S/SS alternatives
 

There's a lot of talk on here about NHRA dumping us from nationals,or all together.Some
want S/SS associations to expand.That's all well and fine.Now that Pat Joffrion has left
No Problem for a consultants role (Good luck in his endeavor) the question is,where will all the association races be held?I don't believe for a minute that if these races get too
big and successful (ala Alex's Class Nationals) that NHRA would want a piece of the pie at their sanctioned tracks.
The ideal scenario would be a completely new organization,sportsman orientated to spring up.The fly in the ointment is that NHRA would probably threaten their sanctioned tracks with lawsuits.
Sadly IHRA doesn't have enough tracks to support an undertaking this grand.And I'm sure that the Circus King would want to stick his fingers in the pie.IHRA really hasn't had much leadership under the Feld banner.
Any thoughts,without turning this into a free for all?

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Revive the SCRA (sportsman class racers association.? I am sure a lot of the IHRA racers remember this. I did not have a stocker back then ,but raced a bracket race in conjunction with the assoc. I used to haul Kenny Koonce Sr to a lot of these races when he was running his A/SA 69 Camaro.They usually had a good turn out.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Hey Ed who would pay for the pros if there was no sportsman entered? People are going to travel to just watch them besides how would they fill in the time in between rounds? How is the entry for S/SS in numidia so far? What about comp what would we do with them?

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

WHO ???
Do you perhaps mean Pat Joffrion ?
:-)

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

I would think NHRA would consider turning the sportsman over to a separate organization for a fee. Compton claimed we are loseing NHRA money so it seems like good business sense.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

The national events could be filled up with the unleashed classes. 9.0-10.0-11.0-12.0.
T/S-T/D and any other circus act they want who'll pay to enter.Someone with the means
($$$$) could step up and organize a nationwide sportsman association.The problem would be wrestling tracks away from exclusive sanctioning by mostly NHRA.IHRA wouldn't
be that difficult.Feld would dump the sportsman show in a heart beat.
And yeah I did goof up Pat's last name.It's fixed now.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Danny,you'd need nationwide track participation to bring in a new association.NHRA's
stranglehold on the major tracks would have to be broken.You would need to guarantee
track owners a sellable product.Don't know if that's possible.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

As an observation, what I saw this last weekend at the March Meet shows the writing on the wall. One eliminator (Hot Rod...which I ran) is the only dial-in group. The others are indexed 10.60 thru (I believe) 6.60 and easy for the spectator to follow. No electronics, throttle stopping crap...just old fashion drag racing. Watching them was like watching Comp cars staying within CIC limits by clicking off early, nothing complicated.

Because Stock & Super Stock have become so complicated in the eyes of the average spectator could explain the reason we may have been swept under the carpet over time. Add the costs of technical control and it starts to look like a liability. Enter fee increases....this way NHRA figures it can recoup some of those expenses to justify the categories existence, even though they may view it as the least profitable. Because NHRA has been run like a business the last few decades is probably whey they're holding out until they can find a viable replacement that garners better return.

Yes, this is a good time to take control of our categories and break off as a stand alone series. Now in terms of runnning like a business I wonder how much muscle NHRA would have now that they're being investigated by the IRS? Essentially we would be doing the same thing NHRA was established for in the first place. And because they're being run like a business instead of a non profit promoter for a safe environment for us to do what we do, could they be backed into a corner so much as not having the ability to file suit? Just a common sense thought.....

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Ed, As I said in a previous post, there are some people that are just addicted to Wallys.

Nothing else works for them....That is, maybe until they become completely unavailable. Maybe then...

A couple months ago , I put out a feeler for a western class nationals type event later this year. ( I still have the date available ,right before the Nats here)
>>> Result : NO calls. NO responses .None

I'm not giving up on S/SS combos , but if I had to depend on them to eat, I'd starve.

Like Billy says, It's like trying to herd cats.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Only one properly teched race a year, heads up races , records set, horse power adjusted. When they threw out half the class winners at Indy a couple of years ago it became obvious to me rules interpretation was a joke....... Thanx Trevor

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

The idea that Stock and Super Stock are too complicated for the spectators is completely bogus.

