Re: NHRA regulates off track behavior.........
 

I`ve known people that were able to race without a state driver`s license but were able to compete due to a current NHRA Competition license. Not making that up.

Re: NHRA regulates off track behavior.........
 

I've read this thread and most of you guys are totally off base. These actions and letters are not about you or controlling you. They are a statement of NHRA's position in this matter. First read Dwights posts. They are correct. Here's why. The most valuable asset NHRA has is their non profit designation. That was issued by the IRS because of their declaration of purpose... To educate people about automotive/vehicle safety. Any threat to that standing is a threat to NHRA's existence, at least as we know it. As a result they cannot and will not be associated (in any way shape or form) with high risk, illegal street racing. They can, must and will distant themselves from any illegal activity (especially street racing) and anyone associated with it. Someday something very unpleasant will come out of SO. When it does the attorneys will go after everyone, especially those with deep pockets. (NHRA) Their current actions are a legal issue and not directed at you as a racer. They can't afford to be remotely associated with street racing or anyone who participates.

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Not just semantics. The "right" means you are allowed to own the gun, which is not true in many countries. The privilege is the regulation of your behavior as a gun owner. Behavior is rarely a right.

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Everyone will have their opinion on this, but let us not forget that NHRA was founded by Wally Parks in an effort to get people to stop racing on the streets and in a safe and organized way.

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California Supreme Court? Real world....keep repeating that.....Real w o r l d.....

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You know I have always had a problem with that wordage.

Driving is not a privilege, it is my right as a citizen of the USA to obtain a driver license.
Now if I miss use that right it can be taken away.

Just like walking down the street or going from state to state is not a privilege, It is my Right as a citizen of the USA.

Yes there are rules and laws to follow, and if I break them you can have these right also taken away. Put in jail, pay big fines ECT ECT ...

But these are our rights as citizen of this GREAT country.

OK I'm done running my mouth now, just had to get that off my chest

Cal
S/ST HR 1177

Dwight while I agree to disagree on our rights as citizens of the USA.
What we both have said is simular, just written differently.
I doubt I would ever have the money or disire to dispute this in a court of law.
But maybe someone should, before we lose any rights we may have left.

I am not say in my statement anywhere that I agree with or dis agree with the Street Outlaws. In the late 70 early 80s I attened my share of street races, it is what we did back then.

But I mostly bracket raced back then. My License was to important to me, I needed to make a living and driving was important.

I only stated my opinion on privledge vs Rights of citizen of this USA.
Do we have any left, or are they all gone?

I still beleive Driving is a Right, if you read my post I did state that if you miss used that right it could be taken away. Guess I left out the part about you need to pass a test to get your license, which I agre with.

It is only my opinion, and i am intitled to my opinion.
I think.

Just like it is the right of a illegile imagrint to get a license.

It is my privledge to get one, What has America come to?

O yea I do watch Street Outlaws, I find it entertaining but know it is all staged.
That particular type of racing never was my cup of tea.

I do watch the outlaw grudge racing at the track but have no interest in that type of racing. Just like I watch TF, FC & Pro Stock but would never want to run any of them classes.

Thanks again
Cal
S/ST HR 1177

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If street outlaws doesn't represent what NHRA believes in then they should by all means ask that they remove all signage or any reference to NHRA from the show but that is not what they did. They are threatening if they are associated with the show their membership could or would be suspended.

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You don't know that they didn't. We would not be privy to that communication.

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The letters are posted all over the Internet.

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Does anybody believe they actually "race" on a regular street??

Do you not notice all the lights and lack of street traffic?

The Police actually shut down the streets and bring in EMT/Fire personal, don't allow any outsiders to watch the proceedings (unless from a distance). Discovery Channel pays big bucks to the Cities to close some out of the way street in a business park so they can film this deal.

Did I not mention the $$$$$$ deal.

Hey people, wake up, this is a "Reality Show? You know, "entertainment"!!

