Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

We dont want that car in H/SA
It isnt a H car and only hurts our class
A one of one crate motor car passed by NHRA for what is in it for them $$$
Jeff what you did was just wrong and you know it
Try looking out for stock and not hurting it....

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

How the heck can you fault someone for taking advantage of an opportunity that was presented to EVERYONE? NHRA set the factors, which everyone agrees are soft. Unfortunately, not everyone is in a position to take advantage of such opportunities no matter how much they wanted to, including myself. The problem will get worse for even more specific classes when the other Mustang combos come out. Go to the source (not that it will do any good), but singling out people for taking advantage of an opportunity because they can is wrong. I'd be surprised if you wouldn't have taken advantage of any combo if you could have!

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Myron it is about doing what you know is the right thing to do
He knew that the car isnt right
As said before isnt this a one of one car?
Isnt this basically a crate motor car?
And most everyone knows this car shouldnt be in H .
I understand that isnt a big deal from where you sit but to me it is a very big deal I spent alot and work alot to get my car to where it is and what he did hurts my class
And as others have said just work more and spend more wont work in this case
All I am asking is for respect for what all class racers are trying to do and I for one dont feel he did....

All said with all due respect...

I feel it is important for the racers in S/SS to do the right thing and because NHRA didnt doesnt mean we should take advantage of it and hurt our fellow racers

Re: Yet another bogus horsepower factor
 

That 's funny (not really) all you guys that used to make fun of the IHRA crate motor cars. At least they have reasonable HP ratings (for now anyhow). And you can put them in $1,000 bodies. You don't have to have to purchase a $50,000+ car to do it.

I don't have a crate motor car, I just think it's ironic.

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

For most this is a hobby so "playing fair" is not an unreasonable request. BUT I doubt there are too many people that race Stock and Super Stock that do it just becuase they like to drive a car fast. The want to race, and they want to win (that's how you get to race more).

Now factor the investment. It doesn't cost $75k+ to build a car to run 9.70's, you could be going alot faster for a third that money with a dragster. People choose to spend this kind of money for the competition. You have to be on drugs to think anyone would CHOOSE to spend that kind of money on a combination that isn't or can't be competitive because they don't think another combination isn't "fair". The only reason some people do that is because they are have some non-competition based motivation (always wanted to race X kind of car or diehard Y-brand fans).

Now I feel bad for anyone who is now not competitive and needs to spend more money to catch back up (if that is even possible in some cases). But I see people on here that sound serious when they have asked people who are racing these new combinations to tell NHRA they have an unfair advantage. Seriously? This isn't some cheap legal show on TV where if I turn myself in I can get a plea deal for a lesser HP adjustment because of my honesty.

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Hold on a sec, let me check my wallet... Hm. Somehow, it appears that this "opportunity" isn't available to me. :rolleyes: :p If I won the lottery tomorrow, I'd have one of each. That still wouldn't make them factored right or put them in the right class.

That, I will agree with. The people buying/building the new cars are playing within the rules, and I don't fault them for doing so. The blame lies squarely upon NHRA and the manufacturers. That being said, people are more than welcome to take advantage of the rules all they want, but don't insult anyone's intelligence by trying to say with a straight face that the HP factors aren't a joke. I have no problem with someone if they're just honest and says, "Yeah, they're underrated, but that's what NHRA gave us, so I'm gettin' while the gettin's good."

Might look like it until you compare the specs on these new "crate motor" cars to our crate motor cars. There is no comparison. And IHRA Crate Motor cars are still Stockers - not factory-built race cars. Let me know when NHRA adds 'the rest of' the crate motor classes... No, never mind. There's a reason I don't run NHRA, and it ain't because they don't have Crate Motor Stock.

Again -- I *love* the new cars. Just put them in the right place, with reasonable HP factors. Got no problem with the people that've bought or built them. The blame is NHRA's.

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Well said Michael!

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Forget all the nonsense Mustangs, Challengers, etc. If you want to be the bad boy in the country get a Cadillac. It may not go into the eights, but it will go further under than anyone else.

Now that some new cars can obliterate the rest of the field everyone is crying and bickering amongst themselves. I totally understand the situation as I have been in it more times than not for over twenty years.

The thing is anyone who wants to race Stock only has to look in the Classification Guide and pick the combo that they want. How fast do you want to go? How much money do you want to spend? Some combos are soft and some are not, but you do have a choice.

Some people want to run these new Fords with say unfair HP ratings. These individuals know that they are just scratching the surface of their true potential. Same goes with the Mopar clan. The bowtie people have had an advantage in the past, but it only has taken several years to realign them with the HP ratings. The sad thing is that these newer cars will eventually be corrected but the other sportsman racers will have left the sport due to frustration.

In the true form of competition we need all the new cars we can get. It will keep the sport alive. We need the older cars as they are a real representation of the sport and is the greatest car show as well. And believe it or not we really need the imports if we are going to draw in a new generation. It all still comes down to HP ratings whether new, old, domestic or foriegn.

The manufacturers know how to "play the new game" with HP ratings. Remember that well. The technical staffs and crews can see the descrepecies in HP ratings as well. The regular racer can see the differences. Everyone knows what is going on. Even the NHRA people in the Competition Department know the situation. We have representatives and comitties but it does not help. If you want to reach the individuals who are casting a blind eye to this and are the ones responsible for changes then look no further that the five members of the Competition Committee. They are the ones who are running this HP game.
Get ahold of them and you have the culprits. Good luck.

Now leave each other alone and go after this Committee.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA no further questions.

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Ron has a good point If these new cars fit into CF/S or U/SA, would the choir be singing as loud?

Re: Yet another bogu horsepower factor
 

Somehow I think we got a little off base here. It is not Jeff's fault, or Chrysler's fault, or Ford's fault that the NHRA has totally thrown out the rule book and allowed these Mustangs and Challengers into Stock. All of you know that if you were able to, you would build or have one built and go racing. Do I look forward to seeing Jeff in the other lane? NO! In fact I hope he will let us H/SA guys know when and where he will be running that beautiful mechanical work of art! This all comes down to the fact that NHRA has broken their own written rules and put these cars into Stock while giving them an indefensible HP rating. Hell, if they want to rate that 360 combo at 275hp then put my 360 back at 175hp! It makes just as much sense. I think maybe Jeff was sort of thumbing his nose at the NHRA when he let it all out on Thursday at the CajunNats and ran 10.50 @ 127. -1.65 under the new index! -1.95 under the old one! Jim

I guess since these engines use full aluminum roller rocker arms it must be ok for all SB Mopars to use them now?


."Ron has a good point If these new cars fit into CF/S or U/SA, would the choir be singing as loud?"

The answer to that one is very much a yes! I received everything but death threats when I qualified #1 many times with both the Cadillac and the Turbo Dodge! What nobody remembers that? And remember Mike Senia's Cadillac in T/SA and U/SA? We were driving Cadillac's before Cadillac's were cool!


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