Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Yes, I have asked. As I have raced 4 cylinder cars in SS since the mid '80's, I had hoped that I had some 'cred' to get it done but no luck. Didn't get an answer, just no change and no response why.

Jim Caughlin
SS/ES 6019

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

How about .5 under, and be able to drive it to and from the strip using the cruise control and A/C? ;)

Would you mind me asking what you think it would take?

The F/SA index is 11.85. If that happened, then a decent converter and a lightweight set of brakes might be in order. I suspect that people smarter than me would still be able to make these cars comfortably run under.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Yep. I still have the e-mails.
1996 and newer with a 15 % reduction would be nice.

Doesn't seem like it will happen now so all the '96-'07 combos are stuck with what they are I suppose.
Just a hand full of the 1996-2007 production cars are running in Stock now so there are all those combos in the guide that will never be tried.

Too bad because there are so many really nice condition OBD II cars out there cheap

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Post # 27 is a prime example. Stock convertor, half shafts, stock intercooler.

3" o/r downpipe, tune, and NHRA spec fuel on the approved list.
You should be able to run index easy. You will need a fuel sampling valve in the car's fuel system and submit samples after a qualifying run. The roll bar and driveshaft loop are easy adds.

The tune is the key with that 2.3EB.
Those cars are soooo under rated and de-tuned from the factory because Ford has to deal with the habits of the driving public and also for warranty reasons.

If they released the cars with a better tune they would risk someone putting lousy 87 octane fuel in it and detonating the engine under warranty so there are safeguards built into the factory tune.

If that combo ever gets factored to G then it will need an SFI harmonic balancer

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Actually, I've seen that car from other angles, and I think it has a giant aftermarket intercooler.

But then again, he's running several tenths under the B/SA index in a street-driven car with air-conditioning. :)

I think all these new cars come with a Schrader valve test port on the fuel rail, don't they?

Yup...

I understand this well- I was a Ford factory-trained technician for many years.

Okay, well that sucks. I hope somebody makes an SFI 18.1 damper for it. And if not, I hope that weight can be added to run H or wherever you don't need one.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I think you will find that this engine does not have a damper of any kind on it.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I believe that it has a balancer on it. The picture on the Ford Performance website looks like a balancer.

https://performanceparts.ford.com/part/M-6007-23T

Roland

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I know the old 2.3 Turbo Ford ( Pinto based engine) does not use a damper. Not sure about the EB

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I think the factory intercooler will be fine.

I believe the 2.3EB uses direct injection at super high PSI numbers.
Might have to locate the sample valve in line between the tank and where it feeds into the high pressure direct injection pump.

It's not simple like the older efi cars

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Understood. My factory training is only current through 1990.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Yes, that's where we hooked up our pressure gauge and test valve. It helps if you have a jumper switch to the fuel pump relay, for a serious effort.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Actually they initially did have the service port on all the fuel injection systems, but about the time they went to a return-less system and even more so now that a lot of these engines are Direct Injection, there is no service port on the rail.

and yes to quote my original reply, I'm very interested in this combo, just don't want it to be destroyed before I can afford to try it..

I would love to get a group of us together to petition NHRA to change the V8 only rule for SS/GT. I can count the number of cars on one one (maybe it would take 2) hand that are being produced with a V8 these days. Would be nice if we could run those engines, I have talked to Don Kennedy about getting the rule changed as I know he was heavily involved in writing the SS/GT rulebook. He is on board and has attempted to make some calls, no luck getting who he wants on the phone yet but this was a very recent idea.. If there are more people out there interested, keep pushing them for change. It will take a group of us showing interest over just one guy.

Just some info on the engine at hand. There are some very big issues with this engine when you make a lot of power over stock. If someone is really wanting to run this combo I suggest doing your research before turning it up much. Block and Intercooler are the first 2 that come to mind, but I'm not an expert yet and have just dabbled in my research.

Brad

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I am familiar with Ecoboost / Duratec engines, I am not aware of any block strength issues. There are a couple of minor weak areas that need attention but very easy and inexpensive to fix. What do you know that I don't?

