The cost of a car
 

Well, I have to admit something. When I first started this as an idea. I traded a few posts on here about the cost of building this 1979 Firebird as a stocker. Some of you guys threw some pretty hefty numbers at me. Being an old hardhead, I refused to believe it would cost near what many said.

I'm adjusting my vein of thought! Basically, this car has only been moved from the original owners garage to mine and other than collecting pieces, nothing has really been accomplished. I've already spent $3200.00. Now, I'm going to say for cast off parts and swap meet junk, I've aquired some decent parts, a few new. I haven't even scratched the surface of this project yet.

Re: The cost of a car
 

The journey to completion [ running under the index ] Priceless!!!

Re: The cost of a car
 

The common thinking for alot of us geezers now is to buy a done car. People enter and exit racing on a regular basis.Sadly 50 cents on the dollar is top price residual on even a competitive car.

Re: The cost of a car
 

Figure out how much you want to spend in total.......then triple it and you might be in the ballpark.

JimR

Re: The cost of a car
 

And triple the time to finish also...

Re: The cost of a car
 

If your doing it your self ...it takes a lot of time....( been working on my street/strip car for 6 months & it still hasn't fired...but it's close!)

Re: The cost of a car
 

Let's see, triple the time and triple the money. You guys have got me depressed now, LOL!

We've argued this before. This time around, I see it. Not going to stop me from going forward. My experience (sadly been more than 2 decades ago) in building cars, progress comes in bunches. That's generally been as time and money become both available and used wisely. Sometimes that doesn't always happen.

We'll see.

Re: The cost of a car
 

fast and easy way

http://www.racingjunk.com/category/3...-firebird.html

Re: The cost of a car
 

After being out of it for a while I just decided that I missed racing and wanted to go again. I've "been there and done that" on buying a stock car, putting a BUNCH of time and money into it, and selling it for one reason or another; usually losing a ton on them. Decided there was a better way to do it. I wanted a street/street Impala SS and having built one before (and having to sell it during a divorce and lost my butt on it!) I knew exactly what I wanted and how it should be built. I found the exact car (very lucky I know) that I wanted less than two hours from me. I'm not ashamed to say the guy that built it had $40,000 in receipts (yes, I added them up) and it was built with very good parts and just the way I wanted it. He was getting married and had lost interest in the car so I got it for less than 1/4 of what he had in it and that doesn't even count his time. I hope to have this car forever and maybe change a few small things but I would personally never build one from scratch again.

Re: The cost of a car
 

lot cheaper to buy a car from someone who has had enough !

jack

p.s. Yacavone has a KILLER for very little, buy car, buy gas, buy number, qualify #1...easy

Re: The cost of a car
 

If someone told me 2 years ago what it would cost to build the DP Ida said they were nuts, after a year of research and lining up items I called it within 10k the Old man didnt believe it.

When working on it one day he looked up and me and said "You know if Ida know how much this would cost, and he paused. I still would have done it but Ida been better prepared"

I have decided to turn my 72 into a GT car, we have engines and trans reday for the DP car, so, andmy 72 Chally will never be worth more than about 15-17, its a 72. But I figure about 10 with me doing all the work cage paint, brakes, rear. Thats less the motor cost etc.

But TIME is Money, if you can packrat stuff for years, you can do it cheaper, no doubts, but if you want it NOW well, then everything comes at retail and expidited prices, I figure 5 months to build the 72 GT , 1 month cage, 1 month paint, 1 month Chassis, 1 month screwing around getting this that and the other, and 1 month finish up.

But when Im done what will I have ? Well a 72 that will be able to run SSGT with 2 different combos we have, a car that with the 318 and a different hood (I have) can run Stock, a car that with a tune and the spool out can run down to our Drive in, and a lot of fun, to me that will be worth far more than the sum of the parts, finished with a motor ? Still only about a 20k car, but well......Ill have immesurable fun doing it all with my own 2 hands.

Guess the balance sheets are enjoyment==$ , $==effort in some cases.

Re: The cost of a car
 

When I had my AMX painted into (mind you, it looked good before), it was supposed to be delivered in 60 days or less and I was paying for nothing but materials as it was a "sponsor" by the body shop. It was completed in about 10 months and somehow the free labor was about $7500 or $10K total. At about the same time I had a restoration '70 AMX they did and had problems with the paint. They finally conceded there was a propblem with there paint and re-painted it (a week before the BJ auction it was in). Somehow there warranty work cost me $1500 and I thought it looked better before they "fixed" it. That car sold for about $10K less than it should have brought and I'm convinced the
paint was the majority of the problem.
The race car AMX received a "Best Appearing" Wally on the first time out so that was gratifying. But the "sponsor" name was no where to be found on the car!
And I sure wish I wouldn't have been so easy on grabbing my ankles, I could use that money to get my chassis / engine work on a fast track instead of a slow track!

