Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

During these uncertain economic times I can't help but wonder how many racers are leveraged beyond their financial capabilities. I've heard stories of maxed credit, mortgaged homes, etc. I know there are several class racers who have the capital to operate within a respectable budget without interference of their daily lives. But I also know some who have "bet the ranch" on keeping their "program" at full tilt.

With all the doom and gloom coming from media outlets ordinarily isolated from typical mainstream hype, I wonder how many racers will fall victim to these unforseen circumstances? As housing prices plummet it has to have put several racers in a precarious state such as "upside down" equity. Or how many have reconsidered their direction and started shoring up losses by liquidating their operation to keep a roof over their heads?

There's a wide spectrum of personalities in this sport and how each of these individuals approach such difficult choices. Some will make the gamble and continue, keeping racing at the top, with an optimistic outlook that this is only temporary. Others will opt on the side of conservatism and pass on events. In the last few recession cycles wealth seemed to shift between various resources. But this time it looks like there aren't any new prospects, at least in my opinion. I wished there were a crystal ball to let us see into the future, both near and far term. For now though, fuel prices alone have made me very hesitant even for local participation.

I'd like to keep this a serious thread and hope others share the same sentiments, especially those who side on optimism as it's a subject I'm taking very seriously. This is by no means an attempt to "air someone's laundry" poke fun at, or make anyone look bad. Ultimately this could have a serious impact on our sport sooner than later.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Good post. NASCAR is pricing the fans out of the seats too.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Gary


I have never had the needle that far into my arm that I would finance , leverege or charge anything related to racing . If I dont have the cash in my hand it wont happen period...

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Gary, very good article but I'm afraid this might be the sign of the times.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

i am a farely new member to this site have been racing for over 20 years,had a few different drag cars,the step up to class racing this year will not happen due to the engine not being ready,,but i am still able to do bracket racing at my local track for now,i have made a ton of changes to the chassis of my car i hopes of being ready for a divisional race,but i even passed on the opening day at the track to get the car down the track after all of the changes that i made,reason is abvious the cost of fuel,race fuel,entry fees,at this point in the game my race program is loan free and i own it(truck,trailer,race car, tools,)the vehicals that i drive are all over 10 years old,i have a 9 year old son and of coarse my wife and between the two of us we make ok money,we certainly do not live any kind of high standard of life,but we live in the state of connectitciut,the car and property taxes are crazy,home heating fuel is nuts,i pay bills in the family and it makes me sick what an average family has to make to in order to survive,in my younger days i would leave lights on,doors open,computers running all night,shops lights on all night,long showers,a/c on all day,heat on all day,spend money like it grew on trees,now!!!!!! different story i make the wife and kid wear extra clothing,put a lock on the thermostate, to keep the heat down,"enough with hour shower",chasing lights,shop on ebay,i even brokedown and started using coupons, and so on, just so i can at least continue to do a little racing,one of my racing buddys has money to burn,he just purchased a twin screw blower for his race deal "$6500.00" just for the blower,thats my race budget for three years

i cant complain ,iknow of alot of people who are in diar straights because of the present economy,when times where good i looked at those people "said these guys are making money hand over fist what am i doing wrong"now there asking me if my comany that i work for is hiring

i read some storys on people who have purchased $400,000.00-500,000.00 homes with no money down on a varible rate and now face $3000.00-$5000.00 monthly morgage payments ,whos mistake was that,the people buying the home or the lenders?


they say "when it goes bad,it realy goes bad" not offend any one on this site, just my .02 cents your average joe GMONDE

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

we were planning a second stocker, now it will just be a footbrake car. mostly to get shots at the tree when we can't afford to travel

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

In Canada many of us are watching the troubled U.S. economy and wondering ?if? and ?when? the ripple effect will make it?s way north of the border. There?s an old saying that goes something like this, ?When the U.S. sneezes, Canada catches a cold?.

