what causes this?
 

went racing this week, everything was fine until the first round. when i pressed my line lock button, the car rolled forward a bit. kind of surprised me. i think it surprised the guy in the other lane to since we was dead late from hell (.138) to my .001. but none of the numbers on the run were any good since i went in so deep.

so my question is whats wrong? one guy told me its my shifter not putting the car "all the way into first gear" another told me that my trans is going away. yes that it does that if it gets hot. trans temp was 200???? so what the f*&k. just kind of upset. i was all up beat about the car and driving and now this. its always something.

any help please.

Re: what causes this?
 

Carlos the same thing happened to me second round at the Div 3 race in
Chicago.... i found out i was to high on the rpms when i hit the trans brake button ( you said line lock, did you mean trans brake?)
Check to make sure your fluid level is right and it is possible the trans is going bad, but my trans guys said he doubts any problems with the trans on mine just to high on the rpms...... hope this helps

Lee

Re: what causes this?
 

YES I DID MEAN TRANS BRAKE.

i only have the rpms maybe at 1500 when i hit the button and mash the gas pedal. bad trans is not good. in a tough dollars and cents world something like this could just spell the end for 2008.

Re: what causes this?
 

I know what you mean..... it is getting tougher and tougher to keep racing
I hope it is not a bad trans for you...

Lee

Re: what causes this?
 

check your band adjustment if it is too loose the car will roll when you apply the transbrake

Re: what causes this?
 

In a P/G the band is applied when it is pulled into low gear. Rolling forward is usually too low line pressure at the time you apply the Trans Brk or too much clutch clearance in the rev clutches. The low(forward band) is applied and the rev clutches must apply to hold or lock up the forward movement. If they(rev clutches) are late or slow applying you will roll/creep forward.Try changing the spring pressure or the size of the boost valve (.488 dia gets the most pressure) in the valve body to raise the line pressure. You might also try going to a higher apply RPM to get the pump spinning up the pump pressure-Vol. Low vol. or worn pumps require higher RPM to move the required fluid vol to apply the rev clutches. The hardest thing to fix is the rev clutch pack clearance. (requires complete transmission disassembly)The more clearance, the more fluid vol is required to apply the rev clutches. I usually work around .060 for pro tree and around .085 to .090 on .500 tree applications. With it doing it hot I would put a pressure gauge on the rev & check the difference in hot or cold pressures. You can also judge how fast the pressure rise is when you apply the Trans brake.
Good luck, hope this helps you solve your problem.

Re: what causes this?
 

band adjustment (all the way in,then out 3 turns)
also change fluid and filter

Re: what causes this?
 

70 inch pounds in and 3 1/2 to 4 out is the way I adjust mine........

Re: what causes this?
 

i adjust my low band about a month ago. turned all the way in and then 4 complete turns out. i might add that it was a bitch with the CSI cover over the trans. its a little hard getting the allen head in there.

as for the line pressure being low and increasing the rpms. that might just be the only other thing to try. always some **** for me in the 3rd round. just finished practicing on friday. back to back to back runs just to see what the car would do if it had a good drivier. everything went fine and it repeated. now this.

well it will just have to rest until friday, then will do a little maintenance and put it away again until race day. see, bad thing about race cars is that you just can't take them out into the street and try them out. hell, it would blow the tires out anyway.....lol

Re: what causes this?
 

Carlos, sometimes my trans rocks the car foward or backwards when engaging the trans brake. Ive tried adjusting an still does it. The way i fixed it was just to bring the rpms up a little before i stage. This brings the line pressure up and no rock. The nova also engages the line lock when the transbrake is engaged to keep it from rocking but becomes a pain when backing up w/ a hipster.

Re: what causes this?
 

I had run into this a couple of times when I first started racing ...1st thing I started doing was bringing the idle up 11-1200 RPM..the 2nd was before I would stage I would cycle the brake 3 or 4 times ...just press and release the button...I have no idea if any of those things helped ..maybe it was just a timing thing between going in the beams and applying the brake. but I know that once I started that routine the car never moved ... I still do it today

Re: what causes this?
 

Rolling forward when you hit the brake has nothing to do with the low gear band adjustment. Low gear band adjustment has everything to do with the timing of the low band dropping out & the High clutches applying. Any one that has really looked at a racepack graph of driveshaft RPM / engine RPM can see if the shift holds low too long or lets it loose causing a flare in engine RPM. Comp racers & savy .90 class racers chase the bump on the graph to get it as smooth at the shift as possible.
The low band is already in full apply when you are rolling forward into the beams. It is line pressure or fluid vol required for a loose reverse clutch pack that makes the car roll forward. The rev clutch pack isn't applying quick enough to lock the tranny up. The cycling of the T brake before the final apply is filling the rev piston cavity with fluid. So when you make the final apply it doesn't take a full load of fluid to move the piston forward to apply the Rev clutches.

Re: what causes this?
 

