1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

I know you all have your own secrets, as I do too. But I need to know what it is you folks do to make these cars work so well. Especially on a HOT Greasy track. The track beat this weekend and I hate being beat by the track. Here is my current set up and please someone with a camaro that works help me out I am tired of fighting in the summer, my car works awesome when the track is good but man its bad when its not. here goes.

Front Suspension
Koni SPA1- set as soft as they will go
Moroso Trick Springs - 214 rate
Rear Suspension
Slide a links
Rancho 9 way adjustables
Afco Multi leafs

28x10.50-15 Tires

Good day 60's 1.53-1.54
Yesterday 1.65-1.67

PLEASE GIVE ME SOMETHING.....

Thanks

Eric Bowling
2008 Ohio Crankshaft No Box Nationals Winner

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Need more info. Motor size, trans, convertor, weight. There is one thing that I don't think you have right. There are no secrets it is just basic.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

motor 406 sbc
400 turbo tranny w/ brake
5500 8 inch coan converter
4.56 gear
Not sure of weight other than HEAVY
33-3500lbs

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

One thing you will NOT regret purchasing is a pair of AFCO double adjustable shocks for the rear. You need the ability to adjust rebound and bump independently.

The other thing that has been mentioned is a 30" tire. Very good idea.

How easily/smoothly does your front suspension work? Have you worked over the bushings so there is no resistance or bind? This is absolutely critical. Consider some Del-A-Lum bushings. Have you cut any coils off your Moroso springs? I would imagine that you have since you've got a SBC up front. Consider some Santhuff front springs. www.santhuffshocks.com You're probably looking at 160 or 180 lb/in units. They will provide maximum weight transfer.

How much travel do you have up front? You need a minimum of 5". If you don't then you need to cut the upper/lower bump stops and get the car sitting lower in front.

Just a few things to think about.

What are your current ET's? What RPM are you leaving at on the brake? Based on your low 1.5x 60 foots you should certainly be able to hook consistantly.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

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Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Re/ Slide-a-Link bars. We've had success with these using a re-arched stock monoleaf but replacing the entire two piece bar and poly bushing with a fabricated single chrome moly tube threaded to accept the supplied ends. Getting rid of the flex and distortion helped, as well as lowering the rear pad 1" to alter the angle on the bar. A bit of preload on the right bar and neutral on the left worked on our Nova with 60 foot best of 1.41. Strongly recommend the double adjustable shocks as well. If you were starting from scratch, I'd probably get the Cal Tracs instead, John Calvert is great to deal with and helpful from my experience....

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

5+ inches of travel in the front.
I have tried launching anywhere from 3000Rpm to 4000 and nothing works. No coils have been cut out of the springs, front end is as free as a can be, bump stops are all the way out. When the car works it runs high 7.30's-7.40's 1/8th mile.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

9 x 30 Goodyear radials, in a D-4A or harder compound, with a light burnout.
One tire compound does not fit all tracks or conditions.;)

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Well without having to spend $1000 on rear shocks I guess I will try to fabricate up a set of caltracs and put about 400 lbs in the trunk.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

You do not have to spend $1000.00 in shocks, just go and get the Rancho shocks from Calvert Racing.

One item that I take issue with is your statement that you plan to fabricate your own set of Cal-trac bars. John is part of our family in S/SS...he has put lots of effort and sweat in his suspension system for some one else to copy it.

I recognize there is a moron out there that has copied his bars and made all the dimensions available online for others to make their own bars. I consider this an insult to our community as a whole...be the man and spend your money like a lot of guys in this forum have done. I can just see you coming back to this forum asking for help because your bars do not work as designed. This applies comment would apply to another company out there that has copied Alf Weibe's suspension system for A and G body cars and it is marketing it like their own design.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Seriously, those people who know me know I wouldnt fabricate crap. I dont put Crap on my car. It was a joke, lighten up for god sakes, I would love to pull up next to you with your panties all bunched up on the starting line if its that easy to get under your skin, heck it usually only takes a couple staging duels to get people worked up but not you. I would have never came on here to ask opinions of your peers if I didnt repect your opinions, Just for the record I emailed the Calvert folks this morning and am yet to hear anything back so unwad your panties I, just like you am just trying to get my car right. On top of that if you would have read the whole post you would have read that I already have the rancho shocks on my car, so if you arent gonna pay attention to the post and question at hand I suggest you shut up and stay out of it! As for everyone else THANKS FOR YOUR HELP AND SUPPORT.