Presently, our economy is still robust, especially in the western prairies where the ?oil patch? drives much of the growth. With $110+ per barrel oil, it seems unlikely ?Big Oil? will slow production. They will continue harvesting as long as the price holds out.

We see it every day, the people who have stars in their eyes and truly believe the ?well won?t run dry?. The huge house, big diesel pickup, an SUV and of course then there?s the toys. In most cases financed to the max. Mostly young folks but others who should know better too. Don?t get the wrong idea, I?m not slamming the young people of our respective countries. We were all young once. These people help to drive the economy because they ?are? young and full of piss and vinegar and not afraid to spend money. On the other hand there are some of us who are a little more seasoned and we remember the 80?s and early 90?s when our economy went sideways. Interest rates went through the roof, inflation was in the stratosphere, there were no jobs, few prospects etc. etc. The banks were the largest land owners in western Canada. The oil industry was stagnant and life in general was bleak. The young guys haven?t had those experiences ? at least not yet. It?s hard for them to believe an economic downturn could be just around the corner,
Back then there used to be a bumper sticker out this way and it said, ?Lord, please let there be another Oil Boom and I promise not to piss it away this time?.

Can we learn from our history? It?s been said life is a cycle of events.
There?s going to be some who aren?t going to make it through this financially and it will take years to recover if at all. It?s easy to sit in judgment on how others have spent their money, but remember life can change in a heartbeat. A lot of good people are going to get hurt.
These people are our friends and neighbors and will need our moral support when times get tough.

Chuck

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Chuck ~ Good post. From behind my desk (I'm a CPA) I see so many people who live way beyond their means. It's been going on for years and now it's catching up to these people. They've run out of the ability to refinance their homes to pay off credit cards, car loans, etc. and they have little to no savings. Yet, they still spend. It amazes me to no end. I had a couple come in the other day...in their early 30's, two kids. Last year they decided she should be a stay-at-home Mom so she quit her job. She withdrew her 401(k) funds and they put in a pool. He works in the construction industry so hasn't been working full-time for most of this year. Now they owe income tax (and early withdrawal penalty), have no money and are crying the blues. I don't know what they were thinking when they made the decisions they did!!

So many people are used to spending on credit, it somehow doesn't feel like they are spending real money. They buy now and worry about how they are going to pay for it later. Or they don't realize how much extra they pay when it's "only" costing them a $100 per month payment. It sure is different from how I was raised. My Dad only financed business equipment purchases and paid it off as soon as possible. If he couldn't pay cash for racecar stuff, trips, extras, it didn't happen. They drove used cars, my Mom cooked dinner virtually every night, they saved to put up for their retirement. Thankfully, I had a good example to follow. I think one of the most important things we can teach our children is fiscal responsibility.

As for my racing? I have an open trailer I tow with, my car could use a paint job, I don't have the trick parts and I only race 4-5 times a year. I have a son in law school and a daughter working towards her nursing degree. They are my priority. I won't jeopordize my family's finances for a racecar.

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Those people that are upside down in their home mortgage put themselves there, with the help of unscrupulous lenders and developers, and the idiots that maxed their credit cards, then covered them with "home equity" that NEVER existed.

When you finance 125% of the home value, WHO is at fault for being upside down?:rolleyes:

Has anyone seen the teevee commercial where the realtor claims that home values double every 10 years?
WTF over?

