Why Aren't You Racing?
 

It has become very evident that car counts are down at all events this year. Whether it be NHRA, IHRA or our own Association down here in the South. Counts are about half of what they were 5 years ago and down by a third from 2 years ago. My question is why? Why are racers choosing to just stay home? What reason would you give as to why you are not racing as much as you used to? What would the Associations have to do to get you to attend more races? I would ask that you answer these questions seriously as I am sure representatives from the Associations will see this. Jim

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

The State of California can't figure out how to get a budget together

Because I work for the State of California and the moron Governator has just reduced my pay to the Federal Minimum Wage of $7.25 per hour....The A/H will not even pay us the California Minimum Wage of $8.00 per hour

Welcome to Public Service...

Bob

PS: I would rather be anywhere but working
.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

$$$MONEY$$$ and the economy is most likly the primary reason and as time goes on the stocker rules have become more and more lax. One might as well build a so so running Super Stocker if all you want to run are the non heads up style association races. I started 2 projects in the last few years and decided it wasnt worth the money and effort to build a winning National event capable combo. With the new DP's and blown Mustangs HP factors being so far out of line not to mention any other NEW combos coming out what is the point? The investment is a heavy hit if you count the cost of support equipment such as a motor home (even used), inclosed trailer for better security of your car and tools, and a few spare parts not to mention the travel and entry expense. Maybe the thrill just isnt there anymore for the old timers who have been doing this for most of their lives and the younger guys just starting out have a tough time affording a
$70,000+ "stocker" today and understanding the rules as they are. Yes it can be done cheaper but how fast do you want to go and at what level do you want to compete. While a pick up truck would replace a motor home and an open trailer would work instead of an inclosed trailer they are not as comfortable if one wants to have a wife, girl friend, and your kids to be involved and being at a race track for several days not to mention your own comfort level. Most points races require you to be gone from work and home for 5 days or so. Again that means a motor home instead of motel bills. I personally still love drag racing (but dont care for sleeping in a tent at the race track) and the friends you make but it requires a lot of time and money to compete. The sport as we know it has evolved for better or worse. Just my opinion.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Both the almost daily increasing costs of living and the still-shrinking economy have forced me into becoming a sometimes spectator, rather than a frequent competitor...I miss racing, but for me, it's surely the lack of extra $$$ that's keeping me away from the track these days. WJ

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

For me the economy has been a wake up call. Its tough to take the gamble as a close div race still will cost me 500.00 Then I realize how hard I worked to earn it and how fast I just spent it. With contingency monies being at an all time low it really is tough to justify the whole deal. My .0002

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

I agree with what everyone said. Plus the fact that schedules (Div 2) are so screwed up you either do all your racing at the beginning of the season or at the end. Not to mention needing to get to some points race on Thurs, sometimes Wed just to get a spot!!? Not getting enough time runs to even justify going, etc, etc. National events that cost to much and take to long to run. Hotels that go up during races etc.. I like the association races good times for a fair price. The time and money are my biggest factor. Not to mention to stay competative "you need" alot of things...High end stuff. If NHRA would consider these things for the sportsman racer I believe that over time they would have more loyalty. Our association (SSSSA) has had a rough year with weather, car counts etc. But if the association remains focused on a long term goal. A place to race, tough competition, fair entry for a good purse. Etc. Then as the economy gets better (that will take a LONG time) we can branch back out again. These are just thoughts to make things better. I will race as I can afford it.

Robert

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

I am in the auto repo bussiness and i thought for sure with times like they are now i would have job security over a lot of other jobs. Not the case for me as the banks have almost stopped repoing vehs and have started taking any kind of payments from customers rather than repoing and taking to auction and loosing 15 -20 grand on a 35- 40 grand note. The ones we do repo usually are given back to debtor on a fresh note, with even more $$$ owed than before. I figure in about 6 months or so this will have an effect and then the repo bussiness will then again be very good. I have done this for 15 years and have lived a comfortable life(not rich ,but comfy). Right now i am really glad that i have another job with the IHRA as it has helped me in these times. It used to be my racing money,but not for right now. I will be back i hope. Also it is so hot to be racing at this time of year in my area .100 degrees almost every day last week.Lots of people have the money ,but are scared to spend as they do not know how this deal is going to turn out right now.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

