Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

If losing .3 of a second, and altitude correction factors originally dubbed for Super Class racers (et.al.), weren't enough, now I can't even race my local divisional points race! Why? Because I can't afford to race both of the upcoming LODRS races being held this week at Firebird International Raceway. $330 bucks is a lot of money for two divisional races, and at no other time in the year will a divisional event have back to back races. Yet in order to run the first of the two, you have to pay for both (or you don't get to play)!

Try as I may to support the NHRA (or was it the decision of our Div. Director Mike Rice, or possibly the track manager Charlie Allen?), I now have another reason why I wish (pray) that the IHRA will continue to grow, and strengthen their efforts to move out west here with their "Pro-Am" series! They have back to back divisional races every year and you are not required to enter both to participate in either (and their divisionals are $135 bucks regardless of division)! All I wanted to do was enter one divisional points race, that would allow me the chance to earn some points, hang out with my buds, and if I didn't win enough rounds to earn the funds for race #2, to pack up and go home, but NOOOO!!! Not thanks to this sanctioning body, or div. director, or track manager (or all of the above)!

For a sanctioning body who says the sportsman racers are the "backbone of our sport", this sure is a nice way of proving it....NOT!!!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

That BLOWS!!!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Maybe it's a sign that stock class drag racing has gotten to expensive for you. There are other options. Stick with brackets or find a way to increase your income. Lots of gold laying around in Arizona. Buy a detector and get ya some of that yella stuff.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Perhaps for you to...I mean t-o-o

.... after searching 6674 in DRC

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

WTH...

Ron

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

"Yet in order to run the first of the two, you have to pay for both (or you don't get to play)!"


Gary you have to be pulling our legs. This doesn't make sense.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

There's no mention of having to run both races in their ad.

I am blown away at the price of crew passes at $30 per day! Test and tune $95!!

There should be some kind of discount when someone enters both races. Especially for the crew passes.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

5-day crew pass $120--4-day spectator pass $90 i guess there's a $30 charge so your crew can help you park! gary clarke

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

* Plus $10 a day parking

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Gary,

I'm believe the title of your post is wrong and you worded it that way because it sounds better and gives you another opportunity to bash the NHRA. If you want to run just one race you have to run the second one. I'm pretty sure you knew that, but failed to mention it because it sounds better.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Toby - Sounds to me like he wanted to enter the first race and hang around with his "buds" during the second race without having to pay .This would be a nitemare for management to figure out who paid and who didn't ...........

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

So if you are going to get there Saturday morning to race the SAT - SUN race - you would need to pay for the THUR - Friday race you did not attend?

I bet Mike would figure out how to get that done without paying for a race you were not at.

Some non-automotive working people might not be able to attend the first race

I thought it was billed as two separate races....

Ron

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Well said Toby...whaaaaaa! cry me a river..2 races in 1 weekend Wish i was there.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

No.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Your exactly right. I found out a while ago I was getting priced out. I still bracket race some and may even try stock again but doubt it. My bracket car is fun (53 Stude w/turbocharged chevy six) and my investment is low compared to a stocker as fast as the Stude. The fact is I'm not going to complain because I choose not to spend the money to class race. When I started racing it was more about the work you were willing to invest rather then the money. Of course that was pre shoe polish days.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Official word id this... You CANNOT run just the thursday/friday (#1) race. BUT you can just run the saturday/sunday (#2) race however you cannot get in early or purchase your tech card before saturday am. So hangin on thurs/fri and not racin not happinin. Some people cannot make the #1 race because of jobs etc but still bought a tech card just to get a grade point. then racing the #2 race.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

IHRA has been running double race weekends for years, with no problems, Leave it to NHRA/racers to complicate the ***** out of it.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

I was thinking the same thing! Stupid. Jim


.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

I normally don't comment on these kinds of posts but this particular post has boothered me since I read it earlier today. This has to be the most insensitive and ignorant posts I have read on this forum in some time. He is not alone in this current economy that have either had to cut back or sadly park their race cars. You don't know everyones circumstance and to say it in that way is down right rude. Perhaps he or his wife has been one of the millions of laid off workers out there and let me tell you, it's absolutely an employers market out there and the wage offers reflect it. Many of us have seen household incomes shrink to less than half of what they were just four years ago while working more days and longer hours just to make less.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Harry, you're as funny as a crutch, and that isn't very funny! There's no reason to have to pay for both events, when you only want to race one (with the option to buy into the other if your finish was good enough to make it worthwhile). I wanted to race the first race and go in to the facility today, because unlike you and many others here, I don't have a garage that I can store my race car in, nor do I own/rent a house where I can have my trailer close by. I was told about your post by another racer and I'll be polite here, but just because I wish to race Stock doesn't mean I have to like all of the changes that have come about since the late 2000's...especially when we're the ones who pay the bills for the rewards the pros get. I wanted to race the first event, because I had the days off to do it, and since I don't have a place where I can comfortably work on my car (like a garage or the race track), I was hoping to get in today for the first race, and use the day to work on my car, and hang out with buds that live in other states. What's so bad about that? You may be ok with it, but for racers who have more modest incomes (and want to race something more glamorous than the brackets), this is horse manure!!!