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

I've got the race car being extensively worked on. The money is put away so I can pay cash when it's done. I do a lot of wheeling and dealing to buy what I want for the race car. I sold two clutches to pay for my new dual 7" clutch. A bunch of other parts sitting on the shelf collecting dust no longer appear important when making improvements to the car, so they make it to e-bay. The timing of these repairs / modifications is perfect because if the car were done today, I wouldn't race it more than a few times this year and that would be at a T&T only just to see if it all works, no NHRA events. With real estate (I'm a Realtor) basically in the toilet, I can't justify spending a dime of the families income on racing. I'm with Julie and others. Never been (or ever plan) to be a "full-time" racer and I use my Expedition and an open trailer to get to the races.
One year I raced both S/ST & Stock and it was a great year for real estate. At the end of the year I figured my income was down $30K+ due to that splurge from opportunity lost scenario. That was the end of that!
And please, anybody that believes borrower's didn't know what they were getting into, do I have some beach-front property in Arizona for you! The Lenders only became "predatory" when the borrower's figured out the home was no longer appreciating at 25% to 50% per year. Then all the sudden it became important to read the contract! I have no sympathy for those people who treated their home like an ATM.
Last I heard, the oil company's were operating on the same profit margins as any other successful business in the USA, around 8% - 10%. If you want to lower the gross profits of the oil companies, stop buying petroleum based products. Taxes per gallon are higher than profits per gallon. Figure out what programs or services you can live without and the gas tax will come down.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

you know its funny every one seams to know a person or a friend who is way over there head (spends or think they can spend a ton of money on there love of the hobby ,when in reality they cant afford to pay attention) i have a freind of mine who is building an altered,nice piece he builds chassis on the side,very talented builder,knows what he's doing,but thats where it ends,he has to have top of the line stuff,carbon fiber this ,billet aluminum that, he was proud to show me a set of rear brakes that cost $1200.00 cool parts but its a shame that the car he is building will never see the track,if he would of did some cutting back on the high price stuff mite have a car ready to go,,,moral of the story

dont go top fuel racing on a slot car budget gmonde

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

I know what your all saying, back when i was doing alot of announcing i always looked at what kind of jobs some racers have and then looked at their rigs and thought to myself, man they have good bankers, i see so many borrowed up to there neck in $$$$ that they will never see the sunny side again.

How some do it is beyond me.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

I've been a budget racer since the beginning and that was in the '60's. I consider myself to be extremely lucky...I have been a nat'l record holder...raced many cars and classes. Won races from a nat'l event to a division event and some bracket races. I sold my stocker in order to go back to local racing. I put togetjer a dragster and spent a lot of money...todays prices are very high for everything. I just returned form a day/nite at my local track, It's less than a 1/2 hour from home, Made 6 runs to get my license back for S/C and ET. My car is paid for. My trailer is paid for. My tow tuck is 12 years old and works fine....and is paid for. I had lots of fun with my old friends and I have many. I enjoy myself wherever I go racing and I don't need to win a Wally ( I have them already) every time I race. Race within your budget and stick to it. Once upon a time I thought a person could come out ahead in racing......that is not true except maybe for a very tiny minorty of racers...racing and staying in the black on the ledger is not happening......have fun race within your budget.....that's what I do and have always done......Wallys get dusty and mine sit right next to my bowling trophys......and my Dale Earnhardt and NY Yankees collection of stuff.......they are all good to me and some cost way to much money to get.......the drag racing stuff is at the top of the "spent too much money to get" list......

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Time to spill some beans. I did my acts of "credit stupidity" with my first race car, and learned a valuable lesson, thankfully, when there was opportunity to turn it around. Lately I can't get out of my head the stories told by mine and my wife's grandparents about the great depression and how they saved every resouce they could to survive.


Jeff, I've heard different numbers, depending on who says it, and what side of the money table they're sitting on. Steve, I'll vouch for your info.

I had the unfortunate experience to live in Fairfield County CT. between 1981 - 1985. I say this with conviction since it was the most miserable 5 years of my life, having to survive on the outside of the most vulgar of high society hippocrites in this country. The town I lived in was home to Raleigh Warner, then chairman of Mobil, and his slimy-marry-into-wealth son in law Percy Pyne. Raleigh was a cold blooded businessman, understanding the future of oil and how it would drive this country to incomprehensive dependency. He didn't care about humanity, only how much wealth it would generate for himself, and his legacy. Percy cashed out (the last I checked) and became a "real estate barron" in NYC. These kind of people have so much capital behind them they can afford to buy the media and shield the truth from our unsuspecting nation.