It's too expensive, it's too hot in the summer, and I'm too old. The last two are not the sanctioning bodies fault but the money I would have to spend to class race competitively is too far out of my budget. I'll probably swallow my pride and return to bracket racing at my local track.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Didnt I see you on TV the other day repoping an old ladys car and she was beating up on the camera crew.......lol.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I have made 3 IHRA doubles this year so 6 races in all. Never been to that many. Plan on attending the double in Crandall in Sept so that will make 8. When we went down to State Capitol in May it cost me a *(&&() fortune. I don't know how you guys do it running races all over the place. Ed

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

LOL , That was not me , but i did get run over one time by a Mustang(actually fished tailed and throwed me about 10 feet)." Don't " beleive what you see on TV .,.,.,.,.,.,.,..,.,.,.,,

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Agree with the opinions on the economy; but ultimately it has to be the confidence we've lost that the current government is going to turn the ship or if in fact they are even interested in doing that. Until we all get involved and elect people that represent true American values and rewarding people for hard work instead of inventing new reasons for entitlements the confidence will continue to plummet, and racers will be less inclined to spend their discretionary dollars.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

How many excuses do you want?

1. I did some thing stupid screwed up an engine.
2. Fixed screw up. Then had head come off a valve really screwing up the engine.
3. Then took over raising my grandson. Man has daycare gotten expensive. I could easily build a really nice engine with a year of daycare money. But he is worth every penny and I would not have it any other way.
4. Last year 2 surgery’s and 4 months in a nursing home was my whole summer shot.
5. This year we are working on it new motor is done but still have other work to do. We hope to have the car out some time this year to at least hit a combo race in Marion or Brainerd.
6. The economy has not helped at all. We have managed to keep going with cut back hours. That part is looking better things are picking up at work and we are even back to some overtime

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

While I understand the issues reguarding money, both cost of going and payout. And I know that class racers are a very proud bunch. My opinion is that it is easier to talk yourself out of going more now than it used to be. The fire of competing is dwindling down as we get older. This is a sure sign that you are getting older. I feel this myself at 54 years old, but the fire burns on as strong as ever. I am building a car for Super/Stock at my own pace, and do all of the work myself (one person team, design, fabricating, paint, body, engine assembly, electrical, etc ). I'll be lucky to see -.3 under the index, but that's enough to light the "W" on my side in most cases. My point is that you can race for half the cost, if you want to. I can scale back, and back, and back some more but I'll keep going. If I did'nt, well I guess it did'nt mean that much to me anyway. Racers have a tough time going to the races without their car (as a fan), I don't. NHRA, IHRA, Local ET, I still give support to the sport!

Wade Mahaffey

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Expensive $$$$, I agree with everyone else post. And would like to add, after spending $$$ and winning a 1st round race then losing the 2nd round. We still leave empty handed... 1st round $$ would help a bit and give some incentive. Also the class prize $$ is not reflecting collected entries. Racers cost are rising, but the prize $$ is not or racers income. Compared to bracket racing at any of the local tracks, which I only do to get ready for class racing. I race for 800.00 - 500.00 prize $$, completed in the same day at a cost of $100, entry fee being 25.00 - 30.00. There are some other issues to deal with bracket racing, but my point is expense vs possible income. I love clas racing, but my wife looks at it from a math point of view.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

You are fortunate Wade. Not everyone has the talents and shop that you have to construct a car from the ground up. From the pictures I see on this site your Corvette is first class all the way. Cant wait to see it when finished. as you know Im a Corvette nut anyway. The number of races and race tracks (both IHRA and NHRA) in your area (I used to live near you) is about as good as it gets for a certified car nut except maybe where Mike Beard lives....lol. The job situation is better in the D.C. metro area though by far. The guys and gals further out west dont have it so good. Tracks are farther apart and IHRA dosent even exist in most areas. Even here in Florida the travel distance is greater (1 1/2 hours one way here instead of 10 miles) meaning more travel time and expense.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

For the longest time I always wondered how a blue collar type racer could make it these days racing. Lets face it to run a divisional anymore if you live 2 hours away your looking at $600 plus to leave the driveway.
OK lets see, if a person is making lets say $800 a week, average person has house payments, kids, food bill, electric, ect, ect. Well going racing every week isn't getting it done unless you win once in a while and we all know round money don't pay crap anymore. So people not racing and car counts down doesn't surprise me at all anymore. I am doing a story in the next Drag Racing Action Magazine talking about all the SS/Stock series around the country and how they are another avenue to race at if you can not afford the NHRA/IHRA national and divisional events.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Living in New England will do it to you (No tracks and land is expensive). Grew up having a ton of tracks nearby in Ohio/Michigan and the same when living in VA.

