Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

No, it should be as well as a couple other cars a SS and another Drag Pak spec car being built....Ill list them as "other" since they dont have a number to track against, but should be listed.

Thanks for the suggestion/question

Cheers

Chris

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Chris, #58 is here in PA in my area. .....I'll let the owner identify himself when he joins us on the forum.........You may not know him ,but he will be bringing a well known name in the Northeast with him!.......Car is a 6.1 will most likely compete in A/SA . ...............Tom

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Sounds good...

Have him give me a call anytime if he feels like it 330-808-8487, I keep owners quiet who want to be, I have over 10 more names that arent on the list that Ive been talking to...Im not going to piss on someones "thunder" of announcing and debuting the car, no fear there. But I also have some contact names/numbers of DP related things he may have use for.

Well know name ? Hell I dont even remeber my OWN half the time.

When you say "bringing" him, like as in the trunk ? No ...seriously is this person going to be wrenching, driving, hanging out ? Or HE has the "Name" ?

Cheers

Chris

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

No, not the trunk! ,,,Sounds like a limited partner type of thing. ...Not someone who's name is normally thought of with Mopars tho. .....Tom

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Doug may correct me if I am wrong, but his is not a factory-built DragPak. Instead of waiting for Chrysler and NHRA to get their stuff together, Doug built his own out of a standard Challenger. I believe his was the FIRST new Challenger in competition, had some nice ink in Mopar mags, National Dragster, and for his efforts his dealership was dropped by Chrysler...

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

No thats correct, but it IS "Drag Pak Spec" in as much as its only difference is well...he had to do a hell of a lot more work and research.

Thats why I was going to list it as "Other" since it dosent have a DP # but its still pretty much a DP, in my opinion, others may not think that way, but the Other category is the only place I can really put it since its not numbered. We originally were going to buy a second DP, but now, I think well take his route....we already have a Numbered car....for all that matters, but the goal for us wasnt something to mothball as a collector item it was something to run flat out.....we like the Dodges....

Having talked with Doug, and I need to again, he is super friendly, knowledgable and helpful fellow that took the hard road on these, doing things from bad photos, etc. Tom end up with a car that is MORE than Competitive, its something to fear. He took time to talk with me and give me and share much info with me that I wouldnt have gotten elsewhere. I like that, there are very few things I will keep seceret, I give 10 of my 11 Herbs and spices away, only 1 (whatever makes me competitive) will I keep to myself. Some people I have met keep everything to themselves, and thats 100% fine, I understand completley. But the fact that Doug shared on his own accord the info he did impresses me that much more.

He is a GREAT resource for Other DP Builders and Owners.....

Like I said, because of that press and ink , I can quite possibly see his car being worth as much as a real DP in the Future, and depending on his campaigning of the car, possibly more. Even though I dont and couldnt imagine he thought of the car as collectible, he just wanted one and rather than wait, he took it up on his own.....

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

I don't know who this is or what # car, but this moparts.com post shows a preview of what it will look like finished.

Is that a "75" on the window?

Les Norton?

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/...gonew=1#UNREAD

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Myron, saw that one myself and I don't know who is the proud owner but I do like the Rod Shop style......

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

I just picked up #65 monday .Bucky

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

How many DP owners know if their engines were even run before picking them up? Our's wasn't. #40 5.7. Also, anyone have dynosheets from Stanton for the 5.9, 5.7 and 6.1?

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

And I'll be having #064 picked up Monday

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

I don't think there are any dyno sheets. I have been led to believe that most 6.1's made 590 to 600, and I don't know about the 5.7, I suspect 30 or so less. Just the bore difference. 3.92 to 4.055. Everything else the same. The first 5.9 is in build now. I think some of the guys who are up and running have more, about 630-40 based on the slide rule. I don't think all motors are run. Mine wasn't #16. Nice piece. We got it apart.

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Stopped by MPR today......looked like a challenger car show....sorry I didn't ask who's they were.....

a couple were done and a couple just got there.....looks like we will see plenty of them on the track this year....

Mike does great job setting them up.......the chassis work was sweet....

Rock

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

His work is awesome....

Ive got an idea, certianly if I were him, after the coming year or so with all these coming out and into his hands if I ever saw another one I would start twitching and foaming at the mouth (ok so more than I already do)....