Eric Bowling
2008 Ohio Crankshaft No Box Nationals WINNER

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Eric...first, they way you put your comment, it did not appear as a joke. By the way, it takes a lot to get under my skin...and for pulling next to me next to the line and try to rattle me, those who know me as a driver, recognize that it does not work. About shutting up, you need to grow up...you sound like a young kid throwing a tantrum...

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Just pointing out the facts. If you would have read the whole post you would have known I had already posted my setup. As for the kid throwing a tantrum comment, you better read your post again sweetheart who sounds like the kid throwing a tantrum????

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

[QUOTE=ericsz;71268]Seriously, those people who know me know I wouldnt fabricate crap. I dont put Crap on my car. It was a joke, lighten up for god sakes, I would love to pull up next to you with your panties all bunched up on the starting line if its that easy to get under your skin, heck it usually only takes a couple staging duels to get people worked up but not you. I would have never came on here to ask opinions of your peers if I didnt repect your opinions, Just for the record I emailed the Calvert folks this morning and am yet to hear anything back so unwad your panties I, just like you am just trying to get my car right. On top of that if you would have read the whole post you would have read that I already have the rancho shocks on my car, so if you arent gonna pay attention to the post and question at hand I suggest you shut up and stay out of it! As for everyone else THANKS FOR YOUR HELP AND SUPPORT.


Eric
That is very harsh for people that are trying to help you
The stock super stock racers are a very tight bunch and this post wont help you ..
I understand what you are saying but it didnt need to be that harsh
Good luck with the 69 it is my favorite car to race also....

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

With all do respect Mark, I didnt say or mean anything harsh toward anyone other than the person that attacked me. Hence the "As for everyone else thanks for your help and support" comment I made. I appreciate everyones help on here and I dont need someone ripping into me when I didnt deserve it. I understand where you are coming from but what about what he said to me? I suppose that is ok I dont hear any Harsh comments about what he said. You are a tight bunch I know and I respect you for what you do which is why I got on here to ask for you help in the first place because you all have awesome equipment BUT please dont tell me about harsh when he started it, I admit this does sound childish but give me a break. I'll go elsewhere next time I need help if I'm not gonna be treated with the respect I give unto you.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

But you have no problem with the guys turning the Slide- A - Links into "Calvert" bars, with fabrication?? :rolleyes:;)

Eric is no kid throwing a tantrum, and his old car is clean enough to be a Stock or S/S class ride, but why would any new blood come into class racing when some of you act like dickheads?
He is an example of a good sportsman competitor that might look for new challenges, since he wins about 70% of the bracket races he enters. :p

Class racers are their own worst enemy in that regard, just my observation and opinion.
I realize that only 1% of the racers are like that, it's just that the 1% doing 99% of the grousing are the ones most widely broadcast...the internet has been no friend to drag racing either, the more I see.:(

Back to the subject, the Calvert setup is superior, but shouldn't be the only way to get this job done. The car is real close.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Thanks Goob!

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

1%...you better check out my posts in this forum. I contribute with a lot of technical guidance in and outside this forum. I embrace bracket racers and anyone that wants to try this sport. I apologize if in any way or form if I was out of line, however, when someone tries to copy and/or take away hard work from others, then I do take an issue. Those that want to take a short cut, are the ones that eventually come to this forum to either complain they cannot run or keep up with the competition. They are the ones that anytime there is a rule change in Stock or Super Stock, that will not follow their position as a bracket racer, they are aganst it. So, if you want to race in Stock or Super Stock, just remember this is a performance class.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

It's all good, I understand your point too, no problem there.

Eric, it might be no favor to know me....;):p

How wide a rim you running those tires on?

Harder compound really helped me out of that hot/greasy thing.

Can you fit a 30" tire?

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

As everyone else had said........... Caltracs, split mono's and rancho's. And while your at it throw a glide in that baby !!!! I bet all your problems will be solved and you'll be faster to boot !!!!!

Bottom line...... NO CAR will hook when the track is absolute junk, Some just hook more than others and those usually have glides.