Plus the D1 races are to far from the Boston area (5-8 hour ride to attend most of the divisionals). Anchored in with the inlaws, so it's going to be tough racing elsewhere.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Nitro Joe you need to do another S/SS combo in Houston like a few years ago. it was cool and I know alot of guys would come out for it. Ed

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

When there is a question (big question) on the current and future economy, we have to make decisions. I love racing as much as anyone. When I was single, it was 3 days a week plus... Now, Jim Carter hit some of it on the head... what is going to happen? Does the government want things to be "fixed"...?

I am blessed to have a good job now, and I am being careful with my money, as we never know what tomorrow brings. I am having to balance my time and spending with wife and kids wants and needs. They like the races, but not as much as I do! I have had my new project down the track, still have some things to do to it, but it is close. I do not have anywhere near the talents or resources that Wade has, but I have built this car myself. Yes, it has taken a lot longer, and maybe not perfect, but I will keep working on it. Will have new chrome and paint someday, but not this year, etc. I have a crate motor in it now, and the Pontiac motor core sitting in the shed... will be a while probably. I can run IHRA stuff when I have a few close, and bracket race some. Better than sitting and crying...

I am a long time NHRA member, raced with them long before I ever knew about IHRA... with that said, NHRA is still stupid with their big money, in my opinion. Higher fees, not as friendly overall to sportsmen. Yes, can win more $ with them, but when you add it all up, not much more if any.

While I would love to blame the contigency companies for not paying and that being a reason, I do understand they are struggling also. I would say this is one area that either N or I could help... beat the bushes and get more contigency money on the paper, and do not make it so complicated to get paid. I would rather have 3 pay easy and quick at $100 than have to fight with one for $300???

Lastly... it is hot! Please drink a lot of Gatorade! If you have not tried it, go buy some of the "G2" Gatorade. Less sugar, no HFCS and lighter - crisper taste! (guess what I make for a living!)

Hope everyone has a great holiday and God bless our troops!

Ken Graham

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Wow. Maybe I'm not too good at math, but I'm seeing a lot of self-inflicted issues here. There have been at least two posts on this thread already noting that it costs $500 or $600 min. to go to a Divisional race.

A few weeks ago, I went to Richmond for a double-header Pro-Am/Sportsman National. Pickup and open trailer, round trip fuel, $100. Test n' tune $30. Pro-Am: $135 Sportsman Nat'ls: $150 2 nights hotel: $75 (and that was a really nice place... split cost, thanks to Mike Bolton) Total: $490 to run TWO races *and* a Test n' Tune. And that's a lot for me. Last year, I left the house early Saturday AM, and I stayed overnight at the track. Total cost for 2 races: $385 (less than $200/race)

Couple weeks ago, South Georgia Motorsports Park. Ran TWO Southern S/SS Association Races and TWO of Scotty Richardson's BottomBulb Series races. Fuel: $200. Hotel: $80 Entry Fees: $180 total Total Expenses: $460 That's an average of $115 per race.

Last week, Dunn-Benson Pro-Am. Left the house, ran the race, and came home all in the same day. Total cost: $160.

On another thread somewhere, I compared travel time and costs for a racer from middle Tennessee could run for an NHRA Divisional championship vs running for an IHRA Divisional AND World Championship.... the time (including time off work) and mileage to do the latter was nearly HALF.

As Beaver Bob says, "Put a pencil to it." I've personally had an amazing year, and I count my blessings, but I didn't get to where I am because I have a toterhome and stacker with my flavor of the week selection of a CJ or DP, or even a Super Stocker of any kind. I still tow an open trailer (that I won in a shootout race when I was a kid) with a 1500 Ram 4.7L (that I just paid off), and race a car that is paid off. (H*ll, if a guy hadn't pulled out in front of me years ago, I'd probably still be towing with my '89 Ramcharger... R.I.P.) I run races that make sense for me (see above paragraph), and when I do have to stay in a hotel, I try to split a room with somebody. For years, my season-long lodging costs have run around $700/year. How many motorhome payments is that? (and that's not touching on the massively increased fuel costs, etc.) I can run 55+ races a year for more than 15 years on what some guys have in their racing operations, and I'll still be racing when the big rigs are parked. I got a new EZ-Up and two new folding chairs this year. As the Legend told me, "Boy, ya can't hide money, can ya?" :rolleyes:

