Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Now you're going to have to explain just what it is that I'm tap dancing about. Aftermarket aluminum intakes on combos that didn't come with aftermarket aluminum intakes aren't stock and shouldn't be legal in Stock. That simple.
OBTW, I'm not much of a dancer.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

|You are still tap dancing Billy, I have asked multiple times, how much hp can be prodiced by after market blocks or blocks never in other combos?

After market and performance blocks were never installed either. Or does this question, throw a real wrench into your complaint.

And I never said, you were a good dancer, a hell of a good racer but not a dancer

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I reenergized post but I've said very little since .
You've never asked me the question directly. I'll give you my take on it. I build my own engines for better or worse. My performance level with my car is respectable. I have a production block in my car that has been honed 3 times and holds a pretty round cylinder. I have good ring seal and a pretty sound reworked oiling system to keep from running over my main and rod bearings going down the track at the RPM I run it at.

I have a new aftermarket block that is being machined to replace my block. For the most part it will have all the same parts in it as the engine I run now. Same heads and intake that I run will go on this new piece. I would be very suprised if it's 5 Hp better. It should stay round all the time from first hone on. One of the draw backs is its 46 pounds heavier than my stock block. Now the car has to be changed around to offset that. When I run it I'll tell you how much it's better than the stock block. If I had my choice, I'd take the better heads and intake any day.

No tap dancing here. Does that satisfy your question from the Pontiac end? BTW do you build any engines or even race stock.

I don't blame anyone who races that combo, especially Tom,Jerry, or Steve. They did the homework, the r&d and put it into action. They are all hard workers and stand up guys. It's up to us as their competition to try and keep up.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I am building a 67/68 cuda right now and to answer your question I bought two 340 dealer replacement blocks and have them sleeved down to a 318 bore. I plan on doing my own short block and have shane studley do my heads.

And I have heard that aftermarket blocks get a hell a lot more hp than 5.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

David, I hate to rain on your parade but if you have a cast iron block with 8 hardened steel sleeves in it then your deal is better than a cast iron aftermarket block.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

[QUOTE=David Lee;

And I have heard that aftermarket blocks get a hell a lot more hp than 5.[/QUOTE]

I agree!!!!!!!!!! 10HP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll take the heads and intake! Probably worth 60HP

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Well I'm about 60 short of Jerry so hopefully that new block will get me close. I hope Warren Johnson, or somebody of that caliber told you that. I should be in good shape then. Thanks for clearing that up. Good luck with your project

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

So you are against all aftermarket heads too?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Todd, All I want is an even playing field across the board. Nothing more

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

For you 71 and later 340 guys there is a Thermoquad adapter in the direct connection catalog that should be easy to get approved. It's from Edlebrock too.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

So just what is it about your 318 combo that you feel isn't fair?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I never said there was anything unfair about my combo, but there are combos who can't find any replacement blocks such as you

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

If someone building a combo is so concerned about the lack of availability of an aftermarket block, then he should build a different combo and buy the block of choice. I always say, the planning is the hardest part.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Really, you are willing to eliminate that many combos.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

But I'm not complaining about not having a replacement block. I'm complaining about combos that are being given aluminum aftermarket intake manifolds in Stock!

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

David, you apparently don't know many hardcore Stock Eliminator racers.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Like I said in the previous post, that is the reason why people fill their blocks.
Others sleeve them.
A properly filled or sleeved block, machined with the right equipment and by someone that knows what they are doing, will make power.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I would be concerned if that 68-71 318 piston with valve reliefs is legal or not. That's a **** load of HP right there that no aftermarket block or head will make up for. Just my 2 cents.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I'm all for aftermarket heads. If Everyone Can Have Them!
Main benefit of a aftermarket block is take the hone better last longer but is heaver
You have aftermarket block and sleved it? Really
Reinventing the wheel ?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

David, it would be a good idea to fill them also. A stock 340 typically has about a .100" thick wall and if you run it as a .060" 318, you'll have approx .135" which won't break but it won't make great power either. A lot of aftermarket blocks have about .300" walls.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

how did you determine that? And you really are so target focused on a couple of mopar engines having a intake that you think they should not have is limiting you to see the full picture. I am done, you can'y convince someone who is not willing to listen

