I need to vent !!!
 

I know I said "no more National Events" & I'm entered for Indy. (An old habit)
I seldom post on this forum, but I'm breaking down tonight & adding a few comments:
I pay my NHRA fees to be a "Class Racer". NHRA now presents a racer who is the single competitor in a class represented at a national event with a combo race, which includes all these single cars. We pay to run a national event "class race", not a "combo" winner-take-all bracket race. The single trophy is an insult to the car owners/drivers who have researched, developed & campaigned their unique combinations.
Due to my feelings on this matter, I will have a petition with me at Indy to present to NHRA. If you agree, please find me there or I'll find you to sign my petition.
The Class Racer traditions in NHRA is long standing and of historical importance to the traditions of this racing body. I think we have let NHRA do this to us and I'm not happy about any of this.
Of course, mentioning what I'm not hapy about open a few cans of worms. Consider the mandatory subscription to "National Dragster" to be spoon fed a constant diet of the John Force & Don Schumacher's boys & girls. And consider that we pay an ever increasing fee for insurance coverage we have never seen in policy form and probably have never used or needed....
I know most of this has been said before, but I feel better now.
SEE YOU AT INDY, PROBABLY IN "TEAR DOWN"... LEW

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NICELY said, Louis!!!.................... & not to mention "WAY overdue!!!!!

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I fought this battle a while back. Get ready to be called a lot of things including a "crybaby"
My feelings go with you. But it's not a bracket race by any stretch.
If you get there first you win. No shoe polish, index to index.
So the soft combo or soft index. Has a marked advantage.
If you can play the qualifying game right and can run the fastest car in the first round (the only one that counts towards qualifying). You might not have to burn the AHFS to bad.

All the combo BS did was save nhra a bunch of money on trophies (so they think).
When you look at the car counts. And figure if at least 5 more cars would have entered (under the old rules) It cost the stupid b*******s money

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Art, all runs for class runs count on the average`s for AHFS. Tom

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I think you are 100% on this. It is not the competitors fault if they are the only one that shows up for a certain class. They should not be penalized.

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Lou , to go along with what you said is , at all national events that have class racing , give a trophy to those cars that win class, if they are 10 cars or a single car in the same class. Give the cars with more then 1 car in the class ,the contingincy dollars ,like it is now. The classes with only 1 car in it ,give them a NHRA trophy and then if they want to ,run the combo for the contingency $ . Lot of guys may give NHRA the $ to go to a national event and a least win a trophy . There are a lot of unquie combos out there and I have not seen them in the last few years at the national events. NHRA may get a few more cars at those events. A good trade off , $355, plus what you spent at the NHRA tents . etc. for only a trophy thats cost ?. Its a good business idea that NHRA may consider with the low car count. Yes , I know the economy is bad and all that. But, its a idea to consider, can't hurt.

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Makes sense to me. NHRA is gotta get it sooner than later, hopefully! I also believe class in Stock or Super Stock should be apart of every National Event on an alternating basis and each division should get a Sportsnational, especially Div. 1. I might be a little bias on that last one, lol!

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The first run goes towards the qualifying sheet. So if you run -.98, -.1.05, in qualifying then runs then run -1.03 in the first round of class Only the -1.05 counts towards the ahfs. Q run
Starting in the second round of class the all individually count. E runs.
This I know for a fact.

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dirt wasnt even tamped down on wally's grave when the class winner enters the eliminator was done away with ... WALLY designed it so EVERY CLASS was represented in the eliminator, not 128 CJ & Dragpaks (and a few TRUCKS)...

THEN they shoved the combo race up our, excuse me ken, down our throats... like i built a 60 chevy wagon to heads up 150 mph CJ's ... yeah keep your stinking wally ive got about 20 of them.

captain

ill find ya lou... wont do no good but ill sign!!!!

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Be careful Jack you will soon be called a crybaby. Because you don't have a bunch of cars in your class. It's all your fault. You could have built a Camaro.

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So you do the research and decide to build a stocker. You work hard getting your combo perfected and even set the class record. Your bigger goal is to win your class at Indy.

You show up at Indy ready for heads up competition but through no fault of your own you find you are the only one in your class. It seems that since you are so fast in your class no one wants to even try running you. While everyone else is racing heads up for their class win, you have to run in a "fartherest under the index eliminator" for your shot at a wally.

In class eliminations you come up against a pickup truck that is so underfactored it can run a few seconds under the index. You try your best in the combo class runoff but there is no way you can catch that pickup truck. Even though you are the fastest in the country in your class, the pickup truck in a much lower class gets the glory of winning the wally.

Try explaining that to the friends and family back home who have watched you toil night after night out in the garage on your racecar. Thanks a lot NHRA.

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And your friends and family respond to this by sayin, " You should be racing a pick up truck".

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I`m surprised how many people are so upset about this pickup deal. I`d like to think it`s a way for some to get into Stock Eliminator in a little less expensive manner. Would it be less offensive if it was a front wheel drive car with a turbo? Pretty funny I think.

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Lane, there will always be oddball combos. and guys who search for them.
Guys who do ,deserve credit for taking a chance by researching and perfecting those cars.
This 350/4bbl deal is a whole other story...There are 305 4 bbls that are rated over a 100 hp higher..
This is gross incompetence and ineptitude on NHRA's part. Believe me, they were not trying to increase participation with a budget combo...Since when did they ever care about that?
Meanwhile, they let a few token 50's cars back in, and then hammer them so hard with HP, they can barely run the index.
You guy should expect more for your money (notice I didn't say OUR money).

Sorry for going o/t , Louie...You are 100% correct, and still the man!

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I understand Mark. I realize the truck`s way underfactored,but let`s just look at it as a "budget" Cobra Jet,Drag Pak or COPO Camaro that car be put together for about $100,000 less and could possibly out qualify them.

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Hope NHRA would at least consider this ,if they want to make more $ and have more cars attend , at least at the National events that have class Stock or Super Stock. How many more cars , would show up if they knew they had a chance to win a Wally and get their picture in the National Dragster for a class win, even if they they are the only odd ball combo car in the class. Will not cost the manufactures anything , unless you opt. to run the combo for the contingincy money , and win it. Again , would only cost NHRA a Wally. You still would have to qualify for the eliminator , like it is now. May work ? How about it NHRA?

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Sorry, but the "tear down" comment......thats funny! More like I'm nervous for ya" but still funny!

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How many of the inspectors at Indy are volunteers ? ---Trevor

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Lew makes a valid point, but I will respectfully disagree. I have singled for Class a few times and the trophy means nothing to me. I would rather race someone and lose than single for a trophy.

I've gone home with those and my friends ask "how many cars did you beat" and when i say i singled they look at me like I'm crazy. That ain't racing! The few bucks you get now for a class win is virtually irrelevant as well. I agree it is not the racer's fault for showing up and having no one to race, but you should have to actually race someone to be considered a winner. There is something to be said for tradition as well, but I suppose in these economic times that NHRA doesn't want to hand out dozens of trophies over the course of the year to "singles."

Whether the combo race is the right thing to do or not is not my decision, but it is still racing.

Evan

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This is my sentiments. Getting a Wally without actually racing someone is a hollow victory and not to exciting to tell the kids and friends about.

Just win the whole thing and problem solved on getting a trophy ;)

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I agree.

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I want to race someone in the same class each time I attend Indy but I realize it isn’t always possible – not everyone can have a E/F/G/SA! A few years ago before the combo classes had been created I purposely moved my car a class down so I could race another similarly classed car (J/S back then). While visiting with another stock eliminator racer in the tech line I shared my plans for which class and why I chose it and he couldn't believe I wouldn't just stay in I/S and take a single for the class win. To me it was way more fun to race for class even though I lost that year. I agree with Lew that the current combo class takes some of the fun away but you could argue that we were our own worst enemy when some would go out of their way to find a single versus racing someone. Ultimately I feel fortunate to be able to race in such a challenging class and would like to see NHRA take steps to promote and strengthen it. Manufacturers are interested - just take a look at the A/S -A/SA challenge. It is the bureaucracy of sponsorship programs with NHRA that makes it hard for them to participate in my opinion.

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I really don't want to go down this road again. But
For all you guys that don't want a trophy for singling. It's simple just do away with racing for class. Just run the eliminator. If you run someone in your class there is no shoepolish anyway. So that should make you happy. Right? As long as you have the faster car.
I ran another car in my class at E'town in the 90's. He said exactly that. "that he would rather run another car instead of running a single" We staged I ignored the tree and watched his fender. Them he told me I shouldn't have made him look so bad. He could have gone in another class, but I was the bad guy.
If you have a fast car or an oddball combo (or both) it isn't your fault that nobody shows up in your class. And you shouldn't be forced to run other cars with no runout.
That being said I personally like the combo class deal. This year I was snakebit with unusual problems (my time in the barrel). But when I got to use just enough to surprise a $100,000 plus car with my $15,000 Neon. It was great fun even though I almost lifted too early.
I'm looking forward to next year.

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When I built my car in 95 , there were 7 cars in my class. I lost a few times for the class trophy and then worked harder on my combo so I could beat them. Now there are only a few in my class and they may or may not show at Indy or other National events where they have class. If they show up great , then we will run for the class win. If they don't , I would still feel good about running a single for the class win and the Wally .Then I would run the combo race and try for the contingency $. I then would try to get in the eliminator and try to win rounds and go as far as I can. At least for my $355 plus dollars , I would have a Wally and hopfully win the $ in the combo race. Just my feelings.

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I am with Evan and Jim on this one,

have not had the opportunity to run a combo yet, but it sounds like fun to me win or lose.
I have many wins and loses in class, and the most memorable ones are in both the win and loss column, not the single wins

getting beat by Phil Lacy in the old chevy II days
getting beat by Bernie Emling in G/S twice by 3 feet
having the fastest G/S car at the 50th Indy and winning class
A/S last year, 5 cars i was 4th and couldn't run within 2 tenths of Caleb or 4 tenths of Kev

All great memories, they are one of the main reasons why I still do this

As far as the teardown comments re/indy.....
go there assuming you will be torn down, it doesn't matter if you were apart last week, it's INDY, bring your best stuff AND your gaskets.

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Art, there ya go big boy!!

Quote from Art: "That being said I personally like the combo class deal."

WOW Art, I like that, I still reckon you have the car to win the championship, go race that turd, LOL

Dave C , Evan (your always right) Carey B, D Johns and Joe S have it right and so do a bunch of us non poster racers thinking the same way.

I reckon the combo deal is really fun to follow and watch on the 'puter. A great deal, that was put together in desperation for a dying campaign and has now held it together in these times, kudo's for the effort, thanks to Charlie N @ NHRA !

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Bernie. All the belly aching I did last year was for other people. And for the sport in general. Not for me personally.
This year I had troubles with a new shifter. Then troubles with a balancer gone bad. Then having all my tires worn to the cords.
Now the shifter is fine, I no longer run a balancer, and I located one new set of tires along with a couple of good used ones.
So next year will be a little different.
I still feel someone with a slack HP or index has a big advantage. And in an unpopular class you can control your own destiny. You are a disciple of qualifying. You should realize if you run the fastest (second) car in the first round of class it counts towards your qualifying number (only the fastest of one of all these runs count) Then you might not have to use everything in the next couple of rounds when every run counts.
It's a game I don't really like to play. But then I didn't write the rules.
As far as Charlie N goes I have yet to see the promised increase in class contingency.
All I see is NHRA saving about 8 to 12 class winner trophies per race.
As a bunch of people have said it would have been easy for NHRA to award trophies to singles and still run the combo for the contingencies. The damage has already been done to some extent. I know of at least 3 people that sold their cars and quit because of the combo deal. If you look at the entries at Indy it spells it out. Not only because of the combo. But like I said 8 for this, 6 for that, Etc. Etc.
The next thing will be to combine stock and superstock.

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Ok but the solution should have been to EITHER take away the single runs OR take away the money. NOT both. NHRA won on both ends of that deal while the racers got screwed on both ends. NHRA puts the blame on the manufacturers pulling out and economic times (all while raising their entry fees?). I guess they feel everyone is hurting but the racers? Heaven forbid they could have stepped up to the plate and tried to help by offering something out of their pocket to class winners. Doug Linke beat the piss out of his race car for four rounds in the combo at Etown for a trophy that said "Topeka" class winner on it and no contingency money. He's a better man than I.

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This is exactly what I was saying last year. But I was called a crybaby by some on here.
I've already proved I can compete with the CJ's. So I don't think crybaby should have been used to describe me. I wanted (want) to stick in NHRA's eye with my POS Neon beating the BIG Money cars (their backers would not be happy).
Much like we did to the W.R. Grace Cup. It was supposed to be a cash cow for the pro-comp cars. But it was won by a Modified, a Stocker, and a Super Stocker.
I'm not posting anymore on this thread. Last year I almost quit Class Racer because of it.
Whatever NHRA does the sheeple will follow. Except for a few that quit each time something is done. Those can not and will not be replaced.

If anyone wants to contact me about this post PM me. I'm not putting a target on back for the a*******s.