What NHRA did was not based on a threat to cancel somebodies membership number, it has to do with getting a piece of the pie.....

Would not surprise me if in the next few weeks you see NHRA advertising the SO Gang being at some NHRA Event.

Follow the money.

NHRA needs a ton of money to keep the doors open. SO's is making a killing and NHRA is trying to cash in. You really can't blame them for it.

Ought to be some interesting reading in the next few weeks.

RJ

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Ive known 2 of the racers on SO since they came to Speedworld and raced in the original Pinks shows. As of today ive watched every SO show and I couldnt tell you the car numbers. Im pretty confident that dui and domestic violence have fair more deaths then a scripted show about ILLEGAL street racing.
Tracks have invited these bad influence racers and they are packed. Kids ask for autographs and buy tshirts. This is a fact.

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Some may remember me making the suggestion of putting on a class car "PINKS All Out" kind of program after my participation experience, actually discussed with Rich Christiansen (who, by the way was very interested) several times only to get shot down by the majority. Now that this debacle has opened a can of worms, Mike Beard is correct in that NHRA continues to sit on their hands until something like this happens, forcing them to respond this way. Although I disagree with a lot of decisions out of Glendora, I have to side with them on this, especially when a racer is foolish enough to leave his number and NHRA decals on his car. But it has also set a precedence in their (lack) of marketing the sportsman guys. And now with Steve Earwood teaming with Rich C and Brian Bossone resurrecting the PINKS brand, S and SS, not just NHRA, are missing out on a golden opportunity.

Sorry to be a bit off topic a bit, but had to add my $.02

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The only thing worthy in “Street Outlaws” is the Farm Truck.



You gotta love the Farm Truck, and of course, Louise.

Re: NHRA regulates off track behavior.........
 

This post may sound like it is off the point of this thread, but I want to do what I can to communicate the underlying points that I see are important.

First, all the talk about the Outlaws program being staged is not relavent. It doesn't matter if the events are staged, actual or cartoons, the legality of the activity being portrayed is not a question for any jurisdiction in the country as far as I know; auto racing on public streets is illegal, period. The fact that a media entertainment company can produce such programs is common. Heck, there is even a staged reality show about bootlegging and that is way over the top of any kind of illegal racing activity because it steps into federal jurisdiction, not just local or state. So, knowing that the racing activity is staged as entertainment is no more relavent to this discussion than saying that I portrayed a serial murderer in our community theater so I must be a murderer.

Secondly, the title of this thread mixes the issues. NHRA is not regulating anyone's behavior or even attempting to. NHRA has no authority to do that. Those guys can continue to play their roles on that TV program all they want. They can even participate in actual street racing as it is portrayed on that program if they want. But, they will then be subject to consequences imposed by organizations who do have authority to regulate their behavior. NHRA just does not want to be identified with people who do that.

Thirdly, NHRA does have the right to protect their purpose and reputation and that is what they are trying to do. In fact, a good argument could be made that they could be in legal trouble if they don't. Their organizational charter stipulates that one of their primary purposes is to provide a venue for drag racing in a legal, safe and controlled environment. If they stand by and allow members of their organization to do the exact opposite, then it can become a legal question whether NHRA is a purposeful organization or not.

Fourthly, all the talk about the jealousy of NHRA or the greediness of NHRA or the stupidity of NHRA is just distractions. We can all get emotionally charged when we form opinions concerning the intention behind people's actions, but the truth is that intentions seldom can be reduced to a single cause. Besides, if NHRA's purposes behind what they are doing in this case are just business related, they would not be addressing the racers.

