Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Barry, I don't believe that you're being very accurate ( and somewhat reckless) with your comment that "almost every combo" is capable of going that far under. No matter how much time and money is spent on them.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Billy....They will if the owner/driver cheats enough and can get away with it !

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

It depends if they can cheat enough and get away with it.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

$20000 heads maybe one way performance has improved.
Only going to get so much out of the heads.
Be interesting to compare Ported Stocker heads to $20k massaged.
Guessing 20 to 50 hp from bare Stock heads.

There are other technologies that have made our cars quicker.
Such as better lubricants, composition of engine materials, tighter tolerances, treatments on bearings, cams and springs and of course Lifters, rings and pistons.

There are better tires, VHT coated tracks for a heck of a lot better launch.
Got Converter and Transmission technology putting power down more effectively.

I am sure that $20000 heads helped a lot.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Sorry, but I just can't see how you can put 20K into a set of heads. The labor rate has to be horrendous.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Yes. What if Jason Line built a motor for a first class AA/SA?

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Bet most of it would be the "hush" money to buy the silence of the guy performing the surgery.............

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Almost every combo is capable of running 1.20 under? Well my combo is a 302/309 HP (1.02 HP per cu. in.) and I can't. But there's a 350/320 HP (.91 HP per cu.in.) in my class that can. Same heads, compression, carb. cam as my combo, but with one exception. 48 MORE CUBIC INCHES! If my combo was factored at .91 HP per cu, in. I could loose 322 lbs. Then I could run 1.20 under. I guess I'm not spending enough money and time.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Billy you know me I'm a reckless kind of guy!!! My opinion differs from yours so that make me reckless really. I may have sell my Burger Place just so I can keep up with you and Terry on here. I stand by statement that most combo's given time and money can run 1.20 and more under. And I'm talking about the combo's that are out there racing. Not at Indy mind you but lets say at Atco at the beginning of the year. Or any other place that has a DA good enough. I know what's good enough. Lets say 500ft or less.


Beside the Factory Stock guys who do you know that has spent 20 G's on a set of heads for stock. I would like to know so if I see them at a race I can go over to them and start laughing. Even better yet ask for money. LOL Barry


Wish I had more time to dispute with you your Idea of what you and Terry and a few others that don't even have a car or race Stock. Want it to be. Please spare me the rules are already there for intakes and heads just enforce them. It's not going to happen.


Billy answer me this question. How many people do you think that race stock use a bone stock intake? What percent do you think it is?
How about head work? What do you think is ok for someone to do to heads. Bowl cut? Or just from junk yard to valves and seats done and that's it?


Just so you know I'm old school. I don't disagree with the way you guys think. I'm just realistic and know it's way to late to back the train up. I'm happy they are enforcing what they have allowed the last 20 years and not to let it get anymore out of hand. No welding, no grind marks no numbers changed. Have them look stock and the CC measure to the numbers they have. BP

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

George Just because you can't make it run that fast doesn't mean someone else couldn't. Also sounds like the person that picked the 350/320 combo knew what car to build for the class. How about this. Anyone that runs your class should get HP just so you can be even with them. What do you think? Barry

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

George makes a good point.
Some of the HP factoring is not balanced.

Bob Benders 1969 Chevy Wagon had HP cut to 261 HP
My 1969 Impala Sport is rated at 275 hp.
We both have the 350/255 engine.

When Bob got his HP factored a Chevelle (think it was a 69) with 350/300 hp.
That cars HP was reduced to 275 hp.

Understand George's conversation about his 302 vs his friends 350.

Love the 302...It is the little engine that humiliated the BB world !

D

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Barry , I have no problem with whatever someone wants to spend on Stocker heads, given the way the rules are written, currently. Of course, as long as the US government is not subsidizing it.

I say "currently" because I've had experience with this, going back many years.

I was in teardown at Miami -Hollywood in 1988 . Next to me was my friend and mentor, the late Joe DeLorenzo, tearing down Ritchie De Cola's K/Stock Chevelle.
One of the ports looked like it had water sitting in it for a while. Tech wasn't too concerned because only one was like that. Joey told the tech guy that NHRA needed to stop this use of acid and port work being hidden, right now ,before it gets out off hand. The tech guy says.."Yeah, we know. We're gonna get right on it...blah, blah
(1988)
A few years later, Wesley told me (I guess it's okay to mention this), that he was working on a chemical to use that would detect acid masking. NHRA told him thanks, but we're not interested . (90's)

In post #91 I mentioned 30 years of neglect by NHRA.. Just two examples.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Big difference , Dan. Bob is out there racing a 255..And you are?

The rules for HP reduction are clearly spelled out.
You're a resourceful guys on the internet. I'll let you find it. ;-)

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

RACING !!!
What is the matter Mark...?
Have a problem ...?

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

No..None at all.
Of course, I'm not the guy who doesn't know how to manipulate the system and get HP reduced. ;-)

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

So that means you know how to manipulate the system
and
Then still complain about it !

wow

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Barry, what kind of stats do you have to back up your comment about "most combos being able to run -1.20"? Making statements like that based on assumptions is reckless. Ya know, the NHRA Tech people read this stuff. You don't know much about combos other than your own, do you.