I wonder if hes had any "Challenger Nightmares" happens to me on almost every car build.....at least 1....

He gave me some numbers and names, I wrote em down but lost the paper....doh !

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Talked to them today Eric over there, before 50, not all were run, so youre not alone....odd thing is carbon on SOME electrodes (1 but not BOTH in the same cylinder), fingerprints on pistons and NO carbon in heads, 0, but fuel in the rails...... ?!?!?!

My suggestion TEAR YOUR ENGINE DOWN and Go through it UNLESS Stanton confirms that your engine was run.....AND you can verify by what you see.

Stanton builds good stuff no ifs ands or buts, we had another engine of his and it was dynod and showed that , as well it ran perfect and all was 100%, he didnt get his rep by building junk.........but if youre before #50 and theres a chance you could deep 6 your #matching block.....well tear it down.....check things yourself, these are not "Ready to Run" engines.....I really dont know where that rumor started, but maybe at one point it was supposed to be, but to my understanding that was NOT Stantons, prior to 50 or ? From what Eric said today.

Talk to Stanton yourself, Eric is not part of the DP enignes and didnt have exact details on what was run and what was not......

Cant hurt to check......can hurt not to............our ring gaps were closer than I would like.....just one of several things I would preffer NOT to blame on someone else, then Id be real pissed......at myself

Now the only single person I can point my finger at is me....I preffer it that way with engines.

Its not like theyre going to warranty these things

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Teaser vid from Day 1 of dyno testing.

Edit

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Chris, to follow up on Mr. Jeff's post on DP #13. I have purchased it from the owner in PA. Mr. Jeff had one on order for me but when I was told that I was getting Cobra Jet #13, I purchased DP #13. 13 was the Lucky number for my Grand Parents. It has a 6.1 mtx but I am changing it out for a 5.7 atx. Hope to see everyone on the track. Good Luck!! PB Candies

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Also, DP 40 5.7MTX came with a black front and bumper. Seen 5 others at Auburn Hills that were built the same way. Anyone else have one of them?

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

do you want to trade the 6.1 for the 5.7 out of car #36.

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

I have been notified that was NOT Al Smyths car.....noone can remeber whos that was at Mikes shop......Al was there that day, but his car I kept thinking was by the door, it was in back.

Mike P has seen several I think if memory serves right that Al Smyths has one....Ive seen 2 (maybe 3, dont know if the one was moved in Mikes shop or a different car....) in person with the black facia.

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Looks like #34 brought $82K at Mecum auction...

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Car # 28 has the black facia. Its for sale on Racingjunk ad # 1749058.... Out of NY I think???

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Damm I coulda saved them about 30 k.....2 I know of are available for around 50......ouch.....

Well when it comes time to sell this one I know who the first call will be to :D

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

the add says car is now complete with rear end ,trans,JB headers. no racing tires or wheels,

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

I was told there are only stupid answers not questions . Are these cars bought for cash or can they be financed ? My guess is its cash ! That cars intake manifold is wild for stock elim and it has a really nice list of other killer parts . Shore would like to race one and I'm a chevy man at heart . What rear suspension is being used to swap out the IRS. Anybody got pic's of there converses yet ? Ken R.

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

He wants $65,000 and quotes...
"BUY THIS CAR TODAY FOR SLIGHTLY ABOVE MY COST AND ITS YOURS.MY COSTS INCLUDED THE SALES TAX AND DELIVERY I PAID"

I know what the car cost. He wants to get "SLIGHTLY ABOVE MY COST" How much "SLIGHTLY" did he pay for delivery? :rolleyes:

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

You guessed right. We picked up the car and once back to the shop, our Dodge dealer parts Mgr stopped by to pick up the check.

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Must be an old photo, rear end with out the cage is 100% useless. Advertised as coming with the broken 6 speed tremec most have received. Roush green recycling program, 6 speed fallout from the street r/ts and Srt's. Collectible car no doubt. Useable race car not enough info.


Anyone see the car in person?

Hopefully the new owner got a car that was finished by one of the few that know what they are doing with these kit-car projects....otherwise name it.

WHITE ELEPHANT


Eric

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Where did you see that Irv ?

Are you talking about the one at Mecum or another one ?

If youre talking about the one at Mecum

I consider myself a HACK, no delusions there, Im 200% over function over appearnace and will take shortcuts on looks and other details if they dont affect performance or safety.