If you had announcers like Allen, Bob, Leo, and a couple of others, and allowed them to talk about the cars and the classes, instead of playing that gawd aweful racket they call music, and having what's his name hawking parts, the spectators would have an opportunity to learn about the classes and the cars. NHRA has chosen to promote the pro classes exclusively, and put on a dog and pony circus side show, instead of a real drag race.

Stock Eliminator and Super Stock provide good racing, and a good car show, all rolled into one. The fact that no one promotes that, and educates the spectators, is not the fault of the spectators, nor is it a reflection on the intelligence of the spectators. It's a reflection on how far NHRA has strayed from what made it such a success.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Ain't that the truth...

The uniqueness and appeal of S/SS is completely lost on what few spectators remain in the stands for it...


Instead of:

" Next out is Joe Mocci's 69 Camaro .This one is equipped with the basic 350/ 2bbl package, but JOE'S car runs way down in the low 12 second range"

You get Pro announcers spouting things like "neat car" , "cool car"... "I'd love to have one in my garage"

In other words, no specifics at all.

You'll never promote S/SS this way

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Exactly Mark. When Bob, Leo, and Allen are announcing, if they're given the reins, you hear them say things like "here comes Kevin Cradduck's big orange 69 Camaro with a 427, this thing is way cool, watch for the big wheelie". I've heard Bob, Allen, and Leo say that about our stuff several times, and it gets the spectators attention, but a lot of times, the announcers they have don't do that. That's just one example, but it is what we really need. But it isn't what we get all that often. And we need it at the LODRS races, too.

If they'd talk up some good matches, and tell the spectators what they're looking at, the spectators would care enough that they'd learn how our racing works. Then, if NHRA didn't feel the need to take a huge cut of everything, we could do things such as have some t-shirts made with the class cars on them, and sell them at a decent price. That sort of thing really makes a difference with spectators, it turns them into real fans. But then, I'm not sure they actually want us to have real fans.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Gary, I don't believe for a second that the public can't understand Class racing... the problem is that nothing about the eliminator is explained to the spectators while the racing is going on. If a good announcer lays out the details, and is not drowned out by the burnouts of the next pair, not only do they understand, but they get into the action and enjoy it too. I have experienced this many times when sitting in the stands with a group, and just doing these explanations with some friends. It never fails to draw a larger group around us asking questions, and telling us that the racing is MUCH more interesting now, and they had NO idea of the sophistication involved with the Sportsman level cars. I once had a chance to announce at a track in the Midwest as part of a special raceday program, and I got the same reaction from 30 or 40 spectators later in the pits.

If NHRA would address this issue, and be proactive in fixing the inequitable hp factors that are causing so much controversy, the spectator reactions might really surprise NHRA. They don't give the spectators enough credit.... Alan and Mark are right on the money, too.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

I think these are words of wisdom. NHRA has been trying to diminish the sportsman fan interest since they decided that guys who run nitro are "PRO's" while everyone is merely a "sportsman". I am old enough to remember the days before NHRA made that distinction. We were all just racers trying to conquer our respective eliminators. It seemed to me like the races were more fun then and everyone was treated better.

I believe Modofied eliminator was eliminated because it was too popular with fans, it drew some fans away from PRO worship.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Interesting observation... I remember the days of the fans cheering for the local racers, and identifying with a car like the one they owned. A lot more information was given to them about what was going on, because the PROS and Sportsman racers were being treated with the same enthusiasm by the tracks/sanctioning bodies.

Re: S/SS alternatives
 

Let me reiterate...I mention the average fan...I'm not saying there aren't any fans. I'm talking about the non-car guy who brings his family like it's a visit to Disneyland. The one who pays to see the circus. They see two cars go down the track and assume the first one to the stripe is the winner. As far as announcing goes, Alan Reinhart and Bob Frey do a great job....then there's Hasley Hood down south, perhaps the best sportsman announcer of our time.

There were a good number of fans watching Stock & Super Stock Thursday morning at Pomona, and Reinhart said it best "you fans are the the real deal. You are the true 'car guys', not the casual fan, and understand what these cars are about". He also says "I love these racers. Perhaps the hardest working and most knowledgeable of all racers". However there were far more empty seats during sportsman racing than during the pros.

My point is we need to BE THE SHOW, not part of a bigger one.