This truth is becoming increasingly difficult to shelter almost daily each time those numbers on gas station signs increase by ludicrous increments. What's more vulgar is listening to many of those so-called "expert" Wall Street mouthpieces (CNBC, CNN, Bloomberg) try to sidestep this truth, explaining how "oil will not have an impact on our economy, and will continue to be stable"??????????? WTF does that mean? How stupid do these idiots think American consumers really are? When pockets are empty, game over...period. Only now add in the housing and subprime "bubble" markets, although a separate crisis', but ultimately the price gouging from oil business actually burst the bubble. Otherwise we'd be watching rapid double digit inflation take off like a rocket, making the Carter era look like child's play.

Enter hurricaine season 2004. I saw this train coming after we were hit by two storms then another in 2005, witnessing "For Sale" signs pop up on lawns in droves. Nonetheless until we as a nation change our habits on how we spend, what we listen to or watch, and understand who and what we're voting for, I fear the big storm is yet to hit, and the death of drag racing will be the least of our worries. But I pray I'm wrong.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Gary if you want an economics lesson....Maybe you watched the recent PBS show...John Adams......Yes, it was a very differnet time but take a look at how France's rulers were dealt with...If enough people say enough already from the super rich and the beaurocrats..."heads can roll" they did in France in the French Revolution.....The one thing that makes America great...we dump the leaders every 8 years or less in elections instead of chopping off their heads.......

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Good discussion. No one on this thread has mentioned the Cash in a Flash corner loan stores and their evil.Another example of something flying under the radar of the government and taking advantage of the less informed. As regards government and its responsibility seems most in government support more worrying about getting elected than doing what is BEST for the country. Unfortunately many voters are going for something for nothing policies. If it takes a tax to pay for it the result is anything but cheap the loss of money in doing it the government way is extreme...waste or inefficiency.
Our racing will take the "hit" for many reasons and fuel prices to our businesses, sponsors, food stores and heating costs will be the cause. It wont need to be the towing costs. Personal overhead is going higher in many ways. At least the cost of health care is further off the front page today.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Some of us are still lucky enough to be able to race,but I personally am having a hard time justifying spending the money on inflated fuel prices.More than a dollar a gallon more just does not compute for me whether I have the money or not.On the other Hand I want to support the tracks and sanctioning bodies but I am afraid we are going to see a lot more local track racing for the average racer.
In this vein Ralph Galuzzi took over Lancaster Speedway(now Dunn Tire Raceway) and raised the pots to 1000.00 to win attracting more of those racers who normally went to all the divisionals but aren't now because of the cost.I heard there were only 22 stockers and a little more than a dozen Super Stockers at MIR,and poor sportsman turn outs at NHRA tracks as well. Looks like it is back to the home town stuff for a lot of people.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

just add a few things,i dont know what all of you in on this disscusion do for work or own for bussineses but,the company that i work for is a family owned transportation bus charter/international dealership and is a good place to work but a challenging job and expectations are high,we have a monthly budget goal for every month(like other companys) but in order to meet these goals all of the stars,suns,moons,have to be in perfect alingment to make this happen,there bussines partner (the bank)looks at this month to month, now here is the fun part,as i am brought in the the monthly interigation room with the first comment starting out as"our numbers suck this month",well you didnt have to tell me that i know the numbers suck"we cant run like this"and looking at the budget numbers its not a wonder why they dont meet monthly budget,over head is way over its no wonder we cant meet these numbers ,these numbers are based on the best economic times when you quoted a engine rebuild(in chassis rebuild) for $10,000,00 the normal responce was "i need it just do it" it was easy ,but now its more like ,"i send the wrecker over to get it " but how bad is it really ,the owner has more toys than you can shake a stick at,the owners kid who graduated high school gets a new hummer,(we will see that in the shop all smashed up i am sure) this company runs over a 1,000 pieces of equiptment and i am well aware of the cost of running a transportation bussiness is not cheap and of coarse fuel impacting bussines cost so are we crying wolf or is this the real deal just another day in paradise gmonde

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Excellent point(s) Dick. I still value the simple, survival methods of my Southern roots (my dad's side of family) and the resourceful lessons that got me through some lean times. I could never comprehend the many complexities of accounting, but understood the importance of saving money, only stepping out of bounds a couple of instances. I can't help but have cynical thoughts in this present day of complex technology and legal jargon that separates the haves & have-nots it has created a great divide between the two. The results allow the highly educated "haves" to prey upon old fashioned hard working "have-nots" through influential thinking which ultimately separates them from their hard earned money. Only now we're seeing results in epidemic proportions.