Fifthly, do not put me on one side or the other of the "us against them" mentality. I am for protecting rights, both individuals and organizations. The "culture currents" that rule media and communications today seem to have blurred the lines (for their own benefit) between inalienable rights and protected behavior. As I said before, behavior is rarely a right. We have rights to "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" within the framework of law that regulates the behavior we choose to exert those rights. When our behavior while exerting our rights steps on someone else's rights, then the law is the mediator. NHRA has the right to protect their organization. Those outlaws have the right to do their TV program. NHRA is seeing this program portraying NHRA and street racing as the same and that is their objection. Think of a member of PETA participating in a TV program about trophy buck hunting.

Maybe I have just muddied the waters more or stirred them again.

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I'd say you nailed it Dwight. NHRA is completely in the right here. I pay a membership due, and I don't want to be associated with street racing at all. PERIOD. It's ignorant, irresponsible and down right disrespectful to your community. It is on the same lines as gangster rap. It encourages fools to break the law by glamorizing it.

This might be a little harsh... but the best thing that could have happened to the main star (Paul Walker) of all the fast and furious movies, is that he die, as a passenger, in a car speeding over twice the speed limit (93 in a 45). It brought a reality check to all the fools who were inspired by those movies. He got exactly what he was asking for, and hopefully saved a few kids lives by waking them up. Innocent people die in street racing. You're acting like an idiot if you do it.

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wow Hagen that,s pretty rough. I don't think anyone should die for street racing, not saying its rite, but I will bet some where most of have done the same. NHRA likely want there share of the cut. They maybe should worry about their racing than whats happend on the tv.

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I believe you are incorrect. NHRA wants nothing to do with the show. and I applaud them for that. NHRA was created to keep racing off the street, and they need to uphold that standard. Flying NHRA decals, numbers and class designation (T/S of coarse) while street racing on national tv (fake or real, doesn't matter) is detrimental to there brand. end of story.

The way I see it. Paul Walker dying saved more people from dying. It saved at least 1 family being plowed into at 100+ MPH. It brought a wakeup call to people who thought street racing was cool, by killing one of their idols. He made like 7 movies in that series. It was pretty much his whole acting career. He glamorized it, and then got to experience first hand what multiple people did that were inspired by him. end of story.

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I saw a post today from a track that is working on establishing a program specifically directed to street racers to get them on the race track instead of the street... which one would think is the goal.

While it obviously was not their intention, the sanctioning body has unwittingly turned more people toward street racing than against it. How do you get street racers off the street and onto a sanctioned dragstrip if you ban them from that dragstrip?

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Should know better than getting into a pissing match with Hagen, but its 5 degrees and I'm bored....so we should paint with a broad brush all the movie car chase movies and actors? Newman in Bullitt, Hackman in French Connection, etc....I guess moviegoers are pavlov's dogs, panting to hit the streets and emulate screen scenes? Beyond harsh to make a questionable point

hit send? yes
hit send no?
hit send.......

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Heard there is a new Drag racing show that starts filming in Texas next month called House of Grudge.Ken from Pass Time,and Mike Merillo are on it.It does take place on a real Drag Strip.

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The next thing NHRA will want to do is Run the Buggy Races on Amish Mafia!

Re: NHRA regulates off track behavior.........
 

R J and Jeff you get it.
This show is actually getting young men and women talking about cars again. Some will now hear on the radio about the events that have always been advertised and now visit whether being NHRA, IHRA, PDRA, etc....
It's not easy to get people off their butts and out of the house. Might even race a test n tune now they are looking things up thru google, yahoo etc.
It's a reality show, with cars you and I all recognize. And on when families can watch togerther. I bet many dads had cars in their youth and can now tell their kids and maybe even get involved in this slowly fading motorsport.
I like the idea of advertising on Mondays by NHRA, but they missed the idea, maybe rethink this.
ps, as said previously, tracks are hiring the SO's and packing them in for appearances. Best news I've heard in a long time as all we hear are closings lately.
NHRA, I hope you get some motorheads at the helm and come up w a game plan to help our sport, not split it up.

