Class At Indy
 

My pick of Class Winners.....FORD

AA/SA 12 Mustang 330 @ 450

A/SA 12 Mustang 330 @ 450

B/SA 10 Mustang 428 @ 388 Runer up 10 Mopar 392 @ 399

C/SA 10 Mustang 428 @ 388

D/SA 12 Mustang 302 @ 325

E/SA 10 Mustang 352 @ 295

F/SA Jeff Teuton 360 @ 299

Re: Class At Indy
 

Dont forget I, J, K, and maybe L stock stick and automatic Mustangs.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Larry -You've got it all wrong - forget the Mustangs and Mopars - there's a whole new wave of Camaro's coming ..................

Re: Class At Indy
 

Way to go out on a limb with those predictions! Class at indy doesn't matter anymore in most stock classes.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Larry,
What about the stick cars for those classes?

Re: Class At Indy
 

30 months on the circuit and the value of these machines is dropping through the floor. Weren't they meant to be the salvation of Stock and Super Stock? How have they improved the overall condition of Stock and Super Stock? Looks like some FAT cats and some folks who are willing to finance everything, including their in-laws cat, are the only people running these cars. Creating this mess, just for a few cars and trucks and some spending cash for the executives - really lame.

Re: Class At Indy
 

And in those same thirty months I've not had one heads-up race with one of those cars - so how did they hurt me .............as for values - everything is worth less these days - I've got a garage full of '69 Camaros that are worth a whole lot less than a few years ago but I bought 'em 'cause I like them --- not for their resale value .........maybe some of those folks who bought the new cars enjoy them .......can't say I've heard any of them complaining .

I believe that if Jesse Kershaw called you and said he has a new CJ ready for you that would change you're mind in a heartbeat ( no pun intended ) .

It's all about money -- always has been ......always will be .The backyard deal has been gone for a very long time ............

Re: Class At Indy
 

We will see. Maybe a surprise or two out there. Bruce, there have been over 400 of these new cars sold, so obviously everybody ain't nuts. Wait till Chevy gets there. Of course then everything will be well, no need to complain. 400, hmmmmm, sounds like a majority to me. Wait till they all get there. Let's see, about 180 in Indy, maybe all the old cars should stay home. How about a better idea, take NItro's newly released stats, add weight to everyone under the leader in each class on a formula of 100 lbs per tenth and race all the way to the bottom. It don't matter if you have the same combo as the leader, you don't have to weigh the same. A new class; Obama Stock and Obama Super Stock. Another rule, no matter who wins each round, you get more weight by the margin of victory on the same formula. If you haven't raced yet, you get a one tenth head start just to even up any possilbe disadvantage. Now with all the genuis folks here, I am sure we can get the rules done and changed by Indy. Who can add something. I know Larry Hill got a rule or two, probably a Kentucky rule, if you are from Kentucky you get a two tenths head start. California gets a one tenth penalty. Have two homes and addresses, split the difference. New York and New Jersey and California and other green states people got to run pump gas. I'm on a roll here, help me. I got to go get pizza.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Great post Jack!

Re: Class At Indy
 

Now that's right!!!!!!! LMAO!!!!!!!!

Re: Class At Indy
 

Good post Jack

:-)

peace

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jeff is in fine form! LOL

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jack,
I'm glad you have enjoyed the first 30 months of these cars without a heads up. How many of them are in your class? You could have seen the tail end of these new cars from your AA/SA car. What ever happened to it? And you certainly have no idea who you're talking about when you say I would take one of these new cars in a heartbeat. Talk Kershaw into offering me one. Then you will find out just how deep this problem runs for many of us.

Jeff,
More of your authentic gibberish. You have been saying for nearly two years that Chevy is coming out to play and that everything will be better when they do. For many of us, you are wrong on both counts. Both CJ's and Mopar cars are showing up on ebay and other auctions for asking prices below their original sales price and they still aren't selling.

But neither one of you answered my question. How have these new cars improved Stock and Super Stock for the average racer. No gibberish, just point out to all of us here how the category has improved without all the rah rah stuff.

