Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Jason,
Thanks for correcting me. I thought the Kenton was out of Ohio. Though your uncle was a northwest region New York racer, I don't recall ever seeing him at Dover Drag Strip (Wingdale, NY) or New York National, out on Long Island, unless he was there for the 68' S/S Magazine
Nationals, along with Ed Miller (Syracuse). I didn't realize Kenton
was for Ken-Ton. The other Dodge (Hat) sponsor looks like Youngstown Dodge (up there near the border???). You are right about the first paint job. Did your uncle really have to race the car like that. Please don't say he had to wear a white cowboy hat too, at the track for the sponsors:D
The maroon and black paint job is :cool:.
Paul (the Amherst area has the best Wings on the planet:).

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Dick ran the Iron Butterfly in '69. Spehar built the car in '69 for SS/CA from his wife's Slant 6 330. It was to take advantage of a one year only rule change allowing the steel front Hemi car to utilize the fresh air scoop. He didn't build the car though until late in the year. It only ran at a couple national events. Ted and Tina (his wife) both confirmed this at the Hemi Reunion. Car is believed to possibly still be around.

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Jason, I think that you are right about running the Dart after the Iron Butterfly. I think Dick told me that being a contract racer he was supposed to race at The U.S. Nats - he blew a motor shortly before and didn't have a good block left. He called Chrysler to explain and they put him it the Butterfly for the race. Interestingly, I have also seen Wally Booth's name on the Butterfly. Wall did have a green Super Bee that he raced also before the RatPack Camaros.
Mark J

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Crate Camaro,
Frank Elliot's old car - Frank built a clone recently - he sent me some pictures of it. I am not sure if that car ever ran as a S/S (maybe the first owners) Frank always ran it as a M/P and was VERY sucessful with it. Any chance of getting any pictures of it now from Reggie?
Mark J

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Dick was in the Iron Butterfly at both Indy and Dallas that year. He scattered a 727 at Indy and was runner up to Sox at Dallas.

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Mark J. : We talked at the Hemi Reunion and I was asking you about Dennis Kilbanes 1968 Dart out of Strongsville Ohio. The car had KILBANE DODGE on the side of it. The car was sold from Strongsville, Ohio in around 1971 and never heard from again. Just wondering if you have heard anything about this car yet. Thanks / Gary

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Jason,
That photo of your uncles car looks like August 69', at York/US30, at the
Super Stock Magazine Nationals. The yellow Cougar Eliminator in the
back-ground is a 69'. Charlie Castaldo won the S/S Eliminator there, with his SS/BA car. That would mean, 2 months later that Dart was in the NHRA Finals at Dallas...versus Sox & Martin in the S/S championship run..?
PC

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Paul,

Dick definitely ran the Iron Butterfly at Dallas. Here's a pic of the semi-final run with Ron Mancini and an article with reference to it.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...pakdodge/5.jpg

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Steve,
Then it looks like Dick put the Hemi Dart on the shelf for awhile, after the
8/10/69 Super Stock Magazine Nationals?
If he was campaigning the Dart for the 69' season, How did he get to
run the 64' Dodge at the Finals?
Paul

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Good question, like I said, I know he ran the '64 Dodge at Indy as well. Possibly a few divisional races too, I had never asked about the divisional entries on the car. Note that he is running a Division 1 number.

http://www.quartermilestones.com/pho...n2/RMA6905.jpg

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

OK, here's the story right from the horse's mouth:

My uncle was racing the Dart, and sometime after Indy but before the last Division 1 points meet, he blew the motor in the car racing at our local track, Lancaster Dragway. Lancaster ran on Thursday nights, and as part of his contract with the Erie County Dodge Dealers he had to race the car at least once a week at a local track. Lancaster worked out well for him because he could race there on Thursday night, and then leave for the big race for the weekend right after.

Anyway, my uncle had a voucher from Chrysler for a free motor, so he called to get the motor, but they told him they didn't have any more. However, they did say that they had a CAR for him to drive, if he was interested in that. The deal was that if he took the car, he had to also agree to race the car at the World Finals in Dallas too. My uncle was near the top of the Division 1 S/S points standings, and he thinks it was the points meet at Atco that was that weekend, so he felt like he didn't have much choice. So, he drove to Detroit to pick up the car from some guy named Ted Spehar. When he picked up the car (the Iron Butterfly), it was the first time he met Ted. He then took the car to NJ, and Ted and Tom Hoover flew there a day later.

Wally Booth was driving the Iron Butterfly prior to my uncle, including at Indy. It was sometime at or after Indy that Wally and Ted had some type of falling out and split up, which was why the car was available.