So the question is, how bad do you want to go racing? If you make up your mind that you really want it, you can do it. Wade is dead-on. We are a proud bunch, but you *can* do it for half the cost if you really want to.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

The IHRA Doubles, while it's nice that youi can get two races for one trip, makes for an expensive weekend. A Double Race weekend is $350, just in crew/entry fees. If I had done the double at MIR this year, with motels, gas, tolls, etc, it would have been nearly a thousand dollars for one weekend.

A trip to Atco or E-town would be about $100 round trip just in tolls, too.

And, to answer the original question, I haven't raced since November 2006, because I'm not happy with the way racing is, and is going, and decided the effort, time and money wasn't worth it. I never thought I would see the day when I would lose the enthusiasm for racing, but it happened.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Maybe we all should move in next door to Mr. Beard to cut back on the tolls and travel.....lol. Racing up north and especially around NJ and New "Yack" can get pretty pricey just in tolls when towing a trailer. Been there and done that.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Re: Contingency... I really haven't had any problems, and have had numerous claims over the years.

Re: G2. Yup, dead-on. Thanks for your good work! ;) I've been supporting your economy! LOL (Think I got Fisher turned onto it the other year, too.) Good stuff.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

I call BS on this one. As your math teacher used to say, "Please show your work." I'm pretty sure it ain't $300 in tolls on that trip.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

All the above. Been here on the forum a while although I don't post much. Probably because I don't have a class car (yet). I sold my super-gas car about 4 years ago and started on a Shelby stocker. (Not the cheapest car to build, LOL)
Being self employeed I've seen my income drop over 60% the past couple of years. Car building is on hold until the economy comes back.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Michael you are absolutely correct. As my father says "How bad do you want it?" I have a open trailer (paid for), just bought a used truck (low mileage, low price). While some things are nice allot are not nec. to go racing. The only thing about where I live it the 2+ hr tow to go to any track. But, other than that at least there are some tracks!! Good luck and keep up the good work. Robert

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Michael I race on a budget trust me I mean budget. I work the State of Texas. I'm not doubting your numbers. here is what it cost me to race at Baton Rouge in May at the double. My wife looked at all the receipts. She wasn't amused at all!!LOL

Entry fee 135.00X2=270.00
Crew 40.00
Hotel bill 109.00
race gas 50.00
fuel for truck roundtrip 324.00 ouch 445 miles each way
food misc 75.00

Not complaining just stating my costs. I had never went that far before to a race. probably won't anytime soon because of the costs. We normally stick closer to home Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, Crandall, Lufkin, etc.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Buff Daddy said a few lines down: "A trip to Atco or E-town would be about $100 round trip just in tolls, too."

So onto my excuse:

I share his sentiment. I felt I was personally mistreated at a race, NHRA (management) did nothing to rectify the situation, so I told them they are not going to get another dime of my money until they either apologize or at least there is a change in management.

I haven't been down a track in 9 months, never renewed my membership / competition numbers, and I am not missing it one bit.

If it weren't for the fact that I own a stocker and enclosed trailer, I'd at least be out of the class racing business (not racing all together, but at least this level). That's the big downside to all of this, I am making payments on equipment that is sitting there not being used. Hell, I had some guy come up to me at a gas station and offer me $2,000 for my Suburban. I had to say "no" because what am I gonna do, go out and put a downpayment on ANOTHER big truck? No way.

I keep saying that I am going to race IHRA one of these days, but in reality the nearest race is a little over 4 hours away. To get there on-time and not be rushed I am going to have to take time off from work, no doubt about it.

It's really a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Never said there were $300 in tolls.

MIR Double Pro-Am weekend projected costs:

-Entry: $135 x 2 races = $270.
-Crew: Two people @ $40 per person = $80.
-Motel: Two nights @ approximately $100 each = $200 I could cut the Friday night room out of the budget, and either leave home around midnight Saturday morning and drive pretty much all night to be there by 8 am, or try and sleep three in our dually somewhere in a rest area. Not ideal or comfortable, but doable.
-Gas: Haven't done the actual math. I know it would involve at least three fill-ups (one at home, once during the weekend, once on the way home). Thirty gallon tank. 30 gallons x three fill-ups (90 gallons) @ $2.79 per gallon = $251.10

Total so far: $801.10. Or, $701.10 with one good nights sleep.