JMO of course.





bob

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Just to clarify, if anyone thought I was copying John Calvert's excellent bars with my Slide-a-Link modifications, that was not the case. In fact, I first bought the Slide-a-Link system locally before I knew how to get the Cal Trac bars and was having problems hooking the car. First I made up aluminum bushings to replace the poly bushing, and that helped but was still inconsistent. I then tried spacing down the back of the bar, thinking to change the instant center which also seemed to help but it was hit and miss and touchy on the adjustment. Finally another racer suggested eliminating the flex by making the bar one piece and rigid. During all this, I tried various shocks and later bought and tried a set of split monoleaf springs from John Calvert, which I still have and plan to use in my next car. Ironically, I had not realised that a good deal of my problem was too low tire pressure. Thanks to another suggestion by a fellow racer, I raised the tire pressure on the radials to 21-22 lbs and with the other changes the car has never failed to hook since. I know what I went through, time and money and effort to finally get a decent 60 foot. If I was starting fresh, without a shed full of bits and pieces, I would definitely call John and buy his bars and use his springs. On the other hand, I also have seen the Alf Weibe bars work very well on a lot of cars in my area.
Thank you so much to all you guys that are willing to share knowledge on this forum! If I had been following these posts then I probably could have avoided a lot of mistakes.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

8 inch rim 28x10.5 Mickey M5 compound, went back to the regular slick instead of the stiffs, as you remember I hated the stiffs. I may be able to fit a 30 but it would be tight.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

I got my car better when I gave up on the 10" and 10.5" tires on the 8" rims.
More tread section is always tempting, but not always the best thing.

I have a few old 9 x 30's laying out back if you want to trial fit some.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Thanks Goob I'll let you know, I am still tossing around trying a Glide but I dont want to be on my back every week changing it and I dont want to have to spend 2 Grand to have one that wont break. My car is about 3400lbs isnt that to heavy???:confused:

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

Eric

As i remember from another thread you posted several months ago you mostly bracket race your car. The set up you have in your car is more of a street type chassis setup. You will not get the kind of performance or consistancy you are looking for with the chassis setup that you are using. I would suggest for you to install a rear frame section with a 4 link or ladder bar suspension using a coil over shock. I have HAL single adjustables on my car. I think this will be money well spent. You can go to a wider tire which will help on the marginal tracks. The powerglide will give you the consistancy that you are kooking for. If you have a decent trans with race quality parts you will not have to touch it for a whole season. The point I am trying to make is if you want to have a race car you have to set it up like a racecar and use race quality parts. The stocker guys use some of the similar parts that you are trying to use. They spend countless hours perfecting and testing their combinations. They do not run their cars weekly and they replace the tires on their cars very regularly.

Mike

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

I see to many 10 inch tire cars with lots more horse power than me dragging the bumper, I dont want to drag the bumper I just want to hook. I would really like to not have to do any major chassis changes to the car, its a "z" car.

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

WELL........ Thats a whole nother thread. I run a stock 1.76 gearset glide with a turbo input and aftermarket drum. It doesnt get any easier or cheaper than that. Car weighs 3450lbs and runs low 10's @ 133-135mph with a 28" tire and 4.10 gears. So far I believe this trans has about 750 runs and I have no plans to rebuild it anytime soon. Thats what direction I went and my car hooks 99.9 % of the time.............maybe more.



JMO .....




bob

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

A glide would probably be a good change for an 1/8 mile bracket car. With a three speed you are probably barely getting into high gear before the finish line, pretty much a waste of gear. A 1.76 glide is going to help your hook just by reducing the overall ratio in first gear, from a 2.48*4.56=11.31 to a 1.76*4.56=8.03, which is a LOT of difference. Your 60's might not be better, but they will likely be a lot more consistant, and that seems to be the name of the game. A glide is also lighter than a TH400 and you don't need a $3000 trans either. A properly built basic box with a stock 1.76 gearset, steel hub, hardened input shaft, good soft parts and a good transbrake will easily hold up against that 406. Put a deep pan on it and keep it cool.

I ran the Koni SP1 shocks on the front of my stocker for years set as loose as they would go. My 60's have always been all over the place. Last spring I put on a set of Calvert's new front shocks and it made a HUGE difference in my 60's. Much more consistant and at least 2 hundreths better than before. Best $100 I ever spent.

Good luck!

Re: 1969 Camaro Suspension Help...
 

I run the fiberglass mono's with cal tracs seems to work for me. I have abit more travel up front though. No trans brake. How does your car work off the converter only, no brake
In my experience hitting the tire harder helped my car but then you need stiffer rebound i think,