Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

This has probably been asked before but why can't the beams all the way down the track, and the most crucial of beams (at the finish line), be the same height off the ground to keep old style cars from getting screwed by late model cars with low bumpers who can use the brake to dip the nose and trip the beam?

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Maybe some racers who have experienced dipping the nose and tripping the beam will post and explain to you the down side of trying to drive like that.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

That's right. At the finish line, if you "dump", you have to get the nose back up before the stripe to prevent breaking out with an even quicker et. Took me twice to catch on. I'm old and a little bit slow.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

I have seen a few bracket cars put an additional "device" under the nose of their car to trip the beam. If you think you have a wheel on them, you really don't because they are tripping the beam with that whether they dip the nose or not. If I go bracket race at a track for the first time, I like to look around and see who has them while I am waiting in the lanes.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

I raced a 87 camaro stocker a few times and I hated the way the nose was made on those cars.. Atleast 3 times I dropped on a guy only to have the nose trip the beams and I would break out and run like 2mph faster.... I even had it do it on me when I peddeling at the stripe..

I would much rather have an older car that you dont have to worry about that..

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Sure wouldn't bother me if the downtrack beams were set at 3", the same height as the ground clearance you're supposed to have.

Been on both ends of the spoiler, and they both suck!

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Does anyone know if it is a triggering issue? If not, then they could continue with their high beams for the pros and go with both beams being the same for sportsman right?

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I have stripe takers on the front of my '01 Corvette, most people don't even realize that they are on the car unless you really look hard. It's a bracket car and in the rule book, it says that the body has to be 3" off the ground from front bumper to back of car. I've had pictures taken of the stripe takers and sent to IHRA and NHRA with no mention saying that they have to come off the car. Do I think it's fair, no, but it makes the front of the car consistant so that if I do stab the brakes, I know which part of the car is taking the stripe at all times.

Casey Miles
248H

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Can you post a picture of them on this thread?

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

How about this scenario?

You are racing against Mr. X in his low riding late model car and he is giving you a headstart. Let's say Mr. X spins off the line now he knows he has to make up some ET because he may not be able to catch you assuming you are on an average run, didn't break anything, and had an average light. He comes up along side of you only to be a wheel behind at the traps but dips the nose to cross inches in front of you and not break out because he had already lost ET at the starting line. This gives Mr. X an insurance policy and another weapon in the arsenal if this scenario ever should happen to him. He can manipulate his track position against you in your 69 Camaro.

I've seen it at bracket races and even on Pinks All-out when the early model car clearly had a foot on the other guy and lost.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

The long nose can be a blessing at times. And other times you just wanna chainsaw the nose off of the car.

It wouldn't bother me one bit if they moved the beam down to 3" at the finish line. I can still get the nose down there!

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

thats one of a million differant scenarios as far as bracket racing. The only time you can count on the front end helping you is in a heads up race... and thats only if you're within a hun at the stripe.

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The E.T. you gain with the nose is minimal and really irrelevant in a bracket racing situation. If someone dials .15 over what they can run in case they spin, they will probably still be able to run the number. You can't stop anyone from doing that. Like Billy said in a heads up this might be more beneficial, but you are still only talking about .01-.02.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

I raced a '97 Firebird Stocker for a year or two. It had single adjustable front shocks. If I set them loose and had the nose low the car would drop the nose very quickly and as everyone knows, that front overhang is way out front.......

I rasied the nose some but still had the shocks set loose....I had no down travel limiter device like a stop or maybe some cable limiters....

I had a race at E-Towns Lucas event......Raced a car dialed at 13.9x I was in the 10.80's all weekend. Speed was never over 123. I had the better RT but not by a lot.... .010 to .02x ......I was pretty hard on the brakes and admittedly had dialed UP as the sun was very hot.......In a doulble breakout race I lost. My speed on that run was almost 124.......My friends saw the race from the stands and saw me drop the nose and said I was down before the stripe......I assumed the nose got me....or I was later on the brakes than I thought......Ran 1 MPH faster hard on the brakes than flat out.......

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Obviously you can't stop anyone from dialing up .10-.15 in case of a spin but you can stop anyone from making the track 1 to 2 feet shorter on a given run in a frantic, strategic moved as opposed to the early model car that has no choice but to run the full 1320'. That's the whole reason for my post. And that is by making the beam 2"-3" like at the starting line. Actually you can make it lower than the starting line because who really goes through the finish line with the front tires in the air? Why not make it 1" ?

In my scenario I said the guy was behind in a wheel race and the nose saved him. I never said he lost .10-.15. Maybe he short shifted or sputtered or something that only cost him .01-.02. I am in agreement with you guys that in a heads up race it may be more beneficial but I think some may be underestimating the importance of this in a bracket race. Nonetheless, the poor guy on pinks lost out on his $10,000 ! And some poor guy in class elimination could lose out on 300 bucks, a coveted Wally, and some bragging rights.

