much more complicated system of track position sensors, run database calculations and brake control beyond the application of traction control, among other things, that are not components of EFI controllers. There are years and years of discussion threads all throughout the internet dedicated to the Matty Box.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Oh,really.

Okay.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

On the subject of Matty boxes, traction control, etc, what happened to Top Fool that was posting on the site a few years ago and was going to present a car to NHRA and anyone else that was interested to show how electronic cheating was being done and undetectable. I've been sitting here waiting patiently for this no name guy to show us this new technology. Just joking...

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Don't think traction control would help an SS car.

(If you need that, go see East Texas Racecars LOL)

Years ago when everybody thought Greg Anderson had it, before the rest discovered turning those 500" engines 10,000 RPM.

A well knows group from south Texas worked at the track with the guys from MSD to investigate that. Best they could do was to NOT slow the car down. LOL Many Div 4 guys know the story. Nothing there.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

For those of you that think it doesn't mater, Keith Lynch won round 2&3 heads up against older cars in a drag PAC challenger. That's a combination that's had around 120 hp added to it over the past three years.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

He almost had another heads up in round 4. Just saying...

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Yes I seen that but I also see where in the 3rd round lynch was .032 on the tree and the other guy broke. Now, did he break cuz we was racing a drag pak? I doubt it, plus with lynch on the tree he would have been hard to beat anyways. Yes I know in the second he was like .100 on the tree but goes to show you that racing happens.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

If reaction times are related to HP factors, do I get HP added or taken off? I'm confused. :o

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Good comment, and to expand on that I'd still like to see NHRA/IHRA change the way the finish line is tripped so that ground effects of cars can no longer finish a run instead of the front tires of the car. Cars are staged by their front tires, and you can surely see how ground effects extend the nose of these newer cars far beyond the line that their front tire needs to get to to stage. However, it's the ground effects that can trip the beams at a finish line on newer cars (as opposed to the front tires only of an older car). Just like photo radar uses a sensor in the pavement on city streets to trip a camera (if someone crosses the line after the light changes), so should it be used to finish a race....thus one less advantage the newer cars have at the finish line.

I also feel NHRA can make the hp factor debate issue between older cars and newer ones an easy fix by bringing back the FI classes, thus reducing that advantage as well over older cars. My .02 worth

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Michael, now come on sir! All I was saying was new car or old car, on that paticular run (round 3) lynch would have been hard to beat.

No matter what happens y'all will have something to say. Good day

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Joseph, I was helping Dwight Machael with his A/SA Hemi this week end. (raced Lynch in 2nd round) We had him .07 on the tree, we went 82 under, and got passed at the first MPH light....Lynch was on the brakes.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Guys I'm not saying that the "new" cars are not fast. I agree the new cars are faster but until we have a place to play we have to play where we can.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Greg, that Challenger wouldn't beat Sorensen's 69 Camaro. I'd bet my life on it! Not worth much, but it's important to me. :-)

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

For what it is worth......we got the bracket we wanted. We knew that Tibor and Doug Lambeck were faster....Tibor went out in the 3rd rd, I think....(we would have had him in the 4th round.....Doug went went out in the first. We just didn't know about Lynch's car. I could not find any history of his car, so we just didn't know......according to qualifying, we were OK......but like everyone else, things are held back, us included. We thought that we could have 3 heads up rounds before getting to Tibor, and based on qualifying, we would have been OK. We put everything we had into the Hemi and it still wasn't good enough for Lynch. So, Good for Keith...he did what he had to do. We wanted a 20-35 light figuring if qualifying times were close, we were OK....because we knew we would pick up...If Keith was "holding a bunch", a couple of hun would not make much difference.....Dwight had a 30 lite and drove perfectly....It just wasn't meant to be.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Sean, those are some pretty high stakes, my friend. I know that car has been running in Super Stock recently, with success. Do you believe that he is faster that DeArmond in stock form?

