Can they win?
 

Do you think that cars/trucks from say M/S and slower has much of a chance anymore to win an eliminator title a National or Divisional? I know there are a couple exceptions,but in general what do you think,and why?
Jeff Ross

Re: Can they win?
 

Ask Jody Lang. He has finished in the top ten national and division points standings for as long as I can remember. Good dialing and good driving at both ends of the track is what it takes to turn the win light on. A little bit of luck goes a long way also!

Re: Can they win?
 

yes they can i won the world championship with a m/sa olds cutlass

Re: Can they win?
 

Billy Nees won a few years ago at the Dutch in his trusty Nova.

Re: Can they win?
 

Sure. I had a R/U at a Pro-Am, and a Win, a R/U, and a semi at a S/SS Combos this year with my 4-cyl FWD FF/SA Turismo. Was still in at 5 cars in the Combo in the Hills gamblers race when it rained out. Won the Farmington Race of Champions in March, and won the Footbrake Champions Showdown there last November.

Ok, so none of them were "a win at a Nat'l or Div'l", but I think the record clearly shows that those results a clearly attainable.

The stats don't show up with the slow cars winning as much anymore because there simply aren't as many of them anymore.

Re: Can they win?
 

What he said!

Re: Can they win?
 

How about Phil Combs, 2011 IHRA stock champion

Re: Can they win?
 

Nope, sorry, that's an L car! They said M and lower. ;-) :D

Re: Can they win?
 

I predict there will be no NHRA National event wins with a 13.99 or slower car in 2012.

( A few weeks ago,I thought the Chicago Bears were going to make the playoffs)

Re: Can they win?
 

its slower than most m and n cars LOL

Re: Can they win?
 

I've never been able to figure out why people think the lowest class cars don't have that good of chance in eliminations,the car that puts together the best package is going to win does'nt matter how fast or slow they are.
Lower class & higher class cars both have their advantages & disadvantages.
I'll say Michael is right about stats because of #'s.

Mike Taylor3601

Re: Can they win?
 

I went to round 4 at the supernationals with my O/SAbut forgot to dail in the wind. Not the car but the driver.

Re: Can they win?
 

In 2010 ( Could not race much in 2011 ) my boy both Won and R/U a Div Race

and won Div 7 Jeg Allstars with his O/SA Aspen Wagon. If you cut 00 or 01 and

drive the finish close...... It doesn't seem to matter all that much how fast or rich

you are!! He also beat two of the Best Challenger Drag packs at Indy

in 2010 both driven by top Drivers (Both Div/Nat winners and not Newbies).


Most of the guy's I know just race what they can afford without starving their

family.....................And they Just make it "Work" for them.

Stop on by if you see us at a Div or Nat'l and maybe we can lucky enough on

the Ladder to run you with my Truck N/SA or Jr's Wagon O/SA first round!
.

Re: Can they win?
 

we all can win if we didnt think so we wouldnt show up but leaving last does have an advantage but that has never bothered me it is what it is and I know it going in but since it has changed to qualified fields the number of lower class cars seems to have fallen off

Re: Can they win?
 

1. I'd rather leave on a clean tree.
2. I don't want the distraction of the slow car passing through my field of vision behind the tree. I'll bet no one ever figured out why my Nova had that big bright obnoxious yellow stripe on it!
3. It does make it hard to dial in the wind with no power.
4. The slow cars are a lot fussier in changing air.
5. And last but not least, hope that they don't spray the whole track right in front of you.

Re: Can they win?
 

One issue with slower cars is everything affects you more than a fast car. It is all about percentages If an air change happens at the last minute both cars will lose say 2% in et. So a 10 second car will lose .2 where a 13 second car would lose .26 this is why you keep seeing faster and faster bracket cars.

Re: Can they win?
 

It's not too often we see a .2 difference in E.T. from run to run. My slower car is more consistent than my faster one.

Re: Can they win?
 

Michael Beard, you could run a bathtub backwards with wind power and cut a light and run your number.You don't count!!! (LOL)
Jeff

Re: Can they win?
 

Yeah! What he said! Jim


.

Re: Can they win?
 

Friendy, if your faster car varies too much due to air density variations, it's likely too rich. Try leaning it to see if that improves.

Everything Billy listed is correct. I seldom leave last, and I like it that way. It's not so slow it's boring to drive, aerodynamic enough that it isn't too sensitive to wind, and it doesn't care if they spray the whole track in front of me. Just needs a decent driver. :-(

Re: Can they win?
 

Tommy Mattingly moves from L to O/SA with different engine combo and is consistently a winner and goes many rounds. Maybe it is a wagon thing, Al Provoast went many rounds also

Re: Can they win?
 

I hope so. Otherwise I'm wasting a lot of time and money! (Although I may be doing that anyways!)

Re: Can they win?
 

Smedley won the Vegas National in a Q car and was deadly consistant, 3 straight 13.19 if my memory serves me right..

Re: Can they win?
 

At the Combo in the Hills, the Turismo ran 5 13.01's in a row to 1000', then a 13.00 before it rained. Lost its mojo somewhere this summer... back to Mr. Bill's this winter for some TLC.


Jeff --- it's perception vs reality. I really kinda suck. I just race a LOT. Even a blind squirrel.... ;)

Re: Can they win?
 

Yes you do Michael, and you get my vote too! You and Jody Lang have been the banner bearers for the M-class and slower class (and fwd) cars. 2012 shall be great for both of you guys!!!

Re: Can they win?
 

Sure slow cars can win. It takes a different perspective of the whole racing scheme. The drivers who figure out how to make slow cars more than competitive and win frequently are dangerous in quicker cars. Most progress to the faster stuff,some stick around and always leave first. The slower cars are a huge challenge,but it`s extremely gratifying when you do well.

Re: Can they win?
 

if they hang with each other and shave they can win!

Re: Can they win?
 

It is no different in Jims 8 second stocker than in my 6.20 bracket car. Some people just need to practice and take the slow ride as serious as a fast car. Whatever you et is it really doesnt matter because total package is what gets the w. Everyone in stock dials soft Havent youins noticed that. eliminate yourself from the double breakouts and it is a different race. I have had the opportunity to jump up to a stocker that goes 6.70s no thanx i will stick with my L stocker. reason why is I want them fast cars to sit on the line why i peel the tree apart and leave them nothing. If a hitter or faster car feels you left them nothing on 1 end they have a tendency to push it and screw up!!
I feel like my slow stocker will repeat as good as a alky car would. Maybe not in a hot lap situation but thats what testing is for!

Re: Can they win?
 

Its like my HERO said!! Its a number game you run that number with the best package and you will turn on the WIN LIGHT!!! #1136 THE BEST DRIVER EVER!!! P.Biondo!:D:):D

Re: Can they win?
 

Can a slow car win? Seems there are a lot of different opinions. I have a slow car.

Just to straighten everything out, I am going to win the Gatornationals this year, and then you all can debate this thing all over again.

Thank you for your patience and time.

Ron Ortiz
U/SA mid 14's at a whopping 90 mph

Re: Can they win?
 

Every single driver in Stock has the exact same chance of winning.


However, with one exception.....unless the driver pairs up with someone in the same class.

Statistically, a driver in a slower class will less likely have a heads up pairing.

Re: Can they win?
 

.2 seconds ?
Wow, if my slow bracket car varies by that much, it's not because of weather. .2 seconds is a bunch !

Mine might vary .02 seconds, maybe.

Re: Can they win?
 

Brian Seibenick ended up in third place in points in D3 in a car that runs in R/SA and T/SA. He is a bright guy (one exception-he is friends with me, but he makes up for that by being friends with Steve Ambrose and Bob Huettman) and is going to even better as a driver. I'd be surprised if he doesn't win a race soon.

Re: Can they win?
 

Quite the opposite. I would say that no two drivers have the exact same chance of winning.


Nope! :D

Quit reminding me. :p I wish you would hit the tree someday, then you'd earn all them redlights I hand you! LOL

Phillbilly's been on both ends of this one... World Champ rookie in a slow car, killer multi-time bracket champ in a fast car. But when he's in the fast car, he's not licking his chops when the Turismo or Anthony Walton's GMC is in the other lane!

Statistically, faster cars are easier to drive, more consistent, and easier to drive the stripe with. Slow cars have some (top secret) advantages of their own, however. :rolleyes: But realistically, the chance of a driver winning in one car is going to be different from the next, or a different driver in the same car, or the same car & driver combination in a different situation. Drag racing is nothing *but* variables. But that's what keeps it interesting. :cool:

Re: Can they win?
 

Please explain.
I am curious .....

Re: Can they win?
 

dwa!!!!!

Re: Can they win?
 

HEY! I resemble that remark!

Re: Can they win?
 

It's great to see this discussion! I guess I had better get busy and get my SS/MA car done afterall!

Tim

Re: Can they win?
 

Seems to me that everyone has gone quick and its like Beard has said multiple times there are just not as many cars in the slower classes. From my prospective if we had more cars in the slower classes the win probability would be a lot better but its hard to do when 2/3rds of your field is made up of M/S and above.

Re: Can they win?
 

Different drivers have different driving abilities, be it avg reaction time, staging consistency, shift point consistency (or adjustability), dialing strategy, prediction and execution, .... I won't provide an exhaustive list as I'm typing on my phone, but suffice it to say that the variables are endless.