Where I live there's great contrast in population between Northeastern "city slickers" and Southern "country folk". So it's no surprise to see many of these "cash-in-a-flash" sometimes next door to pawn shops. Our state (Florida) is also experiencing a health care system meltdown, possibly a result of similar circumstances. I mentioned (I think) a few years back about our local Yellow Pages having like 10 pages of doctors but over 30 for trial and injury lawyers, perhaps explaining why lawyers who prey upon the uninformed in greedy, tribal-ritualistic like ways. The influential push of instant gratification in today's society is like a drug habit to many, forcing good hearted honest people into bad fiscal prioritization. Sadly, I still hear stories like this amongst racers; those who've bought the best of everything, but can't feed their families, mortgaged the house sometimes 3 times over for that pusher-diesel coach, and forgo health insurance (and don't realize the devastation until it's too late).

Again, I don't want to sound off against anyone and really want this to be a non-agenda thread. But I know I'm not alone in my way of thinking or setting about this dream called Stock Eliminator. I have struggled against the odds trying to enter into this sport for MANY years, yearning for that elusive "Wally", a desire to set a record, and the respect of my peers, still waiting here in my 40s, and wondering if I'll ever get there. I?ve made many personal sacrifices that have allowed for small, simple, albeit progressive goals. But only because I didn't want to end up in the streets with my family to accomplish this dream.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Perhaps a "home Economics" course in High School. Make it mandatory for the last two years. could take the place of any required French or Spanish language courses. WOW what a radical idea!

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Being a physician trained in the 60s I have had my share of ups and downs financially. I graduated without a single course in " how to make money" How to keep money" or what to do with money. I was lucky I only did what I could pay for when it came to everything including racing.I had financed all my education so it took a while to repay.I learned about business of money as I went.
Yesterday I visited a Opthmology school with our son. I was impressed, oh yes they had equipment, they had personel but the big impressive point was they started first year of the four year school with personal finance, business investing, how to evaluate a medical practice, and how to create a financially secure future with stock and investing. These classes are part of the required courses for four years. What an improvement. WE ALL NEED EDUCATION on money issues.
I know many people are in the same boat. No education on how to save wisely, understand medical costs, how to get better educations.It should be required to leave highschool even if you are quitting school.
It does start at home. My parents were wonderful but my Grandparents and uncles personally discussed the future goals for me and what I wanted to be in the future and encouraged me to move up the ladder in education for my family and the future.I am extremely lucky to have had encouragement but I pushed for opportunities also.
It is then dependent on the education system to provide open doors for us to attain these goals. In many states people vote against money for education, allow their children to give up school, roam the streets. That becomes a cultural issue.We need to take responsibility. We need to encourage our families to excell, to move ahead. It has been said our generation is the great generation and unless we encourage greatness from our families our country will not continue to be the greatest country on the planet.Other countries are hungrier for money, food and EDUCATION>
Greatness of our country is at stake now. We need to work together to educate ourselves on good practices and reasonable expectations and motivation of our children for tomorrow. These are the "changes" we need . Personal changes and family changes which will translate to national changes and recapturing the greatness of our country.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

By the way, it took me 27 years to get my "race car", I collected the first part for it in 1967 or so.....
It was almost totally built from dumpster meat, but I had no payments, on anything, before I went racing. The car itself was my $38 invested daily driver for over 5 years. Once it started getting used for a shop loaner/parts chaser, I started in on it for a Saturday night beater.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

I have had the pleasure of working for a Japanense auto transplant company for 18 years, know before many of you start hating me please take a few minutes to read my view. For many decades we as Americans have been living high on the hog without much effort. Workiing for a Japanense company for this amount of time I have seen very big changes and not for the good. When I started their were many Japanense visuable at the plant, with their decrease so has the majority of our work ethic. The Japanense people have a much higher work ethic then we do ( I have seen this during a trip to Japan). I have seen our company become westernized just like so many others, work force wants more and more without giving anything back. What has happened to an honest 8 hours work for and good pay. We pay associates $160 extra a month to show up for work each day, but still people use the system of family leave or bogus medical leave to get out of work. We as a society need to wake up, like someone pointed out others around the world are more willing to bust their *** then we are.

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observations from this post...

first of all ive raced same car for 28 years, tow with a 91 suburban open trailer and a tent...

1. jeff's right everyone should be responsible for thier own debt...however we will see your and my tax dollars used by our government to bail them all out here soon... BS
2. sign me up for the revolution to overthrow the government...i dont mind the taxes... it is how they spend it that kills me each and every day.
3. fuel costs have affected my schedule already, missed my 1st ever patscajunnationals :(
4. economics should be a prequisite for high school diploma

with two kids one in college one in private high school and NO CHILD SUPPORT...
i can barely afford to do anything... but a few times a year i get to race !!!

good news... i own 53% of my house and total credit card (& other debts) is currently under $200

jack

and the indexes are so easy i can still go -1.00 ( just had to get that in )

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Jack,

You hit the nail on the head. Thank you for such an outstanding reflection on what we "all" need to be taking care of.

Vote Ron Paul this year for the Revolution you want to sign up for.

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Very early in life I learned that cash makes no enemies; or bill collectors. Yes, we still need credit for our homes and other big ticket items.

Drag racers are not the only crazies out there. I have a friend who has loaded his plastic by taking high dollar golf trips. He's spending tens of thousands of dollars each year on these trips. I think he's out of his mind. Another friend has gone crazy over Harley Davidson bikes. He has three of them and "thinking" about buying another one. And don't forget the high dollar fishing and hunting camps. The list is endless. To each his own - but be careful.

Our economy is swirling around the edge of a black hole and I really hope that we can turn this thing around before we are sucked in.

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Government Regulation is NEVER THE ANSWER TO ANY PROBLEM!!!!!!!
If the Government Local, State and Federal was a business they would be out of business in a short period of time. Too inefficient!!!!!!
One of the other posts has it right on Politicians also. Most are only interested in election or re-election.
It should not be whether it is Republician or Democratic issue it should whether it is the right thing to do for the COUNTRY AS A WHOLE!!!
It should never be a Red or Blue State Issue it should be a Right Thing Issue.
That is why Congress can't get anything done.
Far To Many Full Time Politicians Who Just Don't Get It!!!
The US really does need a 3rd Political Party. The Party Of The People and THEIR BUSINESS.
Far To Much Money Being Handed Over To Politicians UNDER THE TABLE.
Just take a look at how much money Bill Clinton made for doing not much of anything since leaving the White House. Bush will be doing the same thing soon. Taking money for any influence he might have after leaving the White House.
This Presidental election is the first one I may not vote in for over 40 years. I just do not see a canidate worthy of my vote. I would vote if there was a box for NONE OF THE ABOVE!!!!!!!
Just My 2 Cents

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Bruce,
All you need to understand in our economy is the origin of the "Federal Reserve". Search it, and then research it. Please,for the sake of all that is still good, understand the beast we are all fighting against.

The Federal Reserve.. KNOW YOUR ENEMY!

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The top 4% wage earners pays 96% of all taxes collected. 4% total for the rest of us.(until the 2001 tax cut) So your vote depends almost as much as your personal finances do this time around towards racing expenditures. Most of us will get hit very hard if the alternative tax is re initiated like in the 1990's.

Lynn

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Jason,

I know the deal about the Federal Reserve.