Re: The cost of a car
 

The cost of building a race car reminds me of the mindset of someone after they've played poker. Most guys when asked how did they do they reply they about broke even. Translation, they lost a bunch. As with race cars we tend to not count the small items we obtained with out of pocket purchases. Very few of us really ever admit to others, wives, or ourselves what we actually paid totally after the project is completed. If a guy can keep the price of their project to less than a 30% over their budget I think they have done a pretty good job. In my class within a 50% over predicted costs.

Re: The cost of a car
 

I think that fairly accurate across the board. I years ago learned to set up a seperate account for my "play money" something my wife a)didnt know about b)couldnt access and c) was completley funded from my toys themselves and their sale, hence it was no money out of the household. After spending over 10k on some bike parts for a pair of vintage racers I heard no end of it from my wife, daily, hourly this that or the other, made me sick to listen to it because it was nonsese the money came from other toys I had doubled and tripled my money on. So I quit for about a year, one day she said "When are you going to build more bikes ?" Wehn asked WWTF She was talking about, she realized when I sold them and was able to put a downpayment on a new house with the money it was a "winner" Just because I will put Toy money into the household, I woundt take household money into my toys.

Well, divorced her, problem solved :)

But what I learned aside from hiding it from her was it was a GREAT way to Track all expenses I never had more than 1 going really, so use the CC for all things related, I could wait till the end of a build and tally up months x-z and see what it REALLY cost.

Even thought single I still do it, I use Paypal becuase I get a CC and a lot of the items I buy and sell are on Ebay so it works nice.

But youre right, MANY (not all) of us never tell our wives, but she might not have liked me spending it, it became clear she sure liked when I sold and doubled, and put about 1/2 the profit back into the household accounts.....(she never knew what really came in :) But my toy account became self sustaining.

Re: The cost of a car
 

I'll vouch for that one, especially the transmissions...

Re: The cost of a car
 

Pick up my Demon in March (off of ebay)2008 racing it in May 2008. Came with two motors(both are PARSON & MYERS 340 stock legal) and a s@#t load of parts for one low low price.I was building a 73 duster,I had 10 in it,no were near finished,sold it for 6.bought the demon for 20.car ran .996 under the old index.

Re: The cost of a car
 

I like this thread, it hits home.

<I'm adjusting my vein of thought! Basically, this car has only been moved from the original owners garage to mine and other than collecting pieces, nothing has really been accomplished. I've already spent $3200.00. Now, I'm going to say for cast off parts and swap meet junk, >

After having Jeff Lee beat on my head to put a roll bar in my 1969 Barracuda
340-S and make it a stocker, I could not bring myself to cut it up, I sold it to a
buddy and then went out and bought a "turn key" bracket Duster BB for more
money than I had ever paid for a project car before.

Of course it came with NO safety equipment and a gas tank full of rust. :)

My last real race car was a Duster so I guess in my mind it's only OK to cut up
Dusters.

Now I'm into it about $10K and it is done except for paint/bodywork which will
have to wait awaile, but it is ready to be fired, then it's off to the muffer shop and
then a front end alignment.

If all goes well it will be in Vegas at the end of this month for Mopars at the Strip.

Re: The cost of a car
 

Robert check out Freeman Mcneal V/SA 85 Caprice at Indy this year he won Class with -1.o71 under, he told me he bought the car complete from an another racer who had done all due diligence on the car and was qualifying everywhere with so much regularity that he was enjoying the car more than his S/G. Those are rare but can be had. Nothing beats getting a car running properly when everyone tells you to move on.

Re: The cost of a car
 

In my experience, time is the biggest factor/cost in building your own car.

If you are married and your spouse is not a dyed in the wool car enthusiast, you are sunk before you start.

Even if not married, and I am not. Having the time to get done what you want to get done takes sacrifice.. Maintenance on my house, is suffering. Cleaning my house is also lagging behind. My girlfriend regularly reminds me that we haven't seen each other for a while...And so on....