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

350 blocks rare or something? Why would they even approve an after-market block to replace something that can be found in any junkyard in America?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I was planning that already, when I ready to start my engine, everything will be loaded up for a trip out to Shane's place in Utah and brought back home for assembly. Right now I look like a ghost from body filler from working on the roof

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

That *is* the topic of the thread. And what do you mean that he "thinks" they should not have? It's an aftermarket performance intake, and it didn't come on production cars. Period. What's so difficult to understand about that? If you want to run an aftermarket intake, run Super Stock. It's funny how people work so hard to get aftermarket parts approved that "aren't worth any power or ET".

If you want to start a thread on blocks, feel free to do so. That too should be either everybody can have them, or nobody can have them. Happy?

It's also funny how people derided crate motors for years... NHRA is turning into nothing but crate motors, between the "Factory" cars and all of the aftermarket and superceded parts.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Todd you have a PM.

Rick Thomason
GTOMayhem

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Do you men have anything better to do?

All these parts are accepted within the rules. Even all the Parts for GM cars. Like 200 transmissions behind big blocks and 3 speeds in all the power glide only cars. Your beloved GM saw fit to produce these vehicles with just two forward gears, and now you are blessed with an extra gear and still point the finger at the others, well look in the mirror.

No, none of this Is fair, but it is legal according to your sanctioning body.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

I don't know much about this combo. Did it come with an aluminum intake from the factory??

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

It's all baloney, but it is legal.

340 didn't come with aluminum intake, 396-427 never came with a 200 trans, and all those powerglide cars never came with a 3 speed. Why not give all combos and extra non overdrive gear?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

What do transmissions have to do with this thread. It's about an Edlebrock manifold that has been recognized as a superseded part that, was not legal for 45 years, and now all of a sudden even though it hasn't been made in 20 plus years is legal.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Maybe you need to talk to the people who approved the manifold, or for that matter, a whole bunch of other approvals of components. Don't forget that these people have already proved that they can take a whole combo and reclassify it to make it better or worse. A component is just minimal.

It is their sandbox, their rules, and their interpretations, and it is not going to stop.

Now, go back to this thread and continue your debates.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA I'll just write this letter.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Greg I'm expanding the mud slinging to show all of you that every make has bogus parts that FIT into the house rules at NHRA.

I don't agree wi it either, along with many other obviously wrong decisions.

So which part is the worst offender, the latest and greatest?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

All this assumes the LD-340 is worth something. When we did a A-B-A swap/test vs. a OE 71 340 #2100 intake, it was worth a grand total of zero point zero.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

Back in the early 70s I did an A-B swap at Hampton Raceway between the stock 69 440 intake and an Edelbrock CH4B, the car ran identical to the hundredth. The engine was a bracket race 426 street wedge with a Holley 4779. I did a lot of flow work with a stock 2100 intake and was very impressed how much better it was than the AVS intake.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

you can dance just loosen up your laces

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

you have a source for standard deck ht 59 degree aftermarket mopar small block blocks?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

that is not the point, how many other combos do not have any option? Billy and other people are being myopic by only wanting to look at one or two mopar manifolds and want to ignore other combos that get an updated block, and replacement carbs.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

You can have a block. Stop crying. You are the second coming of theDROoZe
Imagine if you had the 340 combo you have a reason to babble
Go back and sleeve your block and make some magic.
If you half your energy into your 318. As you do in this thread you may get somewhere

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

wow, did you actually read what i typed or did you just react?

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

This thread is killing me. I don't know if I should start to build a Mopar Stocker or pack drag racing in all together.

Re: Important if you run D-H/S or SA
 

That's a load of B.S. right there lol. Some of us know exactly what that LD 340 intake was worth on the exact combo in question . I'm not taking anything away from the guys who made it happen they did the homework they convinced NHRA to allow the use of this intake and went on from there and did what they needed to do to make it work ..
I Guess next is going to be how hard it is to find a
Good stock Q jet and let us bolt on Fuel injection.
Maybe even a Aluminium D port head some day .
I will let you know what the side by side comparison is on those cause it's probably Zero point Zero as well.
No assuming here lol.