ADGER

at first i guess i didn't understand your first post. then all the comments about the low band. so the lowband adjustment has nothing to do with my problem at all. that being said now back to my problem

now if i understand you correctly, because this is racing and as soon as i and the other racer are staged we get on the buttom and mat the car. now if i had all the time in the world and say could wait a few secs before i hit the buttom i might not have any problem at all.

but,

because i do its because one i either have a real problem and the trans is going away or i'm lopw on fluid or just a little more rpm to get pump pressure up. all this or some of this and my problem goes away.

that is unless my trans has seen better days. did i get it right.

Re: what causes this?
 

Carlos - if all the mechanical remedies check out and it still happens, we have also found that when you go to get on full throttle AT THE SAME TIME as hitting transbrake, you will roll! Make sure transbrake is engaged BEFORE getting on full throttle. This one doesn't cost any money!!!
Good luck!!!!

Re: what causes this?
 

LOL

THANKS LYNN

i've done that one to, that one usually sends me out of the beams and well on my way for about 4 ft until i slam on the brakes, look up at the starter and ask for a "do over". usually he just points in the big end direction of the track and directs me to keep on moving.

Re: what causes this?
 

It is correct the band adjust has nothing to do with rolling forward. It is in full apply when going forward. What are you going to do, loosen(adjust) it so it slips? ;~) The problem is the low band is applied & it takes toooo long for the rev clutch pack to tighten up & lock the tranny in low & rev. Pull the pan and check the clearance in the rev clutch pack. That can be done by inserting feeler gauges through the small square hole below the Rev clutch pack. (have to remove VB to see) Let us know how many thousands it takes to wedge the pack tightly. I suspect you have a tranny that may still have too small a supply hole. (Had known builder do that to me way back before I started doing my own) The stock feed hole is about .060. Should go to at least 5/16 or 3/8 for good fluid flow. That is if your VB is the type using single feed. Some have a feed & dump, dual...More holes to drill... Or you could have the wavy steel still in the clutch pack or you could have low pressure or you could have too much clutch pack clearance. It isn't going to fix it's self. You need to do some checking before just pulling it out. Did you check the pressure on the rev pack when you hit the T brake? You can also
air check the rev clutch pack, just like you can air check the low band when the VB is out. (not through the same fluid port, though. Did you do the tranny yourself or is it a well used unit from someone else? Hope this helps.

Re: what causes this?
 

wow !!!!!!!!!!!

adger i felt like i was still in some navy school and reading and reading your post over again. and feeling like i'm not getting it. i understand what you say but unfortunally i can geographyly figure out how to check it myself. in simple terms, i was lost after pulling the pan. even with the best instructions i would "F" that up.

no i didn't do my own trans dynamic trans and converters did mine, i have about 19 runs on this trans. so i hope they warranty the darn thing. i have no complaints on there work. hell, who knows maybe its something i did. low on fluid, didn't adjust the low band after my first 2 runs. (was more like 10 before i made the adjustment). just don't really know. in this area i'm out of my element.

all i can do is check the fluid come friday. at first i was hoping that it would be low and thus an explaination. but, it doesn't sound like you think so. got this sucks, since its in a full body car with the CSI cover over it and bolted to the engine with allen heads. **** i can't get a wreench on them so the entire engine and trans would have to come out....... my reallity truely sucks right now.

i just love sportsman racing....... you know, life was alot easyier when the car went 12 something on the foot brake. as i have already said to my wife. the next time something happens thats where i'm going. i just didn't think it would be this soon. the world around us is just so expensive, who really has the money.

thanks for everybodiest help. i'm going to forget about this today and go golfing on TOYOTA'S (my boss) nickael. friday will be here soon enough.

Re: what causes this?
 

Carlos,
Good for you, admitting that you are lost and giving some good information. The last thing I want a customer to do is get in over his head trying to fix something. I'm sure Frank at Dynamic feels the same as I do. So it made atleast 19 runs & strated giving trouble. I would think something went away. Could be as simple as lip seals nicked or cut on assy. Send it back to Dynamic. They know their product & can probably fix it. You need to do that before you or someone else screws up more. I know I would appreciate a customer that was having problems deal with me to get them corrected. Get rid of those allens, they are case eaters... Put a "footed" style bolt with a clearance shank on there. Ask about any updates when you return the tranny.
Good Luck, esp with that white ball.... :~)

Re: what causes this?
 

thanks for your help alger.

the little white ball won again. i like playing, but don't love it, its good for me to show my face at these things. besides all the food and drinks were free, so i had a great time.

today its back to the grind in this 92 degree weather in jersey. no problem for me i've got southern experiece...lol.. lived in charleston sc for 12 years and 7 yrs in jacksonville florida during my nanvy days. but, we don't live there anymore. in new jersey they stay home when it gets this hot.

i'll call shawn at dynamic sometime today or tomorrow (my day off) and see what he thinks. in any case i think i have alot of work ahead of me. where's the million dolaar sponce and the pt crew when you need them. oh, i don't have one of them. so its me and me alone. this is going to suck