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Do you think they could stay up with this stocker.1 7083 SS/DA Andrew Durham, Upland CA, '11 Challenger 9.177 10.20 -1.023. Last year Pomona 63 6633 SS/EA Joe Sorensen, Woodburn OR, '69 Camaro 10.148 10.35 -0.202

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

I guess my point is that the Challenger can out run two pretty good cars easily and has had 120 hp added to it.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

No, but that "stocker" is running Super stock. I'm sure it's still legal for stock.....but not a fair comparison, since we all don't know.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

I don't believe the Sorensens have made a pass in A/SA for quite some time. Come to think about it, when was the last time they raced at a nhra race? I really like what they have done over the years in A/SA and B/SA. But they never saw the day that they could win a heads up race against a fresh Drag Pak, much less Calvert in the 428 cj. There is only one older Camaro out there that can give these new cars a run for their money and it has been worked on for many years and gobs of money have been thrown at it.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Wait a minute. Are you now saying that if you buy the right parts and work hard enough there is a chance that older cars can run with the new stuff?

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Lol Gump I'm sure that not what Bruce is meaning! Lmao! Talk about open mouth insert foot!

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

You guys are begging now. Lol. One car out of two thousand that is an anomaly does not mean that it is available to others.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

We are not begging sir, you threw the info out there.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Of course you are sir. You are looking for any liitle hook to avoid the truth. The info I provided is on drag race central and is the truth. The old car guys are not adverse to the truth like, say, some of the new car guys who can't admit they are abusing their fellow racers. I know that fair competition is a hard concept for you guys to comprehend.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

I don't see how anybody can fault a guy from buying & building one. The problem is the hp factor. They didn't set the hp factor. Hate the bogus hp factor, not the guy that owns one. I have friends with new cars. I love those cars. Would not love having to race one heads up.

If I had back the money I've spent on mine, I would have a new car. I'm not going to spend my retirement money on one.

If I had one I hope I would be honest about why it was fast. Hopefully not act like it was fast because I'm such a wizard. LOL

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Sorry Bruce. I was just having a little fun.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

I would have liked a Lynch vs Kador race. That would have been more telling than the other two runs mentioned above.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Gump, Bruce doesn't know how to have a little fun. He's the ultimate "Fact" machine! If anyone needs facts just ask Bruce Bruce!!

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

One comment: when was the last time a Max Wedge won A/SA at a Nationals?


JimR

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Gump, you have ruined Joseph's day. He was all wound up cuz he thought you had found a plum for him to pummel. Lol again!

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

An even better question is when's the last time a Max set a record. At one time the Max's, Camaros and Fairlanes were pretty close but the faster they go as technology advances the more the big Plymouths and Dodges are at a disadvantage due to aerodynamics, something that should be taken into consideration but is not.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Good thinking but sorry my day was fabulous. Bruce if you really think that someone would waste any energy getting wound up about you, sir you are sadly mistaken. I really don't believe that anyone would lose sleep over something you say. Hope to see you in A/SA one day at the track.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Temper, Temper Joseph. Just relax. I'm sure your daddy can find a A/SA for you to race.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

No temper here. Just laughs. I'm a little upset with myself that I actually went on this long with you but I like to laugh so reading you post make my day. And yea your right my daddy already has me a A/SA. Oh and he has a CC/SA, BB/SA, and just about anything else I want. Oh yea that's true the cars are my brothers and I's but if you would would like to dive one I'm sure my daddy would let you. Lol Are you missing your daddy Bruce? I'll share my daddy with you!
Hope to see you in the other lane! ;)

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

No Joseph, I don't miss my daddy but must say that I thoroughly enjoy the Teuton plot lines. They are so much fun. I'm glad you have lots and lots of toys. Many of us thought you had lots and lots of toys. You probably won't "see me in the other lane" but I'm sure I will see ya at the races.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

unsure of A/SA, but Pomona 2 2009 was darn cool to see in AA/SA.

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Joe my dad is a dick and doesn't have anything for me to drive. Gotta drive my own and can't afford it. Can I please become an honorary Teuton?

Re: Old vs New during rounds
 

Treekiller I'm sure with the proper donation of cold beverages I'm sure anything is possible. Lol