But the one at Mecum, take a look at the fuel system, thats no good for anything over about 500horse, not the rails, the line and ...... ayyyyeeee.....I wouldnt drive a rig setup like that to 711....No alternator, stock pulley on WP, Stock SRT8 Injectors (brown tips)

AEM Mounted up on inner fender.

Maybe all this was just temporary to run the car ? Or run it at the block so maybe someone would be amazed by the sound ?, I feel bad even posting this, I dont want to dig on someone elses job, I would however like to know the reason if anyone know why it was done this way if someone knows the story on this car....

Cheers (and sorry if I offended the person that did that to the car, like I said there may have been a reason, and not that I havent done things like that for a given reason)

Chris

No sound deadner or sealer my ***......

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

We were one of the "Lucky" ones we goot a good current model 6 gear , without issues I dont think its ever been run, no blown 2nd syncro, looks new never run. Even Mike was suprised, some apprarently went out this way without "cores" we ordered an Auto but got a GOOD 6 gear....how funny.

Cheers

Chris

(I like the name....lol)

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Yes I was talking about the one at Mecum. I really dont know what condition its in. I do see the AEM on the fender well and headers. But as far as the fuel rails mine are stock also.. Maybe I can get more HP if i change them LOL.. It also says Goodyear slicks. but shows only transport tires in photos

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Not the fuel rails the 3/8 rubber line, no clamps and single in no out, with the pressure gauge just kinda hanging there.......youre really running a returnless system with the Fast ? How are you modulating pump pressure ? Im ASSUMING you are running at least a -8 on the fuel line, and maybe like us a -10, youre not running the brown tips either. I have seen 2 or 3 cars that shipped with them, Id be pissed as they need changed for at least the 48lb injectors which do atomize better than the higher rated injector if you supply em with around 72...Cant tell me your pulling of 9.74's at your weight with a -6 or smaller fuel line, no way with as thirsty as yours has to be.

Obviously you can run a closed circuit, we did in testing for the FI system, but there are obvious benefits in an open circut system.

I think the "Goodyear Slicks" were also originally listed on the Mopar spec, before things changed....

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Hey Chris....Mopar has been using a system similar for years,with the return inside the fuel tank with the pump, reason?....no engine warmed fuel being recycled back into the fuel tank,one less fuel line also.uh-oh,now everyone knows....Electromotive's Tec3r system in their instructions says that a properly set up system requires NO fuel pressure regulator...hmmmmm.......on a carb setup universally the regulator goes before the fuel mixer(carb) on a fuel injection system the regulator can go before OR after the mixer(injector),so you can either do a return from the injector rail system or dead head the fuel at the rails with the regulator at the tank....which is better? depends on the setup and the only way to find out is to try them all....

The main issue that is the hardest to deal with is the "airation" of your fuel(bubbles in the fuel)...since fuel pressure is higher with injection it can happen real easy and be really hard to diagnose...line sizes are another area where you need to optimize the flow....a line larger than what you need can hurt you as much as one too small...as long as you can cover the required gpm with the optimum fps(feet per second) that you need with a certain size there is no need to go bigger...in fact fluid dynamics will actually HURT your flow if the lines get too big( too large of a subject for here)

On a "push-lok" pressure hose you do not want clamps on it because the barbs are so sharp they will cut the hose from the inside with the force of the clamp on the outside of the hose, I don't remember the max pressure some of these are rated for but I do know that some will hold 200 psi with no problem....

D L Rambo....

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Check and I understand all that, on the cars (vs their Street cousins) I can adjust my supply pressure with a regulator after much finer than in a closed loop system, there I need to modulate the pump (as the St units do) to maintain a constant pressure.

That was why I was curious as to how hes modulating the pump for contant and steady pressure, obviously a WOT burst will cause a drop in the line pressure, then the electronics have to say Oh **** run the pump, there is a delay and a POTENTIAL for inconsistent pressure.

Without being able to bodulate and control pressure exactly your not going to be able to gain constant and reliable atomization when these (the SRT 4) injectors atomize best at a given pressure on the DOT. Now granted thats not where theyre supposed to run but its where the spray patten is best (I saw just this on a fuel test bench) and its common knowlede (supposedly) with the SRT guys.