When we break down our current economic problems we will find the route causes to be greed and abuse of power. Nothing new! Painful lessons are never etched in stone. Humans have been repeating these errors since the beginning of time. Sex came first, then physical control came second, gold/resources was third, spiritual control was fourth and now we have all four at the same time; also known as the megamutha. We may go down but we will eventually get back up to complete the cycle.

Ain't nuth'n blow'n in the wind cept for cold hard cash. Dylan's truth.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Lynn,

You have posted this comment about the top 4% of wage earners paying 96% of "all taxes collected" several times before. Please clarify "all taxes collected" for us. I guess you are not including any earnings outside of wages. Correct? I am very interested in knowing how 4% of the wage earners are paying the bill for 280 million Americans. Maybe Dave Ring can help us out with this one.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

I am one who used to spend money all the time. Just tell me what the monthly payments are and where to sign. Working for a new car dealership as a technician, you see the paychecks go up and down a lot. I bracket raced occasionally but never got to serious. Sometime around the turn of the century, I started seeing the work changing, which meant more wildly swinging paychecks. And the last few years have gotten worse. Living in central Ohio, you constantly see in the paper or on the news about companies shutting down. About 4-5 years ago I started getting more into my income/expenses. Total card debt now is less then $400, Tahoe will be paid off in 4 months and house is on the downhill side.

What does all this mean? I bought my Starfire last year to build as a stocker, a dream of mine. Work has been going at a crawl because I am trying to pay for everything as I go. Bargains always help as I found a set of new pistons on ebay for 0.99. Thats right and I was the only bidder. So total with shipping was just over $13! Goal at the beginning of the project was to have it running before the end of '07. It changed to maybe summer/fall of '08. Now I am not sure about making it this fall, maybe by next year. And after it is running, I still need a way to get it to the track. Enclosed trailer would be nice but an open one is looking better all the time.
Guess there are always something more important comes up and our fun hobby will have to take a back seat, :(

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

First of all I?d like to say I am enjoying this thread. There are many valuable comments and insights being presented.

Dick ? I can relate in many ways to what you are saying. One of our son?s is an engineer and he was required to take an economics course. It planted the seed early in his career and he has prospered in part because of it. This wasn?t the case when we were young. In high school we took basic economics and business. You know the drill, how to prepare a budget, write a business letter etc. I suppose it was better than nothing.

Jack ? I particularly like the idea of a mandatory economics class in high school.

When reduced down to it?s simplest form, ?education? is the key. If we are well informed, most people would be less likely to fall into traps such as the sub prime issue. I said ?most? people, but there are a hell of a lot of people who would ignore the warning signs and dive right in.

Denial & Ego
Most of us involved in this sport would like to win. I think that is a given. We also apply that emotion to business or our work. Most of us can keep winning and losing in perspective. However there are those to whom winning and their ?image? is everything. You know who they are. They will sell their soul in order to keep up appearances. There comes a day when you have to pay the piper. It baffles me how some seemingly intelligent people have allowed themselves to get to a point where they are one paycheck away from bankruptcy. This basic ARITHMATIC and they ?DO? teach that in school! Maybe these people are using the New Math?Denial is a powerful thing! Do they deserve a bail out? I think not.

Who was it that said, ?There?s no free lunch?.

Chuck

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Very interesting thread at a very interesting time. I'm lucky enough to race with cash. That's because I'm retired from one state and went right back to work in another doing the same job. Being older I have learned the hard way to operate this way. I built a couple of cars in the 70's with every dollar I could scrape up and not have enough money to race them. I had planned to build an engine to run SS/GT with my car this year, but with fuel prices and uncertianity, I'm holding on for now. I race with the NMCA which has less races and cost less to run. I have always been a fan of NHRA but realized I could not afford it when I started racing Nationaly in 99. I'm very thankful that the NMCA schedule looked good for us last year and we were able to win the championship. We went to the first race in Bradenton and runner-upped this year so we broke even or better on that but will not run all the races this season unless we go to more finals. I love racing as much as anyone but I won't put my family in danger to do it and hope no one else will either. Like someone on here said, you can tell by my tow rig, I run a cash deal. Good luck all and let's hope it gets much better.
Jim Netherland
2007 Nostaglia Super Stock World Champion
1967 Buick GS 400 B/NSS

