3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
The 5.7 and the 360 DPs and the 2010 CJ 352 got 3.25% effective tomorrow. I am sure this not for profit organization can make it without my money.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
No change posted yet on the 2010 Challengers. Aren't the 09 and 10 Challengers identical?
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
What engine was Pendarvas running in C/SA
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Dempsey was running a 5.7
And I don't think they have delivered any 2010's yet...So maybe they are waiting for them to be built and delivered before they add horsepower to them. But I didn't see any other engine options but 6.1, and maybe a 6.4 too. David The New Hemi Guy |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
what class does this fit in naturallly and can you move up as many classes as you want???
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The 5.7 is a natural D car. So you can move up one and down one class. C,D,E for now. It started out as a natural E car and was re-factored after Bristol. |
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Yep, No doubt.
You see what they think of 90 % of y'all. A couple of downloads, a few key strokes ,and they were done this morning before coffee break. They got their pay off. What did YOU get? No doubt Indy will will fill up again next year, no matter what.. You're gonna have to face it , you're addicted to Wallys.... |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
I think I'll have some t-shirts made up:
"I ran 1.7 under at Indy and all I got was 3.25%!" :eek: |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
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New Drag Pack stocker $100k Trip to Indy $3k Anihillating every conventional stocker in my class by over half a second, and NHRA laughing all the way to the bank...........................priceless (well the rest of us have to pay the price) |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
They probably didn't think those performances warranted any more, since Indy's a mineshaft... :rolleyes:
Well, there ya go.... keep racing with them. Things aren't going to change, because the longer they can keep them underfactored, the more people may give in and "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em." -- when the sales of the cars and engines slow or stop, then they "might" adjust them. |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Is today April 1st??
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
160 plus stockers and SS at at the 2010 US nationals. Where is that kind of car count in IHRA Mike B? 80% of you bitching don't even race at INDY or with NHRA. Yes HP factors are way out of line right now, but look at how many new cars and people are in S and SS now. S and SS have grown more in the past two years then in the last 10. Something like this is the only way to get new people in our sport. Over time this will be a good thing for our sport.
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I am new to this and I race stock eliminator. I do not race a new Drag Pak or Cobra Jet. I paid a lot of money for myself to get a car that was competitive and had already been factored to death. It was the most economical way for me to participate. I got a half a year into racing before the Cobra Jets hit, then come the Drag Paks. I am new blood! I am considering selling my stuff and going back to other interests since the NHRA has not held up their end of the deal in honoring the spirit and intent of Stock Eliminator. IHRA is out of the picture since there aren't enough tracks in my area. Again, I am the new blood and I am leaving (or in the process of it). I really had my hopes up that Indy would wake up the NHRA and they would reclassify the cars into the Factory Experimental class which I think is pretty neat. For the final time in case someone missed it. I am the future of the NHRA and I am leaving. I won't let the door hit me in the ***. Don |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Go back and look car counts have been down at National Events and Points meets last year and this!! Div1 has had higher counts than Dive II for some time. Something to think about is alot of the older cars had thier HP ratings adjusted before the .30 was subtracted now do they go back and correct for that mistake. What about the difference in Dyno corrections between the old and new??
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Time line - late 1960's......if there was an internet back then it would have gone something like this.
"Everyone with 55-57 Chevy stockers are being run out of business. These new Mustangs and Camaros should be put in a different class. We just cannot compete with those new factory built cars. They need to have horsepower added to them or else I'm going to have to quit racing. NHRA needs to do something before Stock is gone." Well in 1972 NHRA did do something. |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Charlie, I know how to keep me in the sport. Lower my horse power rating.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
For what its worth....i was told that the way the AHFS is set up (Written) this is all NHRA can do at the present, supposedly it go's back to the way Len Imbrogno wrote it up. Now truth or not this is what i was told, NHRA has to rewrite the AHFS, in the mean time all the earlier cars will get their butts kicked while NHRA decides how to do this. Go figure,as i said before (SAD)
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
They will never rewrite the AHFS so that it works correctly and in a timely manner. They'd have to pay someone to rewrite it because they would never use the model given them 3-5 times in the last 5 years by people who understand what is necessary to create a system that works without human intervention and in a fair manner across the board for everyone affected by it. They don't want that to happen anyway, because it would prevent them from playing favorites and having control.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Having just sold my Stocker, that I ran in NHRA, I think the trend to buying a $100,000.00 Stocker and $100,000+ S/Stocker is only growing the class because the guys with cash are getting into it with the hope of the "collector car" paying off down the road. I didn;t notice many of the "new Stockers" in anything but a Gold Rush or Renegade trailer with a Toter or a $300K pusher pulling them (usually two of them). That's cool, and I can appreciate wealth and it's benefits. I just think it is a shame what it will do to Stock and S/Stock eliminator in the long run.
I really liked the Stock class, the guys who run it and the inventive ways they tried to gain an edge. Now it seems you just get out the checkbook, hope NHRA doesn't really factor you correctly and go beat up on conventional cars in the class. I feel NHRA is going to have to separate the new generation Stocker from the carbureted Stockers. Just too much computer controlled fuel and timing management for carbs to compete against (not to mention they are WAY OFF on H.P. numbers) Just give the new-gen cars their own set of classes and let them beat each other up in class or during heads-up runs in Eliminations. Not really any different than the way NHRA has allowed all the "Comp cars" into S/Stock. Hood scoops, tube chassis, sheet metal intakes, $30K small blocks running 8.90s. Are those Cobalts and such REALLY a Super Stock car? Are the conventional Camaro or Mopar S/Stockers really on a level playing field as far as reliability and repeatability with a completely fabricated Super Stock Cobalt? The latest versions of these 8-second S/Stockers will and are doing to the class what rear engine dragsters did to bracket racing. It is a distinct advantage to "come from behind" and to that end racers will drop $130K to have a better shot at winning that elusive Wally. When the guys who really want to win all get the fastest cars, you will have smaller fields of very similar cars, ala bracket racing. Then the uniqueness of S/Stock starts it's trip down memory lane. Just my opinion as I sat and watched Stock and S/Stock at Indy. Fun to watch, no doubt, but not headed in any sort of direction that will grow the sport. Good luck to all of you and I hope you choice of class and car turns into a winning combination for you. I have to admit it was nice to see over 300 cars in Stock and S/Stock at Indy....will be interesting to see if that ever happens again after seeing so many excellent cars go home because the new-gen Fords and Mopars ran all over them in class and qualifying. Jok "nuthin' but a dragster driver now" |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
I know two IHRA racers that were thinking about coming over to NHRA. The current situation has put a quick end to this. They don't have the money to jump into one of these new cars. I suggested that they start buying lottery tickets and maybe they could get lucky and buy a car that would put them in the top of the field.
We need to put these car's in an FX class. That is what they are. No VIN's no air bags. This will make everyone happy. |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Very good points made by Jok. Jok, that would be a very good start on an article for Drag Racing Online. It does seem like in the last few years that Stock has become Super Stock and Super Stock has become Competition Eliminator. Meanwhile, Ford and Dodge are taking full advantage of a flawed AHFS.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Great idea on the FX class. Definitely what they have created.
Jok |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
>> 160 plus stockers and SS at at the 2010 US nationals. Where is that kind of car count in IHRA Mike B?
There isn't. -=shrug=- You got me... I raced four times in three days this weekend, did so on a budget, made good money. Just because the majority of people do one thing doesn't mean that it's the best or makes the most sense. If people who live within a reasonable distance of IHRA events don't support those events, whose fault is it? Those who try it overwhelmingly have a positive experience. What exactly does any of that have to do with the policies of NHRA? Car counts at the US Nationals are because it's the US Nationals at Indy. Even other NHRA events don't come close. The US Class Nationals drew even more cars, which tells us that it's the kind of racing people want to do, not the sanctioning body that makes the difference. >> 80% of you bitching don't even race at INDY or with NHRA. I have raced NHRA (Finished #11 in NHRA Div. 1 in my rookie year, and that was in a FWD car.), and I have competed at Indy. NHRA has a number of issues that I don't agree with, so after expressing my opinion about them, I choose to race elsewhere 99% of the time. I'm not into the "battered wife syndrome". Banging your head against the wall doesn't give one's opinion more credibility. >> Yes HP factors are way out of line right now, ....SOOOOOoooooooo make it right! (or at least make an honest effort to get it in the right zip code) That's all anybody's really asking for! >>but look at how many new cars and people are in S and SS now. Yah. $100,000 cars are a great way to get new blood into the sport. That's sustainable. How many new people *are* in S/SS now? That vast