Tolls, I am not sure of the exact figure. I know PA Tolls have gone up twice in the past few years. I have at least $5 in tolls before I get to the Turnpike (Toll Route 60, future I-376, that takes you to exit 1A/Exit 10 on the PA Turnpike). I went to Quarter Aces a few weeks ago, but neglected to check the toll amounts. Dad did say that towing, all the way across PA, would be nearly fifty dollars I would bet good money that tolls, between Turnpike and Rt 60 are AT LEAST $50, round trip [from Breezewood PA to Exit 1A back home], plus whatever the toll for the bridge is that we cross in MD/VA (I forget what the toll, and the bridge is--haven't been there since 2004). So we're up to at least $850, not counting food and any extra stuff we might want to buy on our trip (t-shirts, souvenirs, gift shops, etc). We can cook at the track and save some money, but you still need to buy the food at home to take with you, plus breakfast at the track isn't feasible.

So. all told, the budget for the weekend would be about $900, provided there are not any surprise expenses. Or, at least $800 if you only sleep one night in a hotel. Still not a cheap weekend, no matter what way you look at it.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Because somebody has to pay for Mom and Dad's trip out west :)

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

I would enjoy raceing ,even though the cost is higher, just not as many races, the problem I have is ,MENEARES Disease, (Vertigo) ! It really hurts to not be able to race, after doing it since 1956. I have 2 race ready cars, if they ever figure out how to solve my problem ! Guys count your blessings, money is really the least of it !!,,, John

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Not enough time. Plus, i'm 55, and not near as dedicated as when i was 18.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

OK, so we've heard all the excuses as to dwindling car counts and there's probably dozens of others. Let's change this around and how about what can be done about it? And forget the fact of the economy or the a change in government. That'll probably never happen. What would it take to get you to come to a race? Why go to one and not another?

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Of course money but also time - read my signature comment

I have gotten older and put a higher value on how I spend my time

I still spend money foolishly just not nearly as often

I think this is an enevitable part of life as you grow older (over 60)

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

because they lowered the indexes. now my .2 under car isn't fast enough to make the index. oh well back to brackets i guess.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

I really feel bad for those unhappy with the sport and/or the folks that run it. Everyone has good ideas of how it should be. Some people take actions for change, and some will comply with whatever. Most of the time, the ones most agravated are the ones fixed on one thing or have all their eggs in one basket. I feel it's better to be flexible, Example: a Stocker that can also fit in S/S, now he can race any National Event he wants. Or in my case, someone who raced a car then retired it to a street rod. You can still enjoy your car, and maybe go back to racing down the road. My Roadster is so much fun on the street, and it cost me fifteen bucks a day for fuel. As I build this 60 Corvette for Super/Stock, it is very mild and very versatile and/or miltifaceted. Put on a muffler and go right on the street! I don't need to depend on NHRA,IHRA, to give me a place to play. But if I want to go there, I can! Remember, if you want to do it.....do it today! Your not promised tomorrow my friend! forge on and never give up!

WHEN YOU STOP TRYING.....YOU START DYING (Wade Mahaffey)

X Man thanks for the kind words. self taught, self made my brother.

MB You are the one closest to breaking even on this board! congrats on that champ!

JD Use your influence to promote more combos with Nitro, give them another place to go and get rid of the index for those shows. So the folks that can't make the index, (little guy) can still dial-in. Get-um in the door, allow them time to learn how to go fast. Bring them along and up to standards as time goes along. You need new blood lines on the farm!

Wade Mahaffey

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

How many rounds did you go?

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

That's it four hours.

Re: Why Aren't You Racing?
 

Mr Beard, If you take all those figures you came up with and double them now thats what it takes to race on the West Coast !!
National Event entry 280$ tickets for wife and kids 180$ cheap motel 3 nights 240$
Fuel 350$ round trip, Do you not maintain your Race Car that is a yearly expense ?
What about Race Gas Gotta have that dont we ? Food brought with us is a expense
Do you not eat ? I think your leaving a few things out dont ya lol.
Lets see Im no Math expert but I can Add.. Expense not even including most the costs is uh 1,050$ tax not included lol. God I love this sport