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HAHA, come on Randall, its not too harsh. I've seen first hand on my CT scanner what street racing does to people.... multiple times. That's why I feel so strongly about it. I've bet you've never seen a 16 y/o girl die while you're trying to save her because her boyfriend thought he was Paul Walker. When you see that, come talk to me about how street racing isn't that big of a deal.

Paul Walker made a living off of glamorizing street racing. Millions off of it. He was the main actor in 7 films that were all about street racing. NOTHING MORE... it wasn't 1 single movie. He bred street racing and died doing it. He got exactly what he was asking for. You race on the street, you're an idiot with zero respect for society. You glamorize it, I want nothing to do with you, and NHRA sees it that way too. I don't want my racetrack filled with a bunch of criminals.

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NHRA definitely had every right to do what they did. But it appears to have blown up in their face in a very bad way. What it's done it created a firestorm of hatred from the shows fans towards NHRA, the same fans NHRA needs to watch their shows, attend their races. The internet blew up from this yesterday. The show, which already has 2 to 2-1/2 million viewers a week, will probably now have their best rated show ever this coming week. I think the fans better relate to the drivers and cars of the show than the pros of NHRA. It's a WWE version of racing.

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You know all that fine print that you are supposed to read before you sign anything? The OKC boys should have read it a little better on their NHRA applications.

Yes, they were on Sweitzer Road right outside RT66. I have heard that the people at RT66 were none too happy about it either. They were racing there because the OKC boys spent all day Friday arguing about racing on Doty Road where they were originally permitted for. They raced on Sweitzer on Halloween night 2013. Yes, since Dave lost it was almost 1-1/2 years until the episode aired. What you saw was highly edited too.

Anyway, the NHRA is completely within their rights to draw a line in the sand here. It may not be the best way to handle it, but it is legal. The OKC boys will not be the first or last ones to lose their privileges because of off track behavior. They just won't be able to run at any NHRA tracks.

Funny, I would think that as much as they rag on "track racers" they wouldn't have comp licenses anyway. LOL!

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When I was 17 we all street raced on a road that led to a manufacturing plant. Of course we got arrested, we were all charged with aiding and abetting an illegal race not a moving violation but a misdemeanor.

Long story short. One of the kids brought in a lawyer and he proved that it was a PRIVATE road and the State had no authority there unless the owner complained...we were all let go.

SO race on a private road which seems to be on an airport! With the owners permission and a bunch of paperwork I'm sure. Whether you like these guys or not the only people in danger are themselves.

I can understand the NHRA's position and the answer is simple....cover up your number when you race!

I wonder how many of us started street racing with our street car before moving to legal racing. Hell, I'm still the first one across the street at a red light.

JimR

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In my opinion NASCAR has created more dangerous driving as viewers watch door-handle-to-door-handle drafting inches apart,drafting and squeezing into line...and then bad crashes where drivers walk away

I see it every day in commuting as "me first" amatuers race ahead and squeeze into line

Remember '60's drivers ed classes, 1 car length for every 10 MPH....if you did that today you might as well backup to your starting location

NASCAR wanna bees in Kia's and Hondas can't wait to get ahead in traffic and usually you wind up side by side at the next light

There's plenty of blame to go around: race car emulating, lack of courtesy "safer cars" makes everyone think they can walk away, or they just ain't thinking

Like the saying goes, it ain't the speed that kills, it's the sudden stop

Geez, I need to go to the races....and soon

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All of u that want to put the show down; n not want to be associated with it, well apparently a lot of manufactures don't feel the same way. there is no shortage of parts being seen on the show n on the backs of the SO members. So it seems that they must not agree with u or NHRA on the subject or they wouldn't have their names associated with them or the show. I enjoy it the show for what it is entertainment.

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You don't happen to have the letter NHRA sent to the producers of Fast and Furious?

I understand NHRA not wanting to be associated with the show. Maybe they could of wrote the letter stating so and to please remove any decals or window numbers relating to NHRA. This would have kept them out of lawsuit way and not pee everyone off.

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You got this RIGHT.....Thanks Dwight !!

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How can you compare PINKS with STREET RACING ???
There is no compasrison.......

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Is Don Prudhomme out? He was in a street race on the "Americarna" show with Ray Evernham as passenger. P.S. who else thinks reality shows are real?

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Good point

Re: NHRA regulates off track behavior.........
 

I highly doubt much of the viewing audience for SO would know what a competition number is and I also doubt that any of those cars had a NHRA class designation on them. As far as using your name goes, I am not too sure that NHRA can control that. The section of the rule book that is quoted in the letter that is going around really makes me wonder how it applies to the show. While I agree NHRA can threaten and defend all they want and a NHRA license is a privilege, the terms participant and event that are mentioned in the letter and section 1.3.1 of the rule book are clearly defined in section 1.1 of the rule book and I struggle to see how it applies to a reality TV show and the guys involved in it. Now I am quite sure that it pi$$es NHRA off that they get more viewers on a Monday night than the event coverage gets on Sunday night (or Monday morning) but I am not sure this is the way to help that situation by threatening a bunch of guys that are pulling in more views and interest than they can generate.

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This in good humor. Don't shoot the messenger

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NHRA isn't "regulating off track behavior" here. They hold the keys to the starting line and are reasonably careful as to who they hand them to. You can't race without a valid drivers license and street racing would cause that to go away.

The only way NHRA could know you street race is if you got caught, in which case you would have no license and couldn't race anyway. As for being seen on Street Outlaws, I don't really know about that. NHRA would have to admit to watching this show that they condemn. Tough position to defend.

You can do what you want off track, but if you get caught you have more to worry about than going rounds on Sunday.

As for Fast and Furious, Kent had a blow up of street racing when the first film came out. The Washington State Patrol, Kent Police and Pacific Raceway staff worked to urge these kids to take it to the track. The track now has regular High School Drags and a lot of imports show up for T&T. Bremerton runs the Street Legal Drags series as well as HS Drags.

The type of street racing depicted in the films is considerably more dangerous than street drags. I grew up in Ohio near Detroit Dragway and Milan. There were more than a few remote country roads with marked off 1/4 miles on them.

Dale

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This thread is being monitored and all 'HATERS' will be dealt with!! E

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Here's something for the folks having trouble understanding the issue.

From the first sentence in the "About" statement on the NHRA website. I quote: "When Wally Parks founded the NHRA in 1951, he worked to get racing off the city streets and highways and into safer, organized venues."

Again, that's the first sentence.

So.

1. NHRA is a club founded for a reason.
2. The club has rules.
3. As a member of the club, you are required to follow the rules.
4. Break the rules, lose your membership.

It really is that simple.

You can rant all you want about how stupid, evil, money grubbing, whatever, the NHRA is, but in this case the only thing that they've done is act responsibly. Like a parent to a child. They have enforced an important rule, regardless of what anyone thinks.

But, it's not just a rule. It is the basis of their Mission Statement.

Do some of you honestly expect NHRA to come out and say that Wally Parks had it all wrong, and street racing is actually the right thing to do?

No. They took a stand against something that is not only illegal, but totally contrary to their guiding principles.

In this day and age where anything goes, where there are no rules or boundaries left to be bent or broken, NHRA did the right thing.

They deserve credit not scorn.

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I agree with what your saying here. But why did they start and stop with letters to the SO participants? The letter your quoted with the first line from Wally Parks is only part of the rule. What about section 1, 2, 3 in regards to conduct? If you feel NHRA is going in the right direction then why stop with SO members? What about any NHRA license holder that has a DUI, Domestic Violence, rapist, child porn? Should NHRA right letters and threaten these folks? According to the rule and the way its written these people should receive letters also. You pick and chose the ones you want to punish. If your going by the letter of the rule then go by it not when it fits your cause.