Thanks

Re: Class At Indy
 

I won class last year in Indy. I have been the slowest in the class for years with my old car, and never got in the show, so it is better for me. And I get to really agitate the GM guys like yourself. And the Bowtie info is from the Blue Oval guys and the Mopar guys, but obviously they lie. Maybe it's not as good for you cause you don't race any more. I thought you were building a car?

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jeff,
We all know the new cars are better for you. You remind us all the time. I've been to Indy and not qualified a few times myself. The GM guys at SEMA say they aren't coming out to play. I'll take their word on this subject. How have the new cars helped the majority of Stock and Super Stock racers?

Re: Class At Indy
 

Bruce for one I know many people who has gone to the track just to see the new cars, both CJ's and DP's while there they even may look at a car like yours if its in the way of one of the new cars. I haven't been to a national meet in about 10 years until this year I went just to look at the new cars. I think they have sparked some much needed interest into S/SS Do you think Big Daddy or Roy Hill or Roy Johnson would be in the mix without the new cars?
Dale Shannon

Re: Class At Indy
 

Dale,
Ok a few fans are coming to the races to see them run. How have the new cars helped the average Stock and Super Stock racers?

Re: Class At Indy
 

It may help the class to live just a bit longer
Dale

Re: Class At Indy
 

That's funny right there, I don't care who ya are.

They have made some guys suddenly very fast, that evidently weren't capable of being fast before. What does that tell you about the hp ratings? Nobody cares what brand or year model they are, just give them legitimate hp ratings. Guys that truely think it's a brand or make issue have simply spent way too much playing with themselves.

Re: Class At Indy
 

I agree 100% with you on the HP ratings, but I thought we were talking about the new cars not the HP ratings. You must have been playing with yourself when you read the post.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Bruce - You ask where my AA/SA car is - I'll tell you - its in B/SA - where its a better car .Its very simple - I was overpowered - but I didn't become bitter and I didn't sit home and stew about it - I just changed class and raced - and having the time of my life thank you .Things change and sometimes we must change with them or because of them .Didn't you build a AA/SA car ? What became of it ? This weekend here at Super Chevy we 're having a nice time with the Stock - S/S combo race where there are no CJ's or Mopars .You could be here but choose not to .........

As for what the new cars have done for the sport or me its very easy to say - during my almost forty years with this sport I've never seen so much attention paid to our class - and never ever has the media or even the NHRA paid as much attention to us as they do now -- and that can't be a bad thing no matter how you twist it . Period .No rah-rah stuff - just the truth .And the fact that I don't have an agenda for myself only .........

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jack,
Can you please tell me what all this "attention" is doing for the racers? Something tangible please.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Attention is something we all seek - you chased it while trying to qualify high at a National event - or trying to win class at again a National event - or setting a National Record - or even when you were trying to win Jr.Stock at National Opens ....................And probably the reason you built a AA/SA car . Attention is human nature - admit it - we all want it .And if you weren't doing it for attention the only other thing is you were doing it for the money ........and you didn't get very much .

Re: Class At Indy
 

The new cars are bringing attention to me, the average racer. And for this reason they enhance my racing experience? Naw, I don't think so. BTW, this discussion isn't about me. It's about the new cars.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Why don't you all stop this nonsense. There is no such thing as "class win" at Indy anymore. First of all they take the quickest amount of qualifiers, bogus or not.

They may run "class eliminations" but with the current factoring system and newer car production HP ratings, this seems to be somewhat of a farce.

If there was ever a time to bring in the "imports" into Stock, now is the time. Talk about bringing in new blood.

If they let it really hang out, you could easily see a 1.50 under average.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA no other comments necessary

Re: Class At Indy
 

Havent read the whole thread but.....New cars have opened the "option" to buy a current car ready to race. Given the fans a current car to watch. Given the factory a place to show off and appeal to fans with current cars. Given NHRA a factory connection again. Given the racers a series of lesser factored motors to make them really competitive "day One".
The main thing they give is the "OPTION" to change your program, upgrade the technology.
There are negatives too.