Regarding the damper, I guess one persons pulley is another man's damper. I have one of these in my shop and it looks like a pulley to me. That being said, the Ford 2.3 single OHC motor doesn't technically have a damper either. Mine does because I retrofitted an SBC unit to it but not the way it comes from the factory.

Jim Caughlin
SS 6019

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

What do you mean " not quite legal" what would keep this car from running stock.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

It better have the stock exhaust manifold as it is cast into the head, wonder how they check the exhaust cc's on this one for a teardown? Has anyone actually looked at this motor or is it just something they read about in Hot Dog magazine?

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Here is a picture of the exhaust side of the head.

Roland

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

These are the modifications listed in the video description:

Airaid Intake
Turbosmart Wastegate
3" Open Down Pipe
Wagner Tuning EVO II Intercooler
Methanol Injection Kit
UPR Products Dual Catch Cans
BMR Suspension upgrades
Viking Rear Shocks
Weld Racing wheels wrapped in 17" MT ET STREET R and Front Runners
VP Racing Fuels MS 109

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I'm not planning on setting any records or racing at Indy. I'd just like to comfortably run under the index. What are the odds that I'd be subjected to a tear-down?

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

here is the description for the head from the Ford Performance website.



Fits 2015-2018 Mustang EcoBoost engines
This is the production IEP (integrated exhaust port) cylinder head
Includes water jacket plugs and valve seals
Does not include valves, valve springs, retainers, valve locks or tappets.
Same cylinder head used in Brad Gusler's NMRA 1/4 mile record setting EcoBoost Mustang

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I'm not any further along than you are, but I'm finding that most reports of damaged engines relate to inadequate octane, poor fuel quality, using the wrong "tune" software, using generic "tune" software that is not a close enough match for a specific combination, and/or a defective/failed fuel pressure sensor on the low-pressure side of the fuel supply system under the hood.

Most of those failures look preventable to me.

That fuel pressure sensor will apparently cause the engine to lean out under boost. It can be monitored in real time, using an aftermarket hand-held "tuner". And Ford has an updated replacement part available.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

It just occured to me that the fuel pressure sensor I was mentioning, might be a convenient place to "T" into the low-pressure side of the fuel supply system for fuel sampling valve- the sensor just screws into a threaded hole in the top of the fuel rail.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Jim,
As mentioned my research has been minimum at best. My point is I've read about issues some have had and without having first hand knowledge, as you have, one should probably look into these potential issues prior to encountering them.

I have been told by at least 4 people, I've discussed this combo with, that the stock intercooler has heat soak issues that would prevent this combo from being a viable car outside of class. Looking in the rule book there is nothing stating you must run the stock intercooler so this seems to be a very easy fix, just run a bigger one...

I don't want to pretend to be any kind of expert.. I've never laid my hands on one of these engines. I just was passing info on that I have found as I too am interested in running this motor someday. If we can't get the SS/GT rules changed I'll have less to worry about in terms of limitations to my combo, most likely will never have this engine in a 2015 mustang if I do it.

Brad

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

If the sensor is in the fuel rail I have a hard time believing it is low pressure. Your going to have to find something before the HP pump. Just doing a quick google search it sounds like the is a low pressure sensor in the fuel lines coming from the tank just as they get into the engine bay. You could probably "T" it there.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Are you saying that I can run a larger aftermarket intercooler in Stock Eliminator?

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I may have misunderstood the location of the fuel pressure sensor for the low pressure fuel supply system.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Double post.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I see that VP's C10 100 octane unleaded is on the NHRA approved fuel list.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I6So i see 1 item definite. Methanol injection, and that can be a big one on boosted applications. If the airaid intake is before throttle body can just delete. I do think wastegates are allowed to be changed. The intercooler seams to need clarifying

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I'm saying the rulebook reads this:

INTERCOOLER
"Intercooler tanks must be located in the engine compartment"

I'm not sure how they could enforce a ruling of the intercooler having to remain the factory unit with this rule...

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

I believe this is meant for the supercharged CJ, Copo, and Drag Pak cars.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

That doesn't change the fact that the rule is written the way it is and says nothing about an intercooler remaining factory.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

^^ I would tend to agree.
It seems to relate to the air to water intercoolers..

6130 :

Might want to get clarification from NHRA on the ic rule if you want to step up to a larger than stock IC.
My gut feeling is that they will say it has to be stock.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Yeah, I would suspect the same.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Okay, Alan, let me bounce this off of you, regarding tires, wheels, and gearing.

The Ecoboost Mustang won't take anything smaller than 17" wheels over the stock front and rear brakes (18" in front, if it's a Performance Package car).

The 6R80 cars have 3.31 rear gears (Performance Package 6R80 cars get 3.55 rear gears). 4th gear in the 6R80 is 1.14, and the stock tires are 27" tall. Ford says the horsepower peak is at 5,500 rpm. 110 mph through the lights with 3.31 rear gears, a 1.14 4th gear, and a 27" tall rear tire, is just a little over 5,000 rpm (just about 5,500 rpm for Performance Package 6R80 cars).

I'd want to keep the front tires the same height as the rear, to avoid any problems with the ABS system (don't want to smoke the tires in the lights). I wouldn't want to go any shorter than the stock 27" tires, because I wouldn't want to lose any roll-out in the front. And I wouldn't want to go any taller than 27", because I wouldn't want to lose any torque multiplication or put the engine further from it's power peak through the lights, nor would I want to have to change out the ring & pinion to offset for taller tires.

NHRA says no more than 9" tread width in the rear, and no less than 4.5" in the front.

I'd like to avoid putting radials on one end and bias-ply on the other.

And if I was going to try to save the expense of a truck and trailer, I'd want the tires to be DOT-legal. That would also save me the trouble of having to change them at the track.

I don't think the wheels would need to be anything fancy- again, it looks like these cars will run under without a lot of work. For example, there are Race Star wheels available in 17x10" and 17x4.5" sizes.

What are your thoughts on tires and wheels for this purpose?

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Since that combo seems to have enough power to easily run the index, I would leave the stock front wheel/tire setup alone for now.
Just air them up to 40 psi at the track

Heck, I bet it might run the index with stock rear wheels and a drag radial

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

One thing we all know about the rule book is just because it doesn't say you can't doesn't mean you can lol. I would get clarification on anything before I spent any money on something, most of the time all it takes is an email to Pat C.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Call Larry Hodge Racing and he can help and answer all your tire and wheel questions.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

The closest I can find is DOT-legal drag radials made in a 275/45R17 size by M&H, Mickey Thompson, Nitto, Toyo, and Hoosier. But they're all 26" tall, which is 1" shorter than the stock tires.

But Hoosier lists the tread width of theirs as 9.2", which is over the 9" maximum width, so I don't think that particular tire would be legal.

M&H and Mickey Thompson make 26" tall DOT-legal radial front-runners for 17" wheels. And it looks like there are numerous street-type 205/55R17 (26" tall) tires available.

I can't find any DOT-legal drag tires for the OEM Performance Package 19" wheels that are not over 9" tread width.

And I haven't looked for 18" tires yet (some people with Performance Package cars run 17" wheels in the rear and 18" wheels in the front, to clear the larger front brakes).

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

" Tires may not exceed 10 inches wide regardless of wear".....that is from the 2018 rule book.

I was told one time by an NHRA tech (when asked how wide the tread can be..." 10 inches as measured"


FWIW: I bracket race a 2005 Mustang and my front tires are 28 inch and the rears are 27 inch.
I have not had the ABS light come on.

Re: 2015 Mustang Ecoboost K/SA?
 

Thank you, Alan. That does open up some other choices for the 17" wheels.

M&H makes a 275/50R17" Drag Radial (28" tall, 9.5" tread) and a 4.5/28R17 DOT-legal radial Front Runner.

Mickey Thompson makes a 28x11.5-17 LT ET Street R Bias (28.5" tall, 9.5" tread).

And still not seeing any rear tires that will work for the 19" wheels on the Performance Package, but as I pointed out earlier, 17" wheels will fit over the rear brakes of those cars. Not a big deal either way, as I think the non Performance Package car makes more sense.