Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

I have been outspoken about this subect and we have had a ga-zillion comments about it. I am not racing the Winternationals this year and I am listening and watching on the internet.
The race is on hold for a Top Fuel oil down. Been down for a half an hour now, enough time to run the next complete round of Super Stock. Earlier was a similar Funny Car oil down. Yesterday evening, an Alcohol Funny car oiled over half the track. I listened to the first round of Stock and Super Stock, and recall one incident of water on the starting line, that took a minute to clean up, with about 140 cars going down the track. I may have missed some, but it certainly was not like the fuel cars where you: Make a run, clean the track, etc.
The probablilty of a Fuel Car oiling the track is (on a scale of 1 - 10) is probably around 5. The likelihood of a Stock or SuperStock car is, in my estimation, significantly less than 1. I would like NHRA to calculate the "down time" due to oil downs, on a "percapita" calculation, address the oil down problem accordingly.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Make them tech in with one motor and have to use it all weekend. Eddy Hill used to run the same one all weekend in his fuel drag boat. Calm them down so they can get down the track. So what if they are a little slower the noise will still be there. And they might actually have more side by side runs.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

this was a topic of discusion at my local machine shop yesterday ,,yes it sucks in the delay but each team is getting fined per oil down (one frebee per year) but to a sportsman racer who has a limted budget and has some bad luck with fluids on the track twice in a season this can put a deciding factor in place (do i as racer continue to race the season or say i am done)all off us make sure our cars are reliable to get down the track with out any fluids coming out ,this not only at a national but divisional as well ,,we all hate when there is a oil down and waiting but it happens ,,,fines maybe but have the person who oiled down perform comunity service on the track ,,it might make for faster clean up with out the hit to the wallet ,,,,,thoughts

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

The first round of top fuel and funny car took 90 minutes. So did the 2nd session with half the cars! The rest of the racers sit and wait. They couldnt start sportsmen early beacause the track was too cold. I understand this as having been there many years. NHRA is only concerned for the ESPN show-period. Look at the stands on ESPN3, alot of empty seats. People want to see racing not idiots shooting shirts into the crowd nor do they want to see the sweepers going up and down the track. The trickle down effect will of course be to the sportsman. I wonder how many teams have burned their "freebie" in the first race of the year? Not a great way to start the year off in my opinion. Here it is already 3:15 pST and still have not seen any true sportsman on the track. Probably won't happen today because once the sun starts setting the track goes away. Toby called it on Friday-sportsman will run on monday! Awfully sad. NHRA HAS to do something about these oil downs. Penalties and points obviously don't work so what is the answer? 1 engine per event? Automatic DQ? I don't know what will work but it has to be cleaned up som how

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

I am not a mechanical guy so if some of this is wrong but my theory if this. Go back to quarter mile, the 1000ft idea isn't making a difference now. Everybody is just turning it up harder in 1000ft. Lower the cubic inches, take of a fuel pump and a magneto. If you don't have the fuel then you can spin the supercharger as fast. Besides if you not using as much fuel and parts the smaller teams can run more events it will balance it out better. Less money equals more sponsors less time on events makes racing better.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Antron oiled the track.........over 15 minutes so far for clean up.

Two runs later, a funny car oil down......on hold again.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

I agree with "skills"! Go back to a 1/4 mile racing, but change the engine set ups and fuel. They are pushing them harder now than before. Again, its all part of the "show".Now instead of trying to set 1/4 records, they are pushing them to get 1000 ft records.
Are the oil downs created by stressed equipment or has there been alot of tires going up in smoke and un-loading the motor?

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Big Daddy suggested this also. I think it would do wonders for speeding things up. It would also help the small teams keep up.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

The way to solve this problem is simple:

Require every Stock / Super Stock / SG / SST / 9-10 second bracket car purchase a diaper, and then figure out how to get it on.

That'll fix the oildown problem.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

I hope your trying to be funny. That's not who is oiling the tracks. I hope your kidding.

Will Prater has it right.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Looks to me like they're going to have to incorporate an oil down into the first or worst rule. Oiling down the track would be the equivalent of crossing the centerline or hitting the wall. I say no freebies either.

It can't be any fun for the fans to sit through these oil downs. The fans are the ones who pay the bills for the NHRA.


-Toby

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

lol...............................

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

one small fuel pump, 75% nitro and finally bodies that at least resemble the manufacturers product, not a submarine or giant hotdog. Doesn't matter Force will have all his 16 car qualified to make sure one of his daughters wins a championship , same thing in top fool. Better to support your local tracks and help them with putting on a stock and super stock show.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Of course I was kidding. Wasn't that obvious?

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Bruton Smith probably had it right with Carolina Raceway,but for the wrong reason.Instead of 4 wide they should run the leakers,fuel and alcohol,one one pair and the real race cars on the other pair.For insurance purposes they would need a safer
restraining system to keep a car from jumping the center divider if they were cleaning up a leaker mess and the real cars were running at the same times.
Unfortunately it would be cost and real estate prohibitive.Too bad.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

X 2 But NHRA has their head up their azz ! Cut out one fuel pump, limit the blower size and overdrive. Limit the percentage of nitro in the alcohol. I remember when they used to run a 64 (Yep...Sixty Four) car top fuel field and the used one engine and usually the winner AND runner up never had the heads off during eliminations. So who cares if they slow down to high 5 second runs ? As Will says the noise and nitro smells will still be there. At least they would run a real race side by side and the little guy could afford to compete. Just look at the Nostalgia front engine fuel races going on today. Its a much better show than the crap thats out there today and there would be less oil downs. .

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Or they could simply install one of those automatic scraper deals in the first two lanes like the commercial pig barns have and let the foolers run in the dung. That'll slow them down.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

One more comment and I'll be done with this subect.......When the NASCAR cars were going too fast at Daytona and Taledega, they didn't shorten the race. They took away horsepower. Same for Indy Cars when it was deemed the cars were too fast to be safe. I understand that their is a huge difference between the NASCAR, Indy Cars, and NHRA. They are not purely and acceleration competition. They have to finish the race before they can win. I sincerely believe that we can improve the spectator experience, thus improving attendance by reducing the horsepower of the fuel cars and letting them race the complete 1/4 mile. They claim over 8,000 horsepower. Doesn't 4,000 horsepower still sound impressive? Or 3,000? Would reducing the speed of the fuel cars help with the insurance issues? Yes! We would still have the worlds fastest auto sport and could be marketed as such. I for one, want NHRA to be successful. I want to race. But please don't blame us for the oil down problem. And please don't stomp your feet and insist that we don't oil the track or we will penalize you! Instead, address the problem it is not going to go away by itself. I'm done. Time for a chill pill.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

X2 And if you remember in those days they were running a junk yard block and heads and a real GMC blower, and as memory serves ran better races. Would also mandate one mag and plug per cyl, and why not a 400cid limit .

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Yes I remember and have some 8mm film of Colman Bros. Speed Shop, Tex Randle, "Joltin" Joe Jancano (sp?) with his small block Chev fueler at Aquasco in Md. around 1962-63. I dont recall any of them blowing stuff up during a race. I was there when Tex was killed and it wasnt because his engine blew up. Even when they smoked the tires the full 1/4 mile the race was close and exciting. More exciting to me because of the tire smoke. All of the suggestions sound good but I doubt the big wigs would ever go for it in NHRA. It would make to much sense. Do we really need 300+ MPH fuel dragsters and Ha Ha cars?

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

It appears they are no longer talking about the new smaller engine the NHRA was supposedly working on. Did they scrap the idea in favor flames, oil downs and explosions to keep all the nitro head bangers happy?

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Unless NHRA restricts the blower case size, blower boost, fuel pump, nitro percentage, grear ratios, etc. or a combination of these the smaller engines that were once talked about would still blow up and spill their guts all over the race tracks. Maybe even more so because the teams would lean on them even harder to gain an edge. I dont understand NHRA's reasoning (i guess none of us do !). If it were less expensive to campain a nitro car they would have more cars showing up to race instead of one or two well funded teams that seem to own/buy the championship each year. The rest seem to just take up space on the ladder. The races would be a side by side race instead of seeing who can blow the tires off the most. Talk to Bruce Litton (Top Fuel owner and driver) some time when you have the chance. He is a great guy and holds nothing back.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Maybe all they really need for the Pro's, is a one engine rule, same as the one chassis rule that JF b!tches about! Might help?

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Oke thought I've had for years is sanctioning bodies are afraid if they slow cars down ticket sales and TV eyeballs would be lost. Do they think its speed numbers that fill the stands,or good racing? Just look at the Daytona travesty. If they were to go to a 4 X 3 engine and slow down to say 160 aerodynamics would play a lesser role and racing be better. With Drag Racing I don't believe the spectator can tell the difference between say 250 and 300 from the stands if not told. If you were able to give them side by side full quarter mile runs without lengthy clean-ups my belief is they'd come away satisfied they had seen a good day of racing. Nobody buys a ticket to watch the clean-up crew in action.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Another case of trying to fix the problem where it isn't by taking on the easiest target... the Pros bring in the TV time and the cash, so they will be catered to by NHRA and the broadcasters. The rulemakers are trying to kill a rabbit with an elephant gun with the diaper rules for nearly everyone, when 95% of the problem is coming from the fuel cars, who only represent about 50 teams total, against 200 or so ProStock and ProStock motorcycles, and 3,000 or so Class racers, and 20,000 or more index racers. The best way to NOT solve a problem is to not look at it correctly... addressing the FUEL cars needs to be done, and I see/hear a lot of good suggestions, but the brass at NHRA doesn't seem to want to deal with the problem that way.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Sadly I am afraid you are wrong about most spectators wanting to see close racing. If that was what they wanted pro stock would be the most popular class. Most seem to want things out of control if they crash I think that is a plus to them.
Those of us on here do not look at things like joe blow off the street.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Sadly, I share your views,Novassdude,about a segment of spectators. I remember the days when stands could be filled for a Pro Stock show. When Jenkins,Sox and Martin ,etc.pioneered P/S it eclipsed the f/cs in popularity through good promotion of the category. What is lacking today is any real coverage of Pro Stock.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

And remember back then the fuel racers were pissed at the pro stock guys stealing their glory ! Pro Stock was far more popular than Too Fool or fuel Ha Ha cars.

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

YES-X Tech ! After the fuel coupes got away from altered w/base steel bodies(when they were"funny"looking). Seriously can't see why P/S isn't promoted agressively , the original appeal was how public could associate P/S with their car out in parking lot. What I always wondered , if it wasn't because t/f and f/c sponsors have deeper pockets for ad money (TV spots and event sponsorship).

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Good points.
Watching it on TV yesterday The Snake was talking about one of the T/F explosions saying it looked like a $20,000 to $60,000 explosion. At that rate not to many people can afford to push them that hard.
It would not be that hard to limit boost or fuel flow. I know in some types of open wheel racing, not sure which class, might be Indy lights the sanctioning body issues their own boost regulators and takes them back at the end of the race. I know this is done to “dry” air in a turbocharged application but something could be done in a blower application without breaking the bank. As simple as an NHRA issued fuel flow/pressure regulator.
Why not? They make the Pro Stock guys all use the same ignition

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

Is the day going to come when the Pros and the Sportsmen don't race at the same events? Could that be a good thing?

Chris Barnes
Stock 6621

Re: Oil Downs (Beat to Death)
 

So let me ask this stupid question. After the first event and you oil down the track, does that warning effect the Pro's for the rest of the season? Or just week by week?