majority of people in the new cars are not new to the sport. I think the new cars are really cool, and I wouldn't mind driving one myself, but nobody can tell you with a straight face that they are any semblance of right. "CJ's and DP's are great because they bring new cars and people into the sport, and it's okay that they're not factored right".... Funny, you don't say the same about the "evil Crate Motor cars", which have brought MANY times the number of cars and people into the sport, and they complain about how soft the crate motor cars are, while the 360 Magnum crate motor is rated 50 HP more than the 5.9L DP engine, which has better specs all the way around. I don't care which side of the argument you support, but be consistent. |
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When that's solved they will be coming.I know someone ready to build one for a customer. Jeff,it's real easy to kick Len in the *** now for the AHFS.There's nothung from stopping them from rewriting it,with input from the otside,but the ingrates in charge now. |
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
[QUOTE=Michael Beard;208944]
>> 80% of you bitching don't even race at INDY or with NHRA. Actually Michael, most of the people posting here do race NHRA or have raced at the US Nationals. I ran it in '96, '97 and '98. Unfortunately, I gave up after I couldn't make the field the last two years. IHRA is an alternative for some, that I have personally supported and participated in myself, but it appears that they are on the downturn due to the economy and the Evan Knoll/Torco fiasco. They put too many eggs in Evan's basket and are now paying for it dearly. |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Before all yall lose your rudder completely, the 6.1 has been hit twice in the past year and is in line for another at the end of the year, the 5.7 has been hit 21 hp in the last 60 to 90 days, and will get some more before the end of the year, and the 360 has been to two national events this year in stock eliminator and was hit once for 9 hp. With that many cars out there, the system will work in short order. And the cars don't cost 100k. Mine cost 60k less the value of a 6.1 dp motor which wholesales for 14k that I have in an engine stand. I guess it was ok for the 396's and 428's to kick everyone up till now. Or the mid 80's efi motors, or the other combos that go fast. And complain about them driving cars out, it looks like it was happening anyway. Bring back the EFI classes? Might be an option, stick/auto? SS/AH shows you can have two factors in one class. Make some heads up classes? Next year I'm gonna bring my wife's PT Cruiser Covertable Turbo. I gotta say it was more fun running 4 tenths faster in class than it was running 4 tenths slower last year. But I don't remember complaining about losing by 4 tenths. I did something about it. I got another car. On another note, I have been asking NHRA for new parts for the old cars for 15 years. I am still asking, especially heads, as the 40 year old parts that I ran until now were scarce, rusty, and beat up. And let's face it, an out the box Edlebrock head is better than the acid or other means ported heads in stock and cost about half as much.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Here's the Reading entry list sorted by class...people may moan and groan but above all else they want to race....no withdrawals since Indy so apparently if people have a car they can't class differently than an entered 'killer' car they just hope they avoid it during eliminations.
Just saying..... 18 A/S Ralph Porpora '69 Camaro Chev 396 1330 A/S David Casey '69 Corvette Chev 427 3602 A/S Jason Mc Cormack '66 Belvedere Plym 426 1073 A/SA Edward Horensky '68 Shelby Ford 428 117K A/SA Brooks Lee '69 Camaro Chev 396 1199 A/SA Steve Calabro '69 Corvette Chev 427 1242 A/SA Jc James Beattie JR '09 Challenger Dodg 370 1470 A/SA Adam Keir '70 Chevy Nova GM 402 1656 AA/SA Kenneth Miele '67 Shelby Ford 428 1960 AA/SA Edward Alessi Jr '69 Camaro Chev 427 1990 AA/SA David Barton '09 Coronet Dodg 426 1152 B/S Edward Bednaz '69 Nova Chev 396 1441 B/S Richard Adkins Jr '67 Shelby Ford 428 1518 B/S Bob Broadbent '69 Camaro Chev 396 3969 B/S Joseph Martens '69 Camaro Chev 396 71 B/SA Brian McClanahan '02 Pontiac Pont 346 187 B/SA Bob Moran Jr '69 Camaro Chev 396 396 B/SA Mike Fuller '69 Camaro Chev 396 1002 B/SA Jeffrey Bardekoff '64 Fury Plym 426 1013 B/SA David Ficacci '69 Camaro Chev 396 1020 B/SA Francois Periard '68 Road Runner Plym 426 1041 B/SA Steve Welker '69 Camaro Chev 396 1352 B/SA Bill Hawk '67 Shelby Ford 428 1406 B/SA Matt Rover '71 Challenger Dodg 440 1570 B/SA Frank Bialas '70 GTX Plym 440 1778 B/SA Joseph Santangelo II '95 Camaro Chev 350 1840 B/SA Couturier Serge '64 Dodge Dodg 426 2923 B/SA Gregory Rowe '95 Firebird Pont 350 1904 BF/S Dennis Chapman '88 Dodge Dodg 135 1056 C/S Todd Bednaz '68 Camaro Chev 396 22 C/SA Mickey Whaley '69 Camaro Chev 350 1150 C/SA Russell Linke '96 Camaro Chev 350 123A C/SA Billy Kirpens Jr '69 Barracuda Plym 440 1883 C/SA Eric Merryfield '09 Challenger Dodg 345 1710 D/S Jerry Mac Neish '67 Camaro Chev 302 2 D/SA Anthony Fetch '68 Chevrolet Chev 396 14 D/SA Matthew Welker '68 Camaro Chev 396 1129 D/SA Victor Guilmino III '71 Mustang Ford 429 1262 D/SA Ken Robinson '67 Camaro Chev 396 1043 E/S Doc Horn '67 1973 Plym 440 1165 E/S Dean Cook '72 Ford Ford 351 1255 E/SA Maurice Bivins Jr '71 Plymouth Plym 340 1348 E/SA Mike Farrell '71 Challenger Dodg 383 1547 E/SA Jack Matyas '04 Pontiac Pont 346 1728 E/SA Ralph Kershner Jr '71 Plymouth Plym 340 1018 F/S Adam Strang '68 Firebird Pont 400 1049 F/SA Ron Infantino '69 Camaro Chev 350 1121 F/SA Lenny Williams '71 Buick GS Buic 455 1351 F/SA Tex Miller '71 Mustang Ford 351 1559 F/SA Tom O Loughlin '68 Chevelle Chev 396 1658 F/SA Matt Ticcony '67 Barracuda Plym 383 1578 G/S Jim Roberts '69 Camaro Chev 350 5 G/SA Dustan Lowell '72 Duster Chry 340 1040 G/SA Stan Giermanski '68 Camaro Chev 327 1109 G/SA John Gray Jr '72 Nova Chev 350 1614 G/SA Barry Parker '74 Corvette Chev 350 1721 G/SA Joe Lisa '70 Chevy Nova Chev 350 1860 G/SA Anthony Curcio '69 Camaro Chev 350 1967 G/SA Jim Marshall '80 Corvette Chev 350 117 H/SA Norm Hall '69 Chevrolet Chev 350 1280 H/SA Charles Veach '84 Camaro Chev 305 1290 H/SA James Perrone '69 Nova Chev 350 1317 H/SA Joe De Marzo '72 Chev II Chev 350 1525 H/SA Daniel Lynch '69 Camaro Chev 350 1584 H/SA Donald Pires '72 Nova Chev 350 1617 H/SA Gary Parker '75 Camaro Chev 350 15 I/SA Katie Sepanek '72 Chevelle Chev 350 1168 J/S Dean Cook II '95 Ford Ford 302 1616 J/S Sam Murray '72 Cutlass Olds 350 17 J/SA Frank Ferrucci Jr '90 IROC Chev 350 190 J/SA Frank Aragona Jr '86 Camaro Chev 305 1021 J/SA Eugene Monahan '90 Firebird GM 350 1924 J/SA Bud Rowe '86 Camaro Chev 305 1077 K/SA James English '89 Camaro Chev 305 1116 K/SA Jeanne Linke '85 Camaro Chev 305 2209 K/SA Jorge Carnero '90 Trans Am GM 350 115F L/SA John Fedeli Jr '76 Oldsmobile Olds 455 1424 M/SA Joe Mocci '69 Camaro Chev 350 144 O/SA Bob Bender '69 Kingswood Chev 350 1222 P/S Joe Cokinos '96 S-10 Chev 262 1945 T/SA Ed Fernandez '77 Gremlin AMC 258 |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
[QUOTE=Jim Kaekel;208960]
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I'll take 5 of them please. :D |
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
Jeff,
You are absolutely correct, you were #141 qualifier last year at Indy and I cannot find anything on this site where you were complaining about other cars or your HP. Although it is not an option for all of us to build or buy a different car it is still a performanced based class, it is just that the performance is changing. I don't think the #1 qualifier has $100,000 in that car nor does the #8, #9, #10, #16, #17 or #18 qualifier. I am not siding with NHRA, but we all make our choices, some good, some not so good. Things are always changing in the drag racing world (some good, some not so good). I think a lot of us sportsman guys feel we don't get any respect from NHRA, from TV time to correct HP on all combinations. But we are still part of the show, we could be phased out like the Pro Stock trucks and end up just bracket racers with nothing to show for our hard work, time, money and effort ... Everyone knew what the DP's and CJ's were capable of before Indy. Some racers were able to change class and dodge the bullet, others could not, but you still entered. Look at what it costs to run a SS/AH car, how many of those guys had a chance of winning? But they still entered to be part of the show. 8.60's or 8.70's is still fast for an AH car, but that was not good enough to make the final cut. |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
I believe John Shaul was entered at Reading and he is not on the list anymore. Probably some people were waiting to see what NHRA was going to do. I predict there will be more withdrawals.
Patsy |
Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
John made it very clear at Indy that he was not going to Reading because of these cars.
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Re: 3.25% for the DP & CJ is just a slap in the face
John is a very talented race car builder and driver. He is very lucky that he has a stable of cars to choose from. He could enter the 67 Cuda or the 62 Plymouth and be very competitive and avoid the DP's and CJ's but that is his choice.
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