Go through your past issues of National Dragster and turn to the sportsman winner's quotes. On more than one occasion you will see how their "lucky round" included dipping the nose from behind to get the win. Or, read Dan Fletcher's article in the last Dragster, he was pretty angry about recently being on the losing end of the same thing. You would be too don't you think?

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

On a previous set of runs against a similar combination I thought I took the stripe every time but this picture shows what actually happened.

Who do you think took the stripe, and who do you think got the win?

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
988 Brandon Peterson 954 Richard Alford Jr
E5 0.015 7.239 90.66 ****WINNER**** 0.025 7.261 85.04
M/CM Dial: 7.25 (+/-): -0.011 E/SA Dial: 7.20 (+/-): 0.061
Prior rounds:
E4 (M McCandless) 0.020 7.244 -0.016 (G Jordan ) 0.016 7.225 0.025
E3 (W Dent Jr. ) 0.040 7.272 0.022 (R Caraway ) 0.023 7.231 0.001
E2 (G Powers ) 0.018 7.260 -0.010 (R Roland ) 0.050 7.211 -0.029
Qualified: #2 7.223 -1.077 #25 7.170 -0.530

Brandon Peterson breaks out and Richard Alford gets the Stock Ironman.

Here is one of the worst times my nose has bitten me....i alford spun hard on the starting line and i was on and off in front of him most of the way down track and we both crammed the brake at the same time about around the mph cone, we had figured about 86.5 to 87.5mph by the numbers but it turned up at 90.66mph...i was running around 93 wide open.... i fixed my problem for the most part by putting a 29 inch M/T tire on the front lol....but i also needed it to help out my reaction times

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

Bobby,
I could see where that would suck. Really it would make no difference to me if they would lower the beams. It's kind of a double edged sword because yes sometimes it will allow you to get there first, but it's also a risk of breakout too.

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Frank, you're clearly ahead by a foot and a half.. You are the blue car right? Can't you send this photo to NHRA or something?

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That is a great picture Frank. I think some people do underestimate how this works.
If people know their car well enough, they can make it a real advantage.
That is why I said earlier that if I go to a bracket race, I always like to see who has the spoilers on the front of their car, because if you think you have a wheel on them, you obviouly don't.

a friend of mine that rides a bike lost his track ET championship to a car that had the spoiler on the front for that reason. The bike was alot faster than the car (Bracket 2-modified), so he caught the car and could easily see that he was just in front of the wheel, but the guys homemade spoiler took the stripe.

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

https://www.autoimagery.com/store/cg...12&sortfiles=2

This is the as close as I can get to a picture that I can upload to this site. You have to look very close to the front of the car, the stripe takers look almost like shadows.

Casey Miles
248H

Re: Starting Line Beam vs Rest of the Track
 

I agree with Michael Beard on the 3" clearance though about down track beams. But I have had several long talks with a friend that used to install Compulink systems and he gave me all sort of reasons why they chose to locate the beam around 10 inches at all locations except the starting line. On some older tracks there is an issue with crowning and a low beam wouldn't clear the rise at 3 inches. Debris is more of a problem at lower levels. Here in Texas during the fall even crickets become an issue blocking the small beam on the lower starting line beams. I've worked a few ADRL events at our local track and replacing foam reflector cubes can turn into a real workout and your main concern is getting the reflector lined up as quick as possible for the next pare of cars. BTW, My first win in my 65 Chevelle wagon was on the first night I ever used a stripe taker. A couple of guys complained because they were used to seeing where we were to each other when we were at the prestage beams, and they knew their longer, lower nose would take the finish line before my tires would. So my flat black stripe taker fooled them for a week or two. Now most of the racers are used to them so its no big deal, but it is most critical in heads up and no breakout racing where et is everything just as roll out is on the starting line. I believe they are legal in all classes except Stock and Super Stock.

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Bobby, I think the reason the finish line light isn't that low (1") is because there had been issues in the past of Top Fool cars skipping over the finish line lights. I think it happened to Dick Lahaie at Denver 1989, and Don Garlits had it happen to him a few times in the past, based on his autobiography.

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Hello, first I just want to say that , no, I dont run in Stock or SS. I am just a local bracket racer that just read all these responses. My question is this. Why worry about where the stripe is? Why do all this "dropping the nose", "putting a fender on someone", and just over all "sandbagging"? Dont most racers have cars that can run a consistant number or a consistant driver without having to worry about how the car in the other lane is running? Cant these racers put a number on their car and run it pass after pass? From what I have researched, this is why "package racing" is becoming so popular Best package wins. There is no nose dropping or fender racing. You have to know YOUR car, and your car only.

Can someone please explain why bracket racing has turned into a series of finding new "tricks" to beat the other car? I am not hating what you guys do. Just trying to understand.

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Because racing with one gameplan leaves you way too open for your opponents. Plus... There is really no fun in "package racing" IMO. The fun part is the chess game.

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The guys who have won 35+ national events in the sportsman categories do not just put a number on their car and hope for the best package, believe me. Not only do they have lots of talent and know their cars very well, they do everything in their power to find a trick or strategy that increases their chances of winning.