Re: Horsepowers
 

"2015 Dodge Drag Pak 392 400/400 was a typo and should have been 392 430/430)"

Now rated the same as the 2015 copo 427

hmmmm?

Re: Horsepowers
 

Looks like a lot of folks wrote letters to no avail....perhaps they need a little "Kentucky Windage"? LOL, just kidding big guy.


http://www.nhraracer.com/content/gen...566&zoneid=132

Re: Horsepowers
 

Who proof-reads this stuff?

Under "Stock Horsepower Changes.", they have "'74-'76 Volare." 1976 was the first model year!

Under "No Changes" they have a Stock 1974 Duster listed as OEM HP @ 305 and NHRA @ 245. They actually put up an astrick with: "
* = no such combination listed in the class guide." when it's obvious that the #'s were simply switched!
__________________________________________________

Are there any examples of a different HP factor for the same engine between a 2 door and station wagon of the same model? (i.e: Aspen/Volare, Malibu, etc.)

Under "Super Stock Horsepower No Changes" does the '74 360 Dart have 9 HP over a 1974 360 Duster because of a hood scoop option?

Re: Horsepowers
 

Myron I would be willing to bet the person writing the stuff couldn't tell the difference between a Duster and a Camaro.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Jim owns up to it.....

Re: Horsepowers
 

so we didnt get 7 off?

Re: Horsepowers
 

Welcome to the NHRA Myron! You're gunna drive yourself crazy! Jim

.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Mopar 360 220-245 305 301 74-76 Volare

There actually is no such combo, period! There are no 360's factory rated at 220 or 245hp. The previous hp on the '76 360's were 160 & 175. The NHRA hp previously on the 160/175hp 360 was 284. According to the new rating, NHRA says the previous hp was 305 and they have lowered it to 301 from 305!!!! Nope! Totally bogus!
When they stopped production of the Duster and Dart after '75, the '76 Aspen and Volare' were born. It is a different platform totally. A body to an F body.

Following what I am guessing they were trying to do is make the '76 160/175 360, 280hp from 284. The '76 360 until now was rated at 284hp not 305. Only thing I can think of is that they got the new gen Drag Pak 360 at 275hp and later changed to 305hp confused with the old carbureted 360. But who really knows?

A clarification is needed..... soon! Jim

Re: Horsepowers
 

Mopar 360 245 305 1974 Challenger
Mopar 360 305 245* 1974 Duster
* = no such combination listed in the class guide.


Mopar 360 220-245 305 301 74-76 Volare
This combo is not in the guide either!

Obviously whomever wrote this has zero common sense and drives a Prius! Jim

.

Re: Horsepowers
 

There is a 220/305 360 in a 1976 Volare. I have run that combo in my Volare before.
It is in the classification guide.

Re: Horsepowers
 

The 2014/2015 COPO 427/430 is rated at 465hp.

Re: Horsepowers
 

The 396 Chev and the 392 Mopar are about the same. We just didn't get to earn our way to 430, we just got it. The Bow Tie started life @ 390 and is now 429 I think, and we birthed at 400 and rebirthed at 430. None made as of yet.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Under Stock eliminator no changes is listed:
Mopar 340 240 299 1972 Barracuda

Yet they show a increase to the same combo. The increase is for you only Jim!!!
Jeff Ross

Re: Horsepowers
 

I see it now. Big cam. That's all. Jim



.

Re: Horsepowers
 

My 13 year old daughter running JR dragster can understand this one...

Guy in MN has been running same combo for 30+ years in bad air. Since he got hit to 299, he repeatedly gets his *** kicked heads up by the same engine in an A-body platform rated at 293.

He scribes letter to the mothership asking to be put back to normal so he has a shot.

Another dude on the good air side of our world let it eat a few too many times during qualifying. Hopefully he earned a lot of byes / round wins thru his efforts to validate the HP increase.

Last I looked, there are around 3 of these cars left racing. One of the most beautiful body styles around, but they are getting less competitive every time HP comes out. I know of one I'd be surprised to see running Stock next year☹️

Re: Horsepowers
 

Doesn't look like I'm getting any Christmas cards this year!! 😎

Re: Horsepowers
 

Maybe a lump of coal in your stocking!