As far as who is paying who for what, I don't kiss and tell.

If NHRA isn't going to enforce the rules the way that they are written in the Rulebook then they should change their wording in their Rulebook! Changing the intent of the rule to keep from being sued just isn't real ethical or smart. Lawsuits can go both ways and at some point in time, it's bound to happen.

How many Racers do I think are using stock intakes? I would guess that more are using them than are using modified intakes. All that it takes is a look at the Q sheets and Nitro Joes to get a rough idea of who's doing what.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Yup.. It's called "playing the hand you're dealt"
Try it sometime

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Barry, you might be correct. I very well might be incapable of making my combo run 1.20 under, but if I was able to do so I would be doing it with one arm tied behind my back.
NHRA through the AHFS (and in other ways I suspect) has been manipulating HP factors up and down for years. My combo has had an increase of 19 HP, while the 350/320 has had a decrease of 40 HP, and I'm not the only one. I can assure you that there are many other racers in the same predicament.
Your premise that anyone who cannot run 1.20 under only have themselves to blame and that any combo in the right hands can run 1.20 under is a very simplistic view, as there are other factors at play.
George

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

I do ... I run Pure Stock...the REAL STOCK !!
Remember that ?
Stock Heads, Engine and real street gas..

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

George I agree with you not all combo's are created equal. You are right you are playing with your hand behind your back. You made the statement about 1 hp per cubic inch. Just wanted you to see that it works for some combo's but would be way out of wack for others. Please go back and read my post. I did not say anyone that can't run 1.20 under has themself to blame. What I said is my opinion is that most combo's that are running Stock could be able to run 1.20 under in great air with work, money and the knowledge where to spend it. Not all but most. Just my opinion. And I do understand that opinions are like
we all know what. Good luck with your combo. You could always play the AHFS game and run it soft for a year and ask for HP off. BP

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=Dan Fahey;597875]

There are other technologies that have made our cars quicker.
Such as better lubricants, composition of engine materials, tighter tolerances, treatments on bearings, cams and springs and of course Lifters, rings and pistons.

There are better tires, VHT coated tracks for a heck of a lot better launch.
Got Converter and Transmission technology putting power down more effectively.


Dan I don't normally agree with you but this part you hit the nail on the head. And even though I've never been a big fan of the AHFS these are the reasons I would love to see it get tweaked so it reflects all the above. BP

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

123

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=Dan Fahey;597891]George makes a good point.
Some of the HP factoring is not balanced.

Bob Benders 1969 Chevy Wagon had HP cut to 261 HP
My 1969 Impala Sport is rated at 275 hp.
We both have the 350/255 engine

Dan, forgive me if I overlooked it, but when was the last time you ran an NHRA event with your 69 Impala? what did it run? and what was the index? I'm just trying to compare to see if you have gone too fast to put a letter requesting hp? or you just haven't been out yet. The Dutch is in a couple weeks.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Ha, Ha, Ha

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=1347;597964]I'm confused........you gotta Chevy Duane

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=Glenn Briglio;597977][QUOTE=1347;597964]

I'm confused........you gotta Chevy Duane[/QUOTE

Yes Glenn, I'm driving a Chevy, a car that is not capable of running 1.2 under. But its not sitting in Billys garage while I complain about other people getting hp back. That was the point.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=1347;597998][QUOTE=Glenn Briglio;597977]Since I started thread. Can Dan go sit this one out Delusional as usual
You must have dog in the fight Stick with pure stock thread or calendar

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

[QUOTE=James Perrone;598026][QUOTE=1347;597998]I will comment any damn time I want.
You do not own Class Racer it is a public forum.
Get over it !

Got it child boy !!!

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

There's something goofy the way the "quotes" appear,I don't think Glenn posted that comment.Wrong target!...lol gsa612

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

See the latest NHRA Competition Updates.

Might the NHRA department be taking a more proactive process?

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

What was proactive? Only thing I saw was James p getting slapped for the brake rule.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yXHeCpBAagA

Various notes about all that were tossed at the barn in Indy. Although the intake with the modified casting numbers was of note,

You mean the security/maintenance/truck driver/party planner for Corp NHRA position?

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Think whatever Dan said to his son was plenty of punishment....just saying.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

that was a serious spin

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Pro-active was not the proper use of the adjective. Maybe fastidious is a better way to describe the recent posts by the NHRA tech department.
Does that work for you James?
I get the sense that they at work trying to get control of this mess known as class racing.

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Wow,,,after reading all these posts you guys are going to get us all thrown out!! Who says the cowl hood isn't legal on a 255hp 350 69 Camaro??

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Nhra says so, but mainly because you couldn't get a cowl hood from GM on the 255/350 engine. Only the 300/350 engine

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

Correctomundo Jamie! Cowl hood was a mid-year option on SS. Base engine in a SS is 350/300.

And now that this has been beat to death, can we start looking at all of the "bogus" fresh air hoods on Mopar combos?

Re: Attention Nova 350/255 stock combo.
 

The cowl hood I knew about I just love Billy Nees Canadian two cents!! Good thing you don't work for the NHRA Billy or most of the National records would loose 2 seconds. I still think your one of the fastest 2bbl guys that is totally legally stock!! And a great guy.