Mark, thanks for correcting Mr. Harry...that was rolol funny!!! :)

Jody, I wish my phone had internet access (maybe Wes will get someone to post the picture I took today of the posted notice that said, and I qoute: MUST PURCHASE FULL EVENT, with the the poster next to it showing the first bit of pricing for them listed as; "Double Event Car & Driver, $330.00"! So sorry Jody, I wasn't joking about this. :(

Toby, knowing that Charlie Allen is leaving the track in April, I believe it's he who my thoughts are primarily directed at, since he's the one who put up for this race in the first place. However, I agree with others here who've said what they did about the IHRA, because you can run the first event of a double header w/o having to run the second one if you don't want to (or can't afford to). I wanted to run the first race, and if I went some rounds like I did in 2008 (rnd 4 redlight loss to "Bad Brad Burton"), then I'd enter the 2nd race, and if I didn't then I'd pack up and be gone by race end Friday. If NHRA deserves to be slighted then the shoe must fit, however this gripe is primarily more the result of your future fellow Washington resident Charlie Allen...good luck with your new neighbor, you may need it!!!

Rich and Jim, I couldn't agree with you two more...the reason I said what I did about the IHRA!!!

Aspen 7709, I spoke with the people at the entrance trailer, and they told me if you don't come out until Friday, you can get the one race entry fee (for Sat/Sun). However, I was able to get the time off for today through Friday, and I shouldn't have had to pay for both races just to run the 1st one. As I said above, being there today would've allowed me to hang out with buds like you, and many others as well as given me the chance to do things I can't do to my car since it's being store on the property of people who don't race our class(es).

James, I'm not going to waste my time replying much to you, and your comments. You probably live in a state where you have options so you're not worth anymore of my time!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Well, on the flyer it says you can tech for race 2 at 8AM on Friday. Kenny says one thing and you say another. I would think they would pit and tech people only running race 2 on Friday, but maybe not. If so, you can work on your car, visit your buds and maybe watch a little racing. Sure it would be nice to be able to run just the first race, but as Jack said, it would be tough to keep track of.


http://sportsman.nhra.com/2013/Flyer/71.jpg

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Agree with you 100% Doug...and also want to say that some of those prices...crew passes and spectator...are a tad bit too high...given the state of the economy..

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Gary for your info the nearest track to me is 123 mile away E-town.My problem with you is you are the biggest cryer on the forum.NHRA is the only option most of us have all you do it tear it down..You never say anything positive related to Class Racing..You have no class..internet whinners like you are not racers ..but you blow hards get stuff done....got to be in it to win it..Just stop bashing or move some where they will book in your fwd wanna be class car as a top fueler..you still wouldt be happy..whaaaaaaaa whaaaaaa..
By the way I think this is the last race at Phoneix ..good luck to all the Racers Racing This Weekend.. stop the CRYING

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

James,

From what I heard Charlie Allen is out as Manager of Firebird and the Tribe has taken over. Rumors from some friends that were at the National last week was that they kept saying on the PA "NHRA will be back at Firebird in 2014". The Tribe is supposed to be putting 15 million into the racing facility to bring it up to standards.Went there in 2008 and ummm makes you appreciate everything we have out here!

Rob

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Ok Doug don't get your panties in a wad. I apologize if you think I was rude. I was just stateing what I have had to do. If I can't afford to do something I either find a way to make some extra cash or I go a different direction. I'm not going to whine about my failures as a bread winner. My wife is good at that. All Gary does is bitch about NHRA. He has never said anything good about it. Granted it is getting out of hand but the only thing that will change it is cars staying home. Don't see that happening. NHRA is all I've ever had so I know nothing about IHRA. Sorry to get you on the chip.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Last year I bought tickets for Saturday at the Nationals at Firebird online then I went back on Thursday of the first divisional. I told friends I'd come back to see them before I knew how much it was. A few weeks later I got an online survey from Firebird asking what I thought about the races and stuff. I let them know that I thought the spectator fee along with the concessions were way over priced. Crew shouldn't get gouged either. Do you wonder why there isn't anyone in the stands to watch you? If I can't race I'd like to go watch but that's getting too expensive.

Jeff

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Hey James, you didn't explain to him how hard and expensive those 123 miles are. LOL ___John

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

I, for one, would absolutely LOVE to be able to run 2 divisionals and get 2 grade points in one weekend!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Down here in south Florida, we have a different problems with the N & IHRA. Granted, we have the double up races for IHRA, I went to the IHRA points race at PBIR and there wasn't a sufficent car count for them to run their program. On the other hand, NHRA, the closest track to a points race is 300 miles away. When you have to work on Friday (because of the economy, there is no one to back fill your job) and you want to go to the points race for NHRA, you might get a one time run in before eliminations. So you travel through the night and possibly travel home the following night because of they way they run their races. So here is the question you have to ask yourself, do you chance spending all that time and money going to the sanctioning bodies races or do you just go bracket racing locally?
NHRA and IHRA should see the writing on the wall that the economy is eating away at our wanting to participate. Modify the entry fees, a 15 to 25% cut across the board. Also, the scheduled run times should accomodate the racers who have to enter on Saturday.
Make sure that if a racer is showing up Saturday, that the catigories they race in get 2 time runs before eliminations. Become user friendly!
I not whinning, I want to race the N and IHRA points races. Time is the main concern for me, but for some people it is the entry fees.
I have 5 IHRA sanctioned race tracks within 100 miles, so I do have choices on where to go to race.