Re: Horsepowers
 

It's ok, I'm not the first....

Just wait till this Duster rolls out of this shop. Then I can play with the big boys

Re: Horsepowers
 

Cool. What will you gauge your progress? Round Wins or Qualifying?

I personally like round wins.

Re: Horsepowers
 

I want in....sounds fun destroying a combo!

Re: Horsepowers
 

I'm not a mathametician, but 150lbs+ on another car with the same engine usually isn't an advantage...

Merry Xmas

Re: Horsepowers
 

From what I hear, it's not the same engine!

Merry Xmas!

Re: Horsepowers
 

Awesome. I'll be sure to let everyone else with the other low compression 340 engines know for our cars.

We will stand by for a new factor from NHRA....

Merry Xmas!

Re: Horsepowers
 

Lol.....I don't have a dog in the fight. It's just comical to me that fellow combo runners can't get along with themselves.

Happy New Year!

Re: Horsepowers
 

Agree

Mr. Storms,

As a 12 year old, I watched my Dad (Brown Sugar) lose to Harvey Emmons heads up in Brainerd at the NHRA National Finals at BIR in 1987.

Dad was on a roll that day, but we knew he hit the buzz saw when Harvey won the semi's. I think we lost by less than a tenth in the final...

He could have used a few less factored HP that day...

Re: Horsepowers
 

I am the one James is referring to, I have been campaigning my 73 'Cuda for 35 years in stock eliminator. Every time someone causes it to be hit with HP it only makes the value of the car and the combination go down. I do not plan on racing stock in 2016, so Mr. Storms can either continue driving this combo into extinction or he can spend the next few years trying to lower the HP. He will most likely be the only stocker left in the country with this combo so all of his runs will be the class average. It will be interesting to see if he understands now the HP factoring works or will he blindly keep going fast to appease some other short comings he is trying to overcome. I will look into super stock as an option but being retired my financial resources are limited. I am truly sad that 'Cuda's are rarely seen at races anymore and I always have fans tell be how much they like seeing my car.


Dale Findell
formally F/SA, maybe now SS/KA

Re: Horsepowers
 

Dale. I get where your coming from believe me, when spend a certain amount of dollars on what I do to my car, I'm not going to sit back every year and hang low. Sometimes it's nice to see how hard work and determination pays off.

Sometimes you have to let them fly and that's the bottom line, I'm not the only one who ran over 85 under here!! No disrespect to you at all, your son think may think different and that's his opinion, and frankly I'm tired of playing the game of being safe.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Exactly....

if the class was run off national records they all would be running them out the back

Re: Horsepowers
 

How competitive do you need this combo to be? (facetious question)The combo has been so under-factored that it can keep getting horsepower. You're not going to find much sympathy complaining to the folks trying to catch up to this combo.

Re: Horsepowers
 

In all due respects, Jim is a good guy & a hard worker, had the pleasure of meeting him at Indy several years ago. When running a combo (that has only a few cars in the country running that combo) in such a competitive class (G/SA) it is sometimes very difficult to protect your combo in a performance based class, especially if you are running for class honors. In doing so, when there is no one else to help lower your average, & you don't go to that many races. Not trying to take anything away from Jim or make excuses, but here are the numbers for him from Indy. I am sure he did not come all this way to sandbag. He & his combo are up against pretty tough odds. I would think this combo is a little over factored or there would be much more of them out there.