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

This is a great thread. I have enjoyed the comments.
Dick said:Yesterday I visited a Opthmology school with our son. I was impressed, oh yes they had equipment, they had personel but the big impressive point was they started first year of the four year school with personal finance, business investing, how to evaluate a medical practice, and how to create a financially secure future with stock and investing. These classes are part of the required courses for four years. What an improvement. WE ALL NEED EDUCATION on money issues.
I am really impressed too. I've run my own business for 36 years & have watched other locals come & go. I've had employees that had little or no understanding of business, yet they were considered some of the best @ local high schools. Another thing I have noticed is the younger generations have not been taught to think things out. I would say it is because of teaching "for the test" instead of teaching a student to reason. It is refreshing to see the Opthmology School teaching a student how to stay in business first, then how to do the business second. What good does it do if one is the best in his field & he can't make his business profitable & be a success? These teaching/school issues need our attention & have for a while.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Jason, this is the exact issue that drove me to starting this thread. I encourage everyone to google the Fed Reserve and the ugly truth behind it. I was shocked what I found out.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

oh yea! Good old Ben Franklin & his paper money.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

My truck is paid for so's the trailer---the race car is too owe $1500 on Sears card bought a new washer dryer and stove---BUT I GOT MY HEALTH !!! Other than that liifes great!!! My wife recently retired ,but before she did she was involved with putting on seminars for all types of physicians,These were put on in conjunction with Johns Hopkins Univ. ---These seminars were called "The business of medicine"---Drs. would attend the courses and it was amazing to see such well educated people with not a lick of sense about how much money they were owed or where it all was going too!!!! These guys had receivables that were far in excess of most peoples annual incomes( sometimes in the 100 of thousands of dollars) and yet they did not know this!!! The course was a basic economics course for people with Doctors degrees in medicine kinda like what you might teach to a senior in hi school or en entry level college freshman/sophomore.. When the classes were over you should have heard some of the comments like"wow I never understood where my money was going or why I had never even collected the money in the first place/ or I didn;t know I made that MUCH where is it??? !!!! Sad but true... I live in an area that has become a "yuppie" area the last 10-15 years-These 30 something guys live in 10,000 foot houses worth 2-3 MILLION dollars with real estate tax bills of 40-50 THOUSAND dollars a year-wives don't work --kids in daycare all day---lawn service cuts the grass--- pool guy maintains the pool- and these guys bounce checks all over town---Many are on a cash only basis with the pool/lawn /cleaning lady --PAY BEFORE WE DO THE WORK!!!-My last tax bill on 18 acres of FARM land was $21000 if I subdivided it my tax bill would zoom to $150 THOUSAND on vacant property ----Schools are great but I have a volunteer fire dept--county police protectiion--NO parks-- a library that is mediocre---County plows the snow and maintains the roads--but you should see the PENSIONS these govt workers get!!!!! It's enought to make you vomit---Well my 2 CENTS---Comp 387

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

This has been a wonderful thread, it should open the eyes of people who think
everyone lives the golden life.

I live in SOCAL and too many people here think it is where you live, what you
drive and what style of clothes you wear that make the person.

The Duster was paid for in cash, the car trailer too. The parts I buy for it I pay
as I go. Where ever I can I try to horse trade for parts. Yes I have a payment
on the truck, but small. Wife drives a 2002 Toyota with 118K and still ticking.

Re: Economics & Racing Beyond Our Means
 

Still one of the best books written regarding who has wealth and how they acquired it, is The Millionaire Next Door. It bursts so many myths on who is rich and how they got there.

One of the more interesting conclusions was how these people purchase vehicles for their everyday transportation: They buy them by the pound.