Re: Class At Indy
 

The new cars definitely helped Sorensen and Fletcher because the keyboard cowboys aren't whining about them cheating all the time anymore. :)

Re: Class At Indy
 

The new cars have become a God send to us class racers.Just think:
Look how NHRA has raised the round payouts
Look how NHRA has lowered the entry fees to a sane amount,given the tremendous payouts we receive.
Look how the fans fight to get primo seats in the stands to watch us race.
Look how the tracks provide us prime parking facilities.
Look how we are given a stable qualifying schedule at national events.
And so and so on and so on.
Yeah these new cars have really opened up a utopian world for us class racers.
The preceeding was written with apologies to Jack,who thinks I'm just too negative in my posts.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Thanks Ed- apology accepted ................But here's the thing - would any of your points be different without the new cars ? Nope - things you pointed out would still be there ..........

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jack good point new cars or not it would not change nhra.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Jack, that is exactly the point, thanks for making it. For everything we were told the new cars would bring, nothing has changed. Except for some legitimate combinations have been made mostly obsolete for the purpose of heads up racing.

For all the new cars were supposed to bring, we have seen:

No real increase in car counts.
No real increase in media coverage.
No real increase in new competitors.
No real increase in fan attendance.

So, we got the negative, a bunch of really expensive new store bought cars rendering a bunch of older legitimate cars uncompetitive in class and in many heads up races in final eliminations. And none of the positives.

I actually like the new cars, not all of them, but many of them. Several of the guys racing new cars are friends on mine, and I still like them, too.

I just don't think anything positive has or will come from placing high priced factory race cars with ludicrously low factors in Stock Eliminator, which was, until the rules were rewritten, a class intended for production cars.

One thing it has done. Proven once and for all that NHRA is either terribly corrupt, or completely incompetent. There is no other valid explanation for what has happened.


You folks have a nice thread, I'm going out to work on a race car.

Re: Class At Indy
 

[QUOTE=Alan Roehrich;

I just don't think anything positive has or will come from placing high priced factory race cars with ludicrously low factors in Stock Eliminator, which was, until the rules were rewritten, a class intended for production cars.

One thing it has done. Proven once and for all that NHRA is either terribly corrupt, or completely incompetent. There is no other valid explanation for what has happened.


[/QUOTE]

Truer words have never been spoken !

Re: Class At Indy
 

If there are less "heads up" runs, isn't that less of what NHRA says the spectators want to see? Don't get me wrong, I like the new cars, BUT they are in SO MANY classes, they rarely run one another.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Thats exactly what I am doing. Im lucky my car is also badged as a Plymouth and Eagle instead of just a Mitsubishi.

Re: Class At Indy
 

Bruce, ask J.C. Beattie or Mike Pustelny if GM is coming out to play.

Re: Class At Indy
 

I'm sure stranger things have happened. But doesn't change anything. All of them belong in a seperate group of classes.

Re: Class At Indy
 

That is what people prefer to see. It's not them running each other heads up, it's them killing legitimate cars in class and heads ups. Give them legit hp ratings and nobody cares.

All they have accomplished is make fast guys out of slow guys, and extremely fast guys out of guys that where sharp enough to be fast with normal cars, and now are really sand bagging.

Re: Class At Indy
 

How would everybody feel if NHRA came out with an announcement stating that effective in 2012, there will be an accepted Stock Eliminator engine list.
Ford bodied cars can run the 352 or 428 carb motors or one of the FI Blown motors offered in the 2008, 2010 and 2012 Cobra Jet cars, same thing for Chrysler and GM cars can select from 4 GM engine combos (big or small block carb or FI).
Old cars against new cars with the same engine technology.Easier on tech, most likley fewer classes etc...

Re: Class At Indy
 

Yeah, we could all throw our crap away, then buy & build new engines. That would get rid of a LOT of cars.

Re: Class At Indy
 

No thanks. Guaranteed to end our participation. If we wanted to race "crate motor" Stock, that option is available at IHRA races.

In other words, I'd feel angry, cheated, and disgusted.