A note about the run with Mancini - my uncle had him covered, which is why Mancini tried a neutral start with the car and blew the transmission. I couldn't immediately find the picture, but there is a famous picture that most of you have probably seen before of the carnage of that explosion.

So, there you have it - the story of my uncle and the Iron Butterfly...

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

Thanks Jason. I thought I had read somewhere that he was driving the IB at Indy in '69. Dick would know better than I, lol.

Here's the pic you mentioned of Mancini's car and the damage it caused... ;)

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...ge/mancini.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...kdodge/015.jpg

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I just found my copy of the entry list to Indy in 1969. Wally Booth is listed in the SS/E 1969 Dodge. Dick Oldfield isn't in the list at, but the Iron Butterfly is under the name "Jeg Spehar" with the same competition number Dick ran on the car at Dallas later on that year, #1341.

I don't mean to confuse things, but I'm still pretty sure Dick was in the Butterfly at Indy that year.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...ntrylist-5.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...ntrylist-8.jpg

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Mopar Steve, I saw the Butterfly race several times in the fall of 69. At Indy Us Nats and at the Drag News Open @ Columbus were Vanke set
the SS/C record with his 65 car while Grumpy sat in the stands just a week or so before the finals at Dallas. I Think. Its all a blur.

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Question? Where is the Butterfly now. Question? Could this car be the same car raced by the Fink Brothers / Rod Shop, Then DeFrank and Cohen, now Rick Johnson. A few changes , motor, fenders, hood and grill would do it. I sure would like to know for certain. Anybody got pictures of Ray Wilkes 65 Dodge Hemi car.

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

No clue where the Butterfly is now. Ted has tried chasing it in the past. Not the same car as Fink's, DeFrank's, or Johnson's. I think I have a pic of Wilkes' car on my other computer.

-Steve

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Question? Where is the Butterfly car now. Question? Could the Butterfly be the same car raced by the Fink Brothers ? Rod Shop owned. Then to DeFrank and Cohen and then to Rick Johnson. A few changes, motor, hood, fenders, and grill. I sure would like to know. Anybody have pictures of Ray Wilkes 65 Dodge hemi car they can post.

Re: Original Hemi Dart Information
 

Thought I would post an update on my quest to find the history of my car,since it's been awhile . I have been in doing alot of emailing back & forth with Jimi Vignogna, Lou's son, in regards to getting past the stigma of my car being being either one of Charlie Castaldo's Darts. Well, after showing him MANY pictures, & comparing them to the mods. that have not been done to my car,I can finally say,that Jimi & I are on the same page.He believes that 100% my car can't be a Castaldo car. Now, with that behind me, I can continue forward. Jimi says he's got a bunch of pictures of my car when his dad purchased it in the early 80's.I can only hope he can find those!!! Jimi, any luck yet??? It would make this a whole bunch easier!!! Paul Ceasrine & Mark Janaky have been a wealth of information on this also,& sure is appreciated. Anything new with you guys??.
I'll keep you posted as I get more.

Liteweight
Daryl

Re: Original hemi dart information
 

[QUOTE=Mopar Steve;155433]Good question, like I said, I know he ran the '64 Dodge at Indy as well. Possibly a few divisional races too, I had never asked about the divisional entries on the car. Note that he is running a Division 1 number.

As a point of reference, permanent competition numbers were not assigned by NHRA until the 1974 season. Prior to that time numbers were assigned for individual events with no regard for a particular division.

c

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Rick Johnson does owen The Butterfly and has run the car very successfully in SS/Ba since the late 80's. We had a great chat with Larry Morgan at Brainerd about the car.

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Ted & Tina Spehar both told me last summer that tried finding the car unsuccessfully. Tina still has the title in her name to the car.

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Yeah....hide in plain sight. Nice pic in National Dragster this week of the car in Larry Morgan's article.

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It has been fifteen to twenty years ago, I was at the US Nats at Indy, at the Adams Mark reunion show buying t - shirts from the late Dick Towers ( matchrace madness shirts ) when up walked Ted Spehar to greet the other fellows standing around, When I asked Mr. Spehar where the Butterfly had gone he told me that the Rod Shop got the car. Now I know that they had many cars and drivers, but I do believe that was the only 64 Dodge they owned. A lot of time has passed since then, thats what I remember, if I am wrong it is because the information was wrong.

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Gary,
Got a little info on it - Denny was there at the reunion on Sat. E-mail me
dart4261964@yahoo.com
Mark J

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Carroll Fink actually had owned the car. I'll have to get in touch with Ted and ask again.