Then, there is the money. My first estimate on any project, is my honest best estimate. I then double it. Then, I double it again... I rarely miss by much, either high or low. But the biggest mistake you can make with a project like a race car, is not to set out the time line and costs ahead of time.

I know a lot of guys who just didn't realize it would take years instead of months, and 10's of thousands rather than just a few thousand dollars to finish a car.

If you have to have something you did all on your own, and did entirely your way.... then it will cost you.. in time and money.

Our drag pak car has sucked up more money than I could have ever guessed, and I actually had to sell one of my 1970 RT Challenger convertibles to get over a short cash flow crunch. But it was worth it, because this car has been an incredible adventure.

But if I was going to do something else, I would buy a car already built, and then tweak it to my liking, and save trailer loads of money.

David
The New Hemi Guy
________
Pregnant gangbang

Re: The cost of a car
 

Here is a good way to find out IF you are ready for racing stock / super stock.

If you can fill a 5 gallon pail with $100.00 bills Then lite a match and
( WITHOUT FLINCHING !!) throw it in the pail ... YOU ARE READY!!!! :)

FYI...
To race Pro Stock it will a 55 gallon drum full !!!;)

Re: The cost of a car
 

It was a rust free Duster,a hard find here on the east coast of Canada

Re: The cost of a car
 

Hey Joe, similar to an anology I gave a youngster at a bracket race, 20 some years back. He came up to me, admired my car and asked "what kind of money it take to build something like this"? I pointed over to a big Buick, Caddy, something that was parked close by, told him "go over and fill up the trunk of that car with $100 bills, three-four times, you might be ready to start"!

I appreciate the advise. I knew this would be expensive, it has become more clear to me. I don't have 25-30-40K upfront money I can throw into a car. I'm neither intimidated by the costs or the work. You all may be right, I may never get it together. For me, I desire the accomplishment.

Just for laughs, if I had that pail of $100 bills, wouldn't it be more prudent to put it toward the car? They will get burnt up, eventually!

Re: The cost of a car
 

Time == Money I guess.

You can pay and have it fast, or do it yourself and it takes more time.

Im assuming youre a "handy type" who can do machine work, fabrication, welding, painting all yourself ?

My buddy make some of the most insane things Ive ever seen out of junk and sheet metal, all hammer worked....takes him 2 years but .... lol

I have yet with the exception of gears and the like of "hard part" (engine parts heads, etc) like brake calipers ever seen anything on a car I couldnt do given enough time, do I want to spend 100 hrs doing something I can buy for $100 , hell no, but well if I didnt have $100 I would...

What do you have ? Not have ?

I am just curious what the high dollar parts you see as remaining ?

Motor/Trans ?

Re: The cost of a car
 

In 2004....I was racing mostly in S/C with the dragster I had built new in 1998 I was watching all the late model Firebirds and Camaros in Stock and really wanted to have one.
I learned long ago to buy a good quality used roller and thats exactly what I did. I bought a Firebrid that was very well built and had perfect paint. It came with a lot of engine parts and a trans and converter. I built an engine with parts and some good advice from Woodro Josey.....Thankyou Woody....
I had very little machine work needed to build a decent engine to get started. I bought a used laptop from Ebay.....I taught myself how to tune the EFI. I bought an Innovate LM-1 to help me tune that EFI on the LT-1. I had the trans and converter redone. Bought some used ring and pinions and changed them twice myself trying different ratios.....
I ran well under the index the second week out after fixing some minor EFI programming errors I made. I did get some good help and advice from someone I met on the internet who worked at Accel DFI , as I had an Accell Gen VII ECU....I did not spend a ton of money and ran as quick as 10.55 and at the weight I was carrying...that was about -.8 or more under the index. I did not feel I could chase this type racing as it was just not going to fit in for me......I sold it after making about 60 total runs. The new owner has spent a lot of time refining the tune up...has been on the chassis dyno and also had the help of a very good "tuner". The car has only run slightly quicker......He is getting a new engine from one of the best engine builders in stock so it should be a lot faster....

Bottom line is you can build a car pretty reasonably and be competetive for a reasonable amount of money.....I did.....and most all of my cars have been done the same way.....No they are not showcars..and they are far from the fastest. If I had kept the Firebird, I would have worked at making it faster...slowly as the budget and time allowed.......It was just not going to work for me but it was a fun car to drive and I enjoyed the build up time and learning curve on the EFI.......

Re: The cost of a car
 

Passion.....Can't put a price tag on that.