Mopar GT combo?
 

A new racer-to-be in my area has asked me (believe or not) to gather info for his new Challenger. It's a body-in-white deal and he's gonna' run SS/GT. Now, I'm pretty familiar with the older Ford HP ratings in relation to best "rated" combo's to look at, but I don't have a clue about Mopar's. He wants to run a big block 383 - 440. So what's all you Mopar racers ideas? Year, body, etc.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

At the risk of leading someone down an unethical and immoral road he might consider one of the 3 Drag Pac engines. Sorry, couldn't resist. He could run regular SS or GT. If he chooses a 383-440 it will have to have come with fresh/ram air since the Drag Pac has a scoop. If he wants to stay away from the FI and run a carb, I would try the 70 383 from the E-body. It was available with the shaker so it can run under the Drag Pac scoop.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

To use the body in white Drag Pak with scoop he can run the following: 1964 Max wedge, 1965 race Hemi, 1968 race Hemi, 1970 340/383/440/440-6/Hemi.....all of these combinations could be had with some type of hood scoop during their day.. Guys, correct me if I'm off on this.

If he does not use a hood scoop then any mopar motor will do. To see where it fit he would have to look at the classification guide and weigh HP to weight ratios.

I'm partial to the slant six/4 speed combo myself......lol!

JimR

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

a "New Challenger" Body in white ? Id love to know how hes pulling that off, I and several others have tried, hell Mopar Perf, couldnt even get them for the DP Program.

Drop me a PM and lemme know.....

But Stewart is right, I would look at either the 5.7 , or (and I cant beleive Im saying this) but the 5.9 After Jeff Teutons success, knowing he has forgotten more about motors and the LA in particular than Ill ever know, but I never ever would have guessed it that fast....if its as fast as I think it is.

5.7's blocks are cheap and plentiful the heads for the 5.7 Dp and 6.1 flow over 300 CFM in 225 ex.....The heads are off the shelf items if you want to do your own and can be regulary picked up on ebay, the parts to build one are CHEAP, like 299 for rods, 349 crank, 5.7 block 1200 if you get a whole short block. Less if you Craigslist it, a 5.7 can TAKE a .075 overbore on most blocks easily. Heads used 1000 set, + setup another 1000, , cam 500, timing setup 100, rockers and shafts 40 ea (x4), Ross will have pistons at about 850 a set soon (Diamonds are 1050) Pan 500, Oil Pump 40-100 depending, the manifold and tb are the killer at about 2k....

Im building my 72 Chally to use DP running gear, but it will be done so it can run Stock, SS, and SS/GT .... a "Convertible" as it were, Im ordering cage tommorow.

I am dying to know how he thinks (or has) a BIW ? Unless its from a salvage car and not a "BIW" direct from Ma Mopar....

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Chris
There was one body in white offered by Mopar that I know of. It was pulled from the line for some reason but couldn't be used in the drag pac program since it had a moon roof so it was sold thru an offer on Moparts a little over a year ago. Zippy was the one who listed it.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

What about the '62 383 combo that Bennett runs? If I'm reading it right, it's 330 HP in SS/GT.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

How about a single 4bbl NASCAR Hemi? I didn't even look but it may have the original HP rating and not the Stock factor.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

A question was asked not long ago on Moparts about this BIW and it was reported that it had been sold... Don't know who or when but that was the reply.. Maybe he bought it???

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

The only place i see a challenger would work would be base super stock. no gt or modified. Think of the aero advantage a daytona,avenger,or stratus would have.
It would take a lot to overcome this. Any of the engine combo that come in a drag pac
are real good. I will have a 5.9 on dyno in 60 days.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

5.7 DP Engine, only difference between it and the 6.1 is the bore. But the factors between the two engines is much different and more favorable for the 5.7. The 5.9 would be an excellent choice as well and would be the cheapest option I'm sure.

305 HP factor

If you plan on running the car at around 3100lbs, GT/DA would be a perfect fit for this combo.

I would like to put to put a 5.7 DP Engine in a 96 Neon coupe and run GT/AA at the minimum weight (2600lbs) if its possible. I figure if they can get a Fox Body mustang to 2200lbs, then I could get a neon somewhere close.


Hey guys correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the hood scoop refer to the body style used, not the engine combination. Thats my understanding from reading my rulebook(09).

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

I thought the 6.1 had larger (more CC's) head castings as well as larger valves.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Ron
In the DP car the 5.7 and 6.1 use identical heads, the SRT8 6.1 with 2.10 intakes added.

