Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Ya mean like more 2000-2010 cars in the guide that can be affordable to buy and race? And yeah, I mean FWD stuff too. And maybe 1 or 2 more FWD classes.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I've always loved the concept of S/SS. The concept of competing using a set of rules that everyone must follow promotes getting the most out of a given combination. This, to me, has always been inspiring, motivating and invigorating. I've been a bracket racer, and understand that the cost and complexity of class racing make bracket racing a reality, but it lacks the "look what can be done with stock parts" aspect. Who hasn't run their car at a bracket race and not amazed their fellow participants by their performance? (And yes, S/SS ain't as Stock, and is a lot more Super than they used to be.)

The NHRA seems to be slowly eliminating S/SS. It presents an extremely tedious enforcement process. They don't seem to want the related tech inspections, tear downs, HP adjustments, etc., etc., anymore. The pool of people qualified to do all of the work required to keep up the integrity of the class must be rather small, and getting smaller.

Not to mention NHRA executives that probably don't get the concept, and would rather concentrate on the money they can generate in other classes. They could be rather short sighted, as such, because there are indirect ways of generating income in the long term by maintaining such classes as S/SS.

A big reason I'm no longer a member of the "club" is because the people that run it don't communicate with their own members. The very members that spend on memberships, and an ever expanding list of "enhancements". I'd like to know what Wally Parks would think of the way things are now.

Bottom line: I think the only rule changes they will make will be to make things simpler for them.

I've read on here that NHRA reads this forum. If that's so NHRA, please come on here and speak to your members.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Yes. If NHRA was truly interested in entry level car, there needs to be a FWD class in between 19 lbs. and 25 lbs. !
Also , see my post on X/ Stock.


http://classracer.com/classforum/showthread.php?t=74658

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

With all of the newer "flood cars" available, it can be cheaper to start with a newer body style and build a car, than to look for a 60's or 70's classic and have to replace body panels,floor pans etc. just to get started. Many different combinations from the manufacturers are out there. There not all "dime rockets", but can be built for much less than a new COPO, Drag Pak or Cobra Jet.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

The rear drive Dodge Chargers, Magnums, Challengers, Mustangs, Pontiac G8s,Chevy SS, and Late model Chevy Caprice police package cars need to be placed in the guide. All V8 and V6 combos available in all these models. All years up to the current models.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Too many years where only one model out of a manufacturer's entire lineup is listed. And it is usually the one that they need for the limited-availability non-VIN package cars.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Ban auto trans! There boring!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

And more weight breaks in between the other FWD classes.


Rick Thomason
GTOMayhem

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

There should not be any heads up runs between fuel injected cars and carb cars. and a way to stop the sand baggers make a rule to where if you have a heads up run you cant go faster then one tenth of what you qualifyed at. and yes they should change the seat belt rule to five years.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

There are cars in Stock that are quicker than some cars in Competition. Perhaps there should be a reevaluation of what classes belong in Competition, in Super Stock and in Stock? Performance? Cost? Allowable modifications?

How about moving Stock classes where cars have made passes under 9.00 into SS, as a beginning?

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I know you're being facetious here, but I'm not .
Pay out for stick shift win should pay a percentage more (30 ? 40? , 100% more ?)
Also no automatic upshift unless the TRANSMISSION was built that way and you're controlling it with the OEM computer.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I'd like to see the belts / harness rule go to 3 yrs (at least) because it would match the chassis certification time span. It would just make things a little easier to track - especially for those who have more than one race car.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I feel you Sammy but I don't think it's has anything to do with fuel injected but more to do with the SOFT hp ratings handed out by NHRA. I also never understood why so much discrepancy between model to model or auto to manual. What would happen if NHRA handed out a 30 or 40 hp reduction on all carb cars? I would bet that would even things up! FIVE YEAR SEAT BELT RULE please!!!!!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Change Roll Bar Rule from M/S up
To Roll Bars mandatory if car runs 11.49 or better.
Make it the same as for brackets cars.
You would see a better spread of cars in K, L and M
Lighter car easier on parts.
May get a few bracket racers converting to Stock.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Prior to 2004 the front wheel stock classes were from A - H and Sticks & Auto's were separated like the Rear drive classes. In 04 NHRA pared down the classes from A - E and combined the trannies (no pun intended), giving the sticks a 100 lb penalty. Not sure when they did away w/that penalty.

Why did they pare it down to begin with? I wasn't watching the front drivers then.

What I've seen with the ratings is firstly they're set by the factories. With the exception of the 2bbl 302 FFFords in "U" , aren't the rest set by the AHFS?

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Right because roller lifters never break. Lol

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Roller lifters break of course but they'll be less abused with the average stocker having .400-.500" lift as opposed to the .800" in a super stocker. Starting a new engine without the dreaded cam break in fear and changing valve springs on the engine would be nice.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Been there done that (Dallas National) last weekend. Thankfully Brenda caught it almost immediately...I happened at engine startup at the scales. You are fooling yourself if you think there is less breakage/cost with roller lifters. When the do go bad...they go really bad.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I run an FI combo that has been beat to death. It actually needs to be reviewed and lowered a bit to me somewhat competitive again without spending 30k on an engine. I know which car(s) you're referring to and I totally agree but please refrain from lumping all FI cars into the 'soft' HP ratings category.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Hell yes!...now I can walk up and buy the engine out of any stocker for 10K .
This would certainly make at least a few racers think twice about spending 25K for a engine,and reduce costs for all of us . Might take me a couple weeks to heal up from the arse kicking I most likely will get!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

The genie... she ain't going back in the bottle and the AHFS has already been hard at work adjusting indexes with cars running ported heads. 25% of the cost for a competitive set of heads is for cover up work so lets just get it over with. As long as the heads CC properly and have the correct valves as outlined in the guide, they pass. No more over looking the obvious and checking will be a go-no go based on CCing properly.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
No sir, I don't like it. Don't like it one bit.
Spend money in the right places in the Tech Dept..
This is why we have SS.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

The classes have been refactored with ported heads. Do we go back to the original factors and start over?