G/SA 5018 Corey Hopkins, North Branch MN, '69 Dart 10.941 12.00 -1.059
G/SA 4689 Paula Cotten, Cave Creek AZ, '73 Duster 11.025 12.00 -0.975
G/SA 1614 Barry Parker, Southwick MA, '74 Corvette 11.027 12.00 -0.973
G/SA 154 Anthony Fetch, Colonia NJ, '69 Camaro 11.030 12.00 -0.970
G/SA 3428 Tom Rambo, Washington C.H. OH, '68 Camaro 11.072 12.00 -0.928
G/SA 6340 Jim Storms, Renton WA, '72 Barracuda 11.096 12.00 -0.904
G/SA 4041 Verne Buchanan, Conway AR, '73 Mustang 11.112 12.00 -0.888
G/SA 1290 James Perrone, Shirley NY, '69 Camaro 11.114 12.00 -0.886
G/SA 49 Jimmy Hidalgo, Donaldsonville LA, '91 Corvette 11.143 12.00 -0.857
G/SA 1058 James Daniels, Yardley PA, '85 Camaro 11.160 12.00 -0.840
G/SA 2035 Mike Welfel, Nashville TN, '69 Camaro 11.184 12.00 -0.816
G/SA 1028 Mathieu Beriault, Richeliea PQ, '69 Nova 11.224 12.00 -0.776
G/SA 1231 Kelly MacKay, Mineville NS, '72 Demon 11.321 12.00 -0.679

104 6340 G/SA Jim Storms, Renton WA, '72 Barracuda 11.071 12.00 -0.929


1st round
Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
6340 Jim Storms 5018 Corey Hopkins
E1 0.045 11.046 117.38 ****WINNER**** 0.071 10.958 115.94
G/SA Dial: 12.00 (+/-): -0.954 G/SA Dial: 12.00 (+/-): -1.042
Qualified: #104 11.071 -0.929 #40 10.941 -1.059

Heads-up!
Corey Hopkins' MOV: 0.0625 seconds (approximately 11 feet).

Re: Horsepowers
 

Mr Findell you should be thanking Storms for only getting 4hp that car is fast and can get even more put on it. We try and talk him into going #1 at ever race. That car has been sandbagging just to run 90 under. When we were at Indy that was the first time running in weather like that, a lot was learned and should be faster the next time he goes to Indy. I don't think the value of that car is going down because it got 4hp, it should go up for being fast. Put your car in the classifieds before it goes down in value. Looks like the duster needs some hp now.

Re: Horsepowers
 

The whole system is crap IMHO. I just spent a small fortune to build a car that could be competitive only to spend another year learning how to play a stupid game of sandbagging just to avoid this kind of peer scrutiny!

Re: Horsepowers
 

Automatic Help For Slugs ... been 10 years still the same
it cannot and will not ever work as long as WE can manipulate the system.

just a crutch for NHRA to blame thier inability to correctly factor cars on instead of thier incompetent employees.

captain...
sure that will come back to haunt me in teardown : )

merry christmas hope you got a tenth under the tree

Re: Horsepowers
 

The horsepower for the 64-65 chevelle should be 65 only as the two engines are different. The 64 has a small intake valve 520, and the 65 has a large intake 462. This an example of heads as there are other numbers available for both combinations. Not the first time that this mistake has been made.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Tony,

I'm sure you meant the '64 had small valve 520 heads.

Re: Horsepowers
 

NHRA did not respond to all requests as is normal

Re: Horsepowers
 

Doug were the request done in the right manner? Explain what you mean.

Re: Horsepowers
 

Do you mean they never contacted you? I asked for the 300 ford to be dropped from 190 (ridiculously high) to the factory 155hp and while I never received any directly from them, the next updates showed the 300 ford in the "no change" column.

Re: Horsepowers
 

I think it strictly depends on who you are. My friend, Charlie Malyuke (R.I.P.) built a 1966 Chevy II V-8 (L-79) car in about 1994 and I wrote NHRA to ask for some horsepower off that motor (it was rated at 350.) and never recieved any verification that they even got the letter, much less, any horsepower off the motor.

Charlie contracted terminal lymphoma in about 1995 and passed away shortly thereafter, having never gotten the car within several tenths of being competitive, despite some excellent motors and chassis-tuning. In the ensuing years since his death, the factored horsepower has dropped like a rock for that motor, ending up some 63 horsepower under the horsepower it carried when he ran the car.

SIXTY-THREE HORSEPOWER....And,they wouldn't even answer my letters with a reason of any kind, as to why the factored rating still stood at 350.

That kind of idiocy is what I no longer even have an NHRA membership...

Re: Horsepowers
 

How many people work on this subject at the NHRA Technical Department? Could it be that there is not enough people to handle reviewing the inequities in horsepower factors?