Cutta
Bruce Bachelder told me that if you were running a car with a factory scoop (in my case a 68 Hemi Cuda) you have to run a motor that came with fresh air so the scoop wouldn't give you HP not reflected in the NHRA factored HP.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Thanks. I was thinking production....

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

That's the way I look at it. You have a body "package" which in this case includes a scoop. You have an engine "package". Could be a 318 2bbl that never had a scoop option in my opinion. NHRA has a "GT" class where you can merge engine and body packages that never existed Like a 440-6bbl in a '70 Dart if you choose.
I don't see a rule that precludes scooped bodys with non-scooped engines.
Furthermore, NHRA has a long history (to present) that does not give HP for a scooped car. Look at all the musclecars with factory scoops, 442, AMX, Shaker Mopar & Mustang, Firebirds, Camaro's, etc., etc. Same HP with scooped hood or flat hood.
If I had a dog in the fight, I would petition to allow.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Im not trying to be "contrary" here or well , but here are some things to think about.

There are more differences than bore, read the blueprint guide for the engine, there was a a "correction" that was an after the fact change to the 6.1 deck height(in relation of the piston) as well look at the CR and gasket, and dome height, volume etc. There are more differences than just bore.

You are 100% correct about the 5.7 that is why after Gainesville (or Original Plan) was to run the 5.7 we didnt expect to HAVE to do it because we blew the 6.1 to smithereens, but we are very hopefull of the 5.7 capabilities, AND we will be the first to track it in a DP car. (in SS nonetheless)

The 5.7 and 6.1 are CHEAP. I would reckon cheaper than a 5.9 DP Motor.

Eliminate the FI system (both need the DP specific and they about the same cost)

6.1 Crank $349 delivered
6.1 Block $940 delivered
Rockers and shafts $40 ea x4
Pistons for 6.1 now $850 from ross
Rods $299
Pan Pickup Windage $500
Heads 2200 (done) less if you take stock castings and do em.
Oil pump 40-100

IF you do a 5.7 the short will cost $1200 and thats timing cover etc, sell the rest on Ebay (crank rods cam pan blah)

NOW , I "think" the 5.9 Crank, Rods, Heads are just as expensive for DP Parts.

You can find the Parts list on my Flickr site.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newhemi...7623214928025/

Here and Here specifically

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newhemi...7623214928025/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newhemi...7623214928025/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newhemi...7623214928025/

Hope that is helpful to someone........

MOST Parts you can price on sites out there, if you have a dealer login then you can cross and check avail.

BUT and I will say this becuase they have been A1 with pricing, beating price, shipping cost etc, Henson in Texas seems Ace, Art over there is top notch.

Cheers

Chris

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Chris check your pm's

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Chris, rumor has it that the dealership is closing down. Hopefully not. If so, Art will be truely missed.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Jeff
Trust me, I tried twice with Bruce. Once over the phone and once at the Southerns last year. I wanted to run the low comp 360 in a 68 Hemicuda body. He said no because of the scoop. It would be no different than you trying to run the SS AMX scoop on your car. The rule book says "Hood openings and/or scoops other than original equipment prohibited.". Just reading that would lead you to think since the SS/C AMX scoop is an original equipment scoop that it can be used on any engine in that year body but we know that is not true. Since it is not true in S or SS then it is not true in SSGT. Heck, if you just read the rule as written what keeps folks from running the SS AMX scoop on any AMX it will fit on? The rule says nothing about limiting the hood with "original equipment" scoop to the year offered but I think we all understand thats not legal even thought it not written out.
Think this also has been tried on the ram air vs non ram air late firebirds since the engines "I think" carrry a diff HP depending on which hood is on the car.

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Stewart, I understand what you are saying, but you may want to check out Tom Sheehan's pics from Charlotte post. There is a '68 Dart GT/EA with the Hemi scoop on it. I asked what engine combination it's running and was told it's a 360/285. The only car I can figure that engine came with fresh air in is the '74 Duster/ Dart Sport. Not challenging here, just mentioning. I guess Bruce didn't tech this event!

Re: Mopar GT combo?
 

Charlie Ford, your guy wants to run some 383/440 stuff. Call me. I got whatever you need. The hood scoop thing is basically if the body (68 Hemi Cuda) and the motor (various 440-4 or 383-4) almost had hood scoops also. Both got them Problem solved. I really think if they would let you run a 68 Cuda with a flat plastic hood, it would go faster.