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

No Todd, as a matter-of-fact, We don't! Leave the factors in place where they are and shame on the A-Holes with the ported heads who were responsible for getting those combos factored!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Any size rear view mirror, lol

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Back to just ONE battery, front or rear. Your choice.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Raise the index 2 tenth's and that will make the AHFS work great !!!! Lol.....

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

With so many rumors of a few racers using manipulated ignition control boxes to control elapsed times, it may be time for NHRA to work with MSD to have certified ignition control boxes that can't be tampered with or can be easily checked by NHRA tech officials to determine if it's been illegally altered. I know this will be a challenge for the modern EFI cars, but something needs to be done. Maybe someone more knowledgeable than me has a better solution.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

That is one of the best ideas I have heard all year!!!!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Sometimes it can be harder to control a lifter on a smaller lobe then a larger one. Just food for thought. Roller lifters should be rebuilt or thrown away after some time. You don’t really have that issue with solids.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

All NHRA has to do for this one would be to have a small collection of legal boxes (easily donated by MSD, Holley, Mallory) at the trailer and when you get weighed the racer is asked what box he is using. NHRA gives him a duplicate box with a receipt for HIS box and for the rest of the race the racer uses the NHRA box. After the racer is done racing, he goes back to the Tech trailer and gets HIS box back. Check your serial #.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Good idea, as long as we dont expect belts to cost the same for 3yrs as they do for 2 . One of the positive things the SFI and NHRA have done is create a healthy and stable market for alot of very low demand safety products that have very high potential for legal liability. A large percentage of the cost is for insurance, this would now have to be increased while sales in this market would decrease . There are at least a half dozen manufacturers for seat belts with a wide variety of prices and styles , even a few USA made . Make them last 3 or5 yrs and I think that would change and not for the better. If we are not careful we might make them even more expensive. Just saying, be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Take this for what it is worth


There are not a bunch of cars out there with ET controlling ignition boxes. That is about as true as the accusations made about 3-4 really good racers a few years ago regarding transbrakes, trick buttons, and delay boxes, by an individual that used to be on these boards.


And NHRA ain't gonna buy three or four hundred plus ignition boxes at $700+ each, haul them around, hand them out, and collect them after the race. MSD, Accel, and Holley ain't gonna donate them, either. Think about it, you HOPE that around a HUNDRED stockers show up at races in SEVEN different divisions. That's a ton of ignition boxes for someone to buy, haul around, hand out, collect, and otherwise keep up with. A logistical nightmare. NHRA doesn't want to pay tech people now. You really think their going to hire more?



If you are breaking valve train in your stocker, it's not going to be resolved by roller lifters. In fact, it will likely just become more expensive to start with, and result in far more catastrophic failures.


That's sort like people complaining about stock rocker arms. We never broke a stock rocker arm. We broke ONE used up rocker stud, before I learned about replacing old parts, and valve train stiffness. Every single stock rocker I saw broken was poorly prepared. And I saw a bunch, on expensive engines.


Here's the deal. Roller lifters will require entirely new lobe designs, and steel core cams. Both of which are expensive. Then there's lifters, etc, and the entirely new learning curve. How many roller cams do you want to buy to find out what's fast?



Sure, you can institute a new valve spring rule. And then you can buy ten new cams to make it work. Because the cam lobe designers will be busy, and Spin Tron time ain't cheap.


You are not going to reduce breakage or reduce expense with new rules.



You CAN decide to ENFORCE rules, and resolve a lot of it. You can reign in what has been let go, and resolve a lot of it.


When you think about rules, think about the health and longevity of the sport, and stop thinking everyone is cheating.


You guys need to talk to Wesley, Travis, and Dave. And then you need to talk to the guys who make your parts.


Class racing doesn't need new rules for the cars. It needs proper enforcement, and it needs PROMOTION. It needs to be seen, by a LOT more people


Y'all have fun now.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Alan I agree.

How do we make a rule that you have to have INTEGRITY to race !
Integrity seems to be in short supply in the in all walks of life today.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I can see bracket racing replacing stock and S/S class racing in the future in NHRA national events. I' m not sure how long it will be before it becomes the norm but its coming like in IHRA. I will hate to see it happen.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

I can see a woman president of the United States in the future.....

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

People have been saying that same thing since the 70s.
If you would like to see something more "specialized" than S/SS Racing, check out what it takes to competitively go bracket racing today!

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

If I spend $700 on an ignition, what happens after NHRA's box fails in my car at that race? Geez, the NHRA box could cost a racer a final round win, not to mention time lost chasing the problem. Sounds like socialism.

The seat belt thing has always been ridiculous. You can bet the belt makers will be against extending their life. They must love NHRA!
I have a street car that's quick enough for a roll bar, and thusly, belts. I don't mind the roll bar, but I don't even take it to the track every two years! How many cars never get to the track, and how many of them, as a result, aren't racing every weekend?

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

What happens after NHRA fails to find a box that's been tampered with and that box is in the car that beats you in the final round?!?
Maybe NHRA should stop doing tech altogether and just start handing out participation trophies.

Re: What Stock rules would you change?
 

Thank goodness that did NOT happen 4 years ago !:eek: