Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Indy is all fine and dandy BUT Danny & Bruce have been around too long to not know what would happen!! They should have seen last year when the first CJ were too fast for the roll cages. Too many hidden interest out there. It will be hard to get all the horses back in the barn know that they are free just like all the SS chassis mods that don't meet the specs, how about FWD Sturts on rear wheel drive cars but the Old F-cars can't do it.
Time to clean house in Glendora in tech department. Glen Gray should fix this!

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

As much as this needs to happen it will not. Lets face it if there are a couple of choices to be made, NHRA will ALWAYS pick the one that is the most foolish! It has been proven over the years....Even with the HP increases (Laugh), the "G" car can and will outrun any car from D on down. I am not knocking Jeff for his car choice but I am knocking the absurd "blindness" of NHRA for the complete lack of understanding of the stock class. As Woodro put it Sad real Sad........

Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Well, I may just put the brakes on selling my stuff. I cannot offer proof of what I am about to say, but Indy did get the NHRA's attention. A very reliable source told me that it finally hit Gracia that there is a real problem out there with the current classifications/hp ratings/etc...of the Drag Paks and Cobra Jets.

Basically, Danny was not too keen on the idea of putting them in the FX classes before Indy, but when the news got out how fast they were running and how much more weight they were carrying over the minimums it made them realize something has to be done. That may be why there were only minimal hp changes on the combos if they are about to be put into FX classes.

Keep your eyes pealed for upcoming changes on these cars. Good gosh, there may be hope.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Thank god

Now Larry Hill and Greg Hill can get back to racing.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Everything you said is true, but it is what it is. I wish I had the ability to substantiate my information, but it was enough for me to put a halt to my plans of selling my car.

The horse is already out of the barn for the Drag Paks and Cobra Jets, but Glendora can build a new barn right around them with the FX classification. This would take it from a win/lose situation to everyone shares a bit of a win.

That doesn't correct some of the other items you have addressed. It does at least address one of the most inane decisions that they have made lately.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

The 'fast' news didn't need to travel far, Gracia was at Indy...

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

One thing that should be done is do new corrections on engines either the old engines should be corrected to the Dyno Correction SAE J1349 which is to 29.234 Baro & 77 degrees. The old Correction SAE J607 is to 29.92 & 60 degrees. This would reduce the old engines by 4%. Or you could just add 4 % to the new engines

http://www.land-and-sea.com/dyno-tec...horsepower.htm
Look at this web site on dyno corrections.

Need to get all engines rated at the same weather correction.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I heard Stevie Wonder saw what was going on and tipped off Danny. LOL.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Add 4 % ? Dont you mean add 20% to the new engines !!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I hope you're not holding your breath.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

xyz

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

A good start to lessening the effects of the new cars that I believe we all can live with is to make the AHFS quarterly instead of twice a year.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Or should I say speed up the process.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

One can only hope that something like this gets put in place. I can only see this as being a win/win situation for both parties. This way Dodge and Ford can really show what they got, without simply murdering the rest of the cars out in the field.

I do not have anything against Ford or Dodge for building these cars. I think it is great that the manufacturers have interest in our class, however they are obviously factored wrong as everyone can see. When a C/SA goes faster than most A/SA cars, there is something very very wrong.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

So should the FX classes stay in Stock or be moved into S/S? If they stay in Stock in their own FX classes, they will let it all hang out showing everyone what they are capable of running.

Do you really want 140 plus MPH cars passing you at the finish line?

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I think they should stay in stock for a few reasons. First they are more like stockers in appearance to the public than super stockers. Secondly they should run on 9" tires to help maintain that appearance. And finally, I want the opportunity to put as many on the trailer as possible to "get even." :D

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I vote for keeping them in stock, however giving them thier own FX classes.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Putting these cars in a FX catagory would be a good resolution for everyone. The factories would be able to use this as a great marketig tool. The could brag of selling a factory race car to all the rich kids and they could butt heads with each other on a heads up basis,while racing the real stockers (ones with VINS) in the eliminator on a dial in basis.

As far as having one run me down at 140 MPH ,I am not that concerned. I learned to bracket race against cars that went 150 to 160 while I was traveling 114 to 118 MPH. You just need to make your car and your driving consistent.Something that doesn't take a wheel barrel full of money.

BRING BACK THE FACTORY WARS AS THEY WERE IN THE 1960's

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Didn't the FX classes make lots of hot print back in the day?

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Why not put them in both stock and superstock as they are.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Good point when was the last time you seen a SS/B car run 8.60 lol
1 5251 SS/B Todd Patterson, Augusta KS, '10 Mustang 8.675 9.90 -1.225
2 243 SS/BA Roy Hill, Sophia NC, '10 Mustang 8.775 9.90 -1.125

Uh thats 1.55 under the old index

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Who won class in SS/B this year? And I think about six years ago David Barton with his Dart had the SS/BA Record at some where around 8.80.

Do any if you really think NHRA is going to put these cars in a FX class come on. Nothing is going to change you can all bitch on this form about how its not far all you want. But it will not change one thing.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

IHRA's SS/B and SS/BA index is 10.20 ! That puts Todd Patterson at 1.525 under and Roy at 1.425 under. Kind of makes those neat old 64 & 65 Hemi cars a pile of expensive junk dosen't it ! Can you say "Nostalgia Racing" is in thier future. If Im not mistaken Roy was quicker than Armstrongs Corvette was in SS/AA and on smaller tires? Those things belong in SS/A !

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

only because he broke/spun/rolled out of the beams, not because there was someone faster. Open your eyes

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I'am just looking at the facts. Who won SS/AA this year?

How come no one is bitching about the PT? hell he went almost -2.00.

How many DP'sand CJ's went more then three rounds at INDY this year?

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Well...the PT meets all of the requirements of a street registered stocker. And it runs in a class that the cars are all quite similar. Head's up are generally not out of whack and eliminations are a dial in matter from there. Not sure that the PT helps your case.

You might want to be more specific with your DP/CJ example. How many of them went deep into class eliminations and/or how many of them beat a legit stocker in eliminations. Irvin Johns did a fantastic job of driving in super stock, but did you see his lights in stock? He had several horrible lights and won!

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

He's not affecting the older cars! Ray Charles could have seen that one

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

So what you are saying is only under factored combos in A-F matter.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Charley,

You keep referencing the LT1 cars and how long it took them to get factored properly. At least they were in their own class until then! That is all anyone is asking. Class the Drag Paks and Cobra Jets properly to let them eventually reach the proper horsepower factor.

Why is this so hard for you to understand? Is it because you have one and you like the idea of having an unfair advantage until things are sorted out? The LT1's didn't have an unfair advantage against the older cars since they weren't in heads up races except against each other.

Don

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Boy I wish the website can get the servers corrected. It is getting tough to follow the flow of the posts.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Charley Downing

LOL! I so enjoy reading your posts trying to defend what is happening in our class!!

The thing is, I don't know if you are serious or just jerking everyones chain because you know how upset we all are!!!

But keep it up and keep the flames glowing!!!

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Also Blossom got bumped to a natural BF/S car from what I understand? So the system worked there. I know there are cars that can run BF/S that will out run his car. His still might be under factored, but all of those fwd turbo cars are underfactored. At least they are all in the same boat.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

I know these new car are way out of line. But here are the facts

Plus side
Fans Love these new cars
Fans love cars they can relate to
Who would build a new car if was not rated soft? (look at the new Camaro do you see any out here)
Our class is getting more fans
New members in stock and superstock
Some kinds of factory/dealership support again
Win on Sunday sell in Monday (This still works)
S/SS Chassis shops staying in business
S/SS Engine builder staying in business



Negative side
New soft combos
NHRA not stepping in and correcting HP (this is the big problem)


I Agree Dumpy Pendarvise or whatever his name is run of 9.79 in C/SA is a joke. NHRA should add 35 hp to those type combos that make runs like that. But don’t blame Fords or Dodge they did what any company would have done. Racers have been finding soft combos for years it is all just part of the game. No combo is on top forever. This will change it’s just going to take time. Hell it took 15 years for the LT1 to go from 275hp to 346hp. These combs are here to stay so quit or change with the times.
I'am upset just like everyone else. I have a LT1 car that if I put 25,000 into today I still could not run within .50 of the DP's And CJ's in B/SA and C/SA

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

1. Stock and Superstock doesn't have very many fans. You can't count the 45 relatives that happened to be sitting there.
2. New fans aren't paying to get into the gate to watch Stock and Superstock. They check out Dragracecentral. Just because a few stayed in their seats after the pro's were done at Indy doesn't mean anything.
3. 95% of the new cars that have been built are built by present Stock/Superstock racers and a few Comp guys.
4. "Win on Sunday, Sell on Monday" - That must explain why the Camaro has sold more units over the last three months than both the Mustang and Challenger and is in a dead heat with the Mustang for 2009.
5. If anything, stock/super stock engine builders are being hurt. Their clients that usually come back every year for a tune-up are going to their closest chassis dyno with a laptop in their hands with their new cars.
6. NMCA is the king at "cars people can relate to". Go ask the owners over there how their tickets sales are going.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

While these new factory racecars are great performers & the (few) spectators can relate to them at some level, the fact is, their technologyis so far beyond what most Stock & S/S guys have in their stable, it probably is time to resurrect the old F/X class. It's just a question of what's fair --- to expect a guy to run his 5,6, or more year old combination against a car who has a whole multi-billion dollar corporation backing them.
And don't tell me "they" don't! A friend's chassis shop completed work on a CobraJet car & NOTHING was similiar to "stock", PLUS he was told in no uncertain terms, what could & couldn't be done to the motor! So what you have is a corporate race car, managed, designed & built by professionals, that are running in an "ameteur" or "sportsman" class. Yes, I know some of these hobbyists are as good or better than many pros, but for the guythat's trying or hoping to get into this, he's lost before he's even stepped foot in the pits!
I don't mind this level of professionalism--Hell, I think in alot of ways it's a good thing. Just own up to what it is, why they're doing it, and let the dust settle where it may.
Stepping back & looking at it this way, I think most anyone can see it's time for F/X to come back!

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Dgal
Just so you know LT1 cars where in G/SA H/SA I/SA for the first three years killing other combs like the 255/350. No different then the New CJs and DP's

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Charley please tell us how any of these pluses would not still exist if the cars were in there own FX class within the stock class.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Everyone seems to forget somewhere back in the day in order to run stock the factory had to produce 500 units show room available to the public. Less than that was super stock. At that time super stock was king. Maybe we should go back to what works. Just my 2c.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

BIG difference. the LT cars carried a factory rating the same as the showroom car, which anyone could go buy, there were way more than 500. Were they factored soft, yes, but no one KNEW the potential of those motors ahead of time either. The DP/CJ motors were designed to be race motors, and ford/chrysler LIED, BOLD FACE LIED, about the HP ratings. maybe the LT1's should have started at 300 like the vette motor, but in all fairness it was factored at what the showroom available motor was SAE rated at (and there is no way GM gave two craps about stock eliminator enough to lie about it on purpose). The closest relative to a CJ motor is rated at 540 SAE hp, 425 for the DP (with much less compression, cam, heads, intake and throttle body.

Re: Drag Pak/Cobra Jet FX classes
 

Just for informations sake!
If I recall correctly, Mopar Performance told me they had to wait "(FOR THE NHRA)" to supply a HP rating from the three complete engines "SUBMITTED TO THE NHRA" prior to the release of the Drag Pak cars.

Cheers

Peter Ash