Soooooo

If you can see that thats push lok line and not rubber hose your eyes are better than mine (and thats not suprising as Im blind as a bat) but what is obvious about the Mecum car is its a hack all the way around AT LEAST when those pics were taken.

Also fluid to fluid friction can cause cavitation and bubbles as well, BUT even knowing that I still ran my return line in the bottom , why ? Because it looks better and will cut down on aeration.....I can change it later....I also unlike many others opted for a check valve before the rail to hold line volume....didnt have to but I could and its right so I did....

(no making fun of my lines I hadnt finished moutning them:)

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4053/...ab6757d7e7.jpg

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

"Obviously you can run a closed circuit, we did in testing for the FI system, but there are obvious benefits in an open circut system." by Drooze


wow! do you think I can pick up by changing my fuel plumbing>>>> I hope so...Ive got -4 going to my fuel rails

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

Yer funny....-4, I pee a bigger stream than that.....The benefits arent in speed Irv , obviously....and No I dont think you can pick up......well see at Pomona.....the question isnt right now HOW were going to run its IF were going to run....Damm forecast dosent look good for this week.

Ill be happy to send you a vid of the atomization tests on the fuel test bench, if youre telling me that with your system you can hold a steady 72 psi +/- .25 psi, cool, it can be done with a closed system, but for the 3 rd time, thats why I was wondering HOW , if you even know, HOW are you modulating your pump and line pressure. When running from idle to WOT , I wasnt aware the FAST or AEM was that accurate in pump handling and it was a curiousity question , NOT a cant be done, the BENEFITS of an open system is I can hold that pressure and not depend on electronics to handle it, then again maybe your running yours stuffed and dont know it ? There are benefits to a closed system too.......

I cant remeber if youre running the AEM or FAST, I know they have provisions for it, so Im not suprised if thats how its being done. But I am actually suprised at with all the guys you have help , experienced people who know their stuff, that that was the system you ended up with.

Pomona is gonna be FUN ! Cant wait to meet you......

Read my blog tongiht if you want a real suprise of something you said either couldnt be done, or noone had yet I cant remeber :D

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

OK I give what blog???

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

As my good friend Mike Kuhl once said, "Spare me your technical bullsh#t, show me your timeslip"
Drooze, maybe you should call your shop "new2hemiracing".... especially if you think these cars are capable of making an eight second pass. It's evident you have no clue what that actually takes. Mike

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

An 8.99, yes I think in a year they will be capable possibly,youve ever put your hands in one of the Drag Pak motors, and know what the numbers on the spec side (not the blueprint guide) but flow numbers and dyno numbers of these engines then yes.... well I can tell you there are about 5 other guys right now who were sharing R&D info with that all agree between us well have 6 cam profiles and 5 different configs of headers as well as the trans stuff all by Gainesville....soo....much more effort than we could afford to do on our own or them on their own.....do any of us think its guarenteed ? No, do we think its possible , yes......are on the Im not saying its a lock, Im saying its possible I believe with some R&D and running out.......They are already with the few out there at 9.7s and fat. soooooooo......Probably the way they are theyre already good for 9.6.

Like I said to someone else my favorite quote is from Einstein "Wether you think you can or not youre right" so, in as much as you building one youre right, in as much as me building one Im right, were both right see how easy that was:D

Timeslips coming Pomona to Gainesville :)

Irv, the blog is http://newhemiracing.blogspot.com, I did it so I could track build progress and show others what they will be up against in terms of those like us who choose to do the rest of the build themselves with their own hands. Stupid shtuffzzz like this will get in the way of that and the like.

In as much as having no clue goes.......Its late and Im tired so maybe I took what you said the wrong way. If not, Ill be happy to wager Our car will be faster by Gainesville than any of your DP builds :) Name the stakes something friendly and in good spirit. Lunch, Dinner, a Ball Game. I heard you were doing a few more builds is that correct ? (Mind asking who for Zeeeee list ?)

Well see in a year from now if I was right, and youll see our timeslips dont expect our combo to be dialed in and wrung out till Gainesville.....Its looking very possible well be showing up at Pomona untested.

Would be a real kick to you guys if the guys who dont know jack run faster the first time out than Warford did wouldnt it :)

Cheers

Chris

Re: Challenger Drag Pak Owners
 

#69 on e-bay. Item # 260545446124