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Jason,
Do any photo's exist of your uncle's Dart at 9/69 at Indy.
Or, at the X/SS big meet at York, 8/24/69.
Daryl (Liteweight), Thanks for mentioning on helping. Hopefully, something will turn up. May search in another direction for you. Possibly, Staten Island, New York. Big Mopar race bed their. Have not been able to find any 68' Hemi Cars (originally owned) out of that area. Staten Island Speed was pretty big in that area.
Paul

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Mark J,
Any information on a Hemi Dart (68' thru 70') sponsored by a
S & S (Auto Parts, or Speed Parts, or Engineering).
Or, lost info or whereabouts of the 'Manhattan Speed & Power", Dart, and whether it was an automatic or 4-speed. Other than that the motor
blew.
The "Deb's Automotive" SS/BA Dart out of Springfield, Mass. area
most likely competed in A/MP, after its brief run in S/S. Those guys were into tunnel-rams and Modified/Production classes before alot of other
northeastern racers.
On that first Charlie Castaldo Dart, (2) specific items. (1) The Cool-Can
was inserted into the fender-well (fabricated cut-out with rubber-ring).
(2) That car had utilized air-shocks (for a short period), and the air-filler inlet was located on the trunk floor, to the right side (passenger side) of the trunk.
Paul

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I just talked to Carrol a couple of days ago. He said he drove the 64 with a max wedge and steel front end. He told me he did not know where the car went as Gil Kirk owned it !!!!

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Talked to Rick Johnson about the missing history of the Butterfly. Does anyone know about the ownership between Rod Shop and DeFrank? Rick and Lynn Balek think it spent some time in Louisiana. They also remember the car running in Brainerd in 71 with a max wedge.

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Another NE Dart.

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Steve,
Thats the better photo of Bob Ramstrom's Dart. The earlier photo's of the Dart, has the same paint scheme, but with Natick Dodge lettered on the door panel. Also, earlier car (circa 1968) had white steel rims for the
front, and factory 15" x 8" black steel rims for the slicks. Photo you posted looks like (circa, 1969/1970). Nice photo.
You always come through!
Paul

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Mark J (68Hemi's),
Tracing Sam Dell Dodge, Syracuse, New York.
Did an original Dart go through that dealership?
As for the pictures on Bill Flynn's "Yankee Peddler".
1968 sponsored by 'County Dodge' (New Haven, Conn.)
Sometime in 69', changed grille and had car re-painted later in the year
with different 'Bill Flynn' lettering. Went to script style on the name, instead of box-lettering. Yes, the bumble-bee (69' split type) was added.
Chorches Motors, Manchester, Conn. (central Connecticut) sponsored the car.
But they were the same car. I think 'Woody's' out of New Britain, Conn.
did the paint job on the Dart (second paint job).
Paul

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Mark J,
Are you still out there.
Van Dyke Dodge out of 11 Mile Road, Warren, Michigan.
(2) Hemi Darts came out of there. No info anywhere though.
* Marty Reagan
* John Rivers
Maybe photos from Detroit Dragway out there somewhere?
Paul

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Marty Regan? The Irish Rover car? This was originally Gil Clark's who sold it to Ron Mancini. Ron won Indy with it in 1970. Marty Regan bought it from him and had it up until recently.

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Sorry if it's been mentioned but I didn't read the entire 11 pages. But there is a guy in WI that organized the Hemi Reunion that has all the Vins for the LO and BO cars with history on most.

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That's Mark, 68hemiss on here.

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Mopar Steve,
Thank you for correcting that.
It was posted, that Marty Reagan and a John Rivers purchased new
S/S Hemi Darts from Van Dyke Dodge in Warren, Michigan. But that information was 'Incorrecto mundo".
The Gil Clark/Ron Mancini/Marty Reagan car. Is that the #5 car.
Somebody out there in that Michigan area got to the Hurst Performance
"Skunkworks" Facility in Madison Heights, and brought a car or two to
Van Dyke Dodge.
Paul

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Jerry,
I'm not 100% sure on the NHRA ET record for SS/B in 68'.
But I think Don Grotheer set the SS/B record in mid-year with a
10.91 @ 131.19, with the white 'Cable Chrysler-Plymouth' Cuda.
And suprisingly, Bill Stiles had the SS/BA record with a 11.06,
with the white steel-rimmed Cuda.
Of course, that shoots down all the claims of the cars running
10.50's right out of the box, unless everyone was riding their brakes through the traps.
PC

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Paul - Sorry for the lengthy delay in my response. I don't have many pictures of my uncle's cars prior to the Missile. I went through his scrapbook, and didn't find anything definite from Indy in '69, but most of the pictures / articles in the scrapbook aren't dated. For now, I just have to take my uncle's word for it that he was at Indy in '69 with his Dart, unless somebody can prove otherwise.

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How is this? This is from a 1970 Dodge Scat Pack book. The background of the images ID them as Indy, except the Behemoth pic which looks like Pomona.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...1no25-Copy.jpg