Casey Miles
248H "F" NHRA Stock!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

x2 on that.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

My husband & I went to Disneyland for 3 days last month. Our tickets were $250 each/$500 for our trip. And I won't even begin to tell you how much the concessions were. Running two divisionals in one weekend seems cheap compared to that expense!

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

James , I am going to Norwalk Points race two days early , why don`t you come with me ? We could set-up a garage and work on are cars for free . Oh , and we could use all of Bill`s free electric . lol

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

No Jack, if I didn't win enough rounds at this race (like I did in 2008) to win the money to pay for the second race, then I would've packed up said my goodbye's (and good lucks) to those who would run the second race, and I'd have been gone. Others may be like that but I wasn't raised to be that way, nor do I choose to be, so now what've you got to say???

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Thanks Doug, and I couldn't agree with you more about Harry. Sorry about one thing though, I'm neither married nor am I laid off. However, although I do have a steady job, my wages have not kept pace with the growing cost of living (or racing...sorry Toby but the truth is what it is, and if my wages were on par with NHRA's entry fee increases since I moved here in '08, I'd be a home owner instead of an apartment renter, and I'd be there with money to throw at a race set-up like this one...like I could back in '99)! Your post was spot on, and I applaud you for it...someday Harry may think beyond himself and realize that too? Just as there are a variety of different cars in Stock & Super Stock Eliminator, there too are a variety of budgets for the racers in those classes, and our sanctioning bodies need to be sensitive to the masses, and not just to the more fortunate...sadly the one that is more so that way, is over 1,000 miles (at their nearest track) away from me where I can race at our level....:(

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

What I have to say now is that if your statement is true and reliable the same Nuns who taught and raised me would be proud ....That and the fact that I feel like many other members here - if $165 is going to break the bank perhaps you should rethink about even going to the first one .Seems to me if you're already there its a bargain to stay for the second and race it .Good luck ...........

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Ummmm, since you were there anyway, ya know, you could have won the second race.
Gary, I'm going to have to tell you a Billy story.
When I first moved into this area I went to the local racetrack (Beaver Springs)and met this obnoxious young man (he knows who he is) running in Street Eliminator who was/is pretty good. After getting to know him and his Dad a little better I mentioned to them that they should travel around a bit and hit some money meets. His Dad told me that "we need that $100 that he wins up here"! I told his Dad (who has become one of my best friends) that if they needed that $100 that badly then they shouldn't be racing and I told the Son that he could stay there and be the "King of Beaver Springs" and never amount to anything or he could take his show on the road. The Son has done OK.
I guess where this is going is that we all make our place in life. If you can't afford to NHRA race then bracket race. If you can barely afford to NHRA race then make the best of it or don't race. Don't complain about it, you put yourself there.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

I am still scratching my head as to why you couldn't just run the second race (if you can only afford to run one). Everyone has their economic demons. Some more than others. But to come on to a public forum and complain that it is somehow the NHRA's fault that you can't get what you want is really pushing it. Life can be tough - deal with it.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Good story Billy yep the kid has done very good.

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

Not having read the whole thread.
I have a couple of questions. That may have been answered.
What if you break something in the first race? Are you on the ladder for the second race?
What if you can't get there for race one? Can you enter race two?

Re: Both or neither this week in Phoenix!!!
 

I've done exactly that before, and more than once I'm afraid. I probably shouldn't even tell these stories... :o Kids: DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME (or anywhere else).

One was a double-header Pro-Am at Carolina Dragway. After being on the road for several weeks, I came home to realize I had forgotten my truck payment. I paid two months on that to catch up, and after paying the first day's entry fee and Jill's crew ticket for the weekend, I had like $16 in my checking account (and more bills due in the next week). I was R/U Saturday night, and they paid in cash. "Hey, we're racing tomorrow!" I bought Sunday's tech card, and won the second race. "...and we're paying the bills!"

Another one was the first weekend out on a fresh motor. Wish list: Piedmont Pro-Am, race fuel, Pageland points race. I only had enough cash for two out of the three. Some idiot :p told me "Just write a check, win the race, and then deposit the winnings. It'll cover the check!" Wrote a check for the Pro-Am entry, paid cash for everything else. Made my two qualifying runs at Piedmont, loaded up and drove to South Carolina for the bracket race, R/U there, came back to Piedmont the next day and won the Pro-Am. :eek:

Both instances were pretty stupid things to do, but as some cranky old coot (he knows who he is) told me once, "I'd sell my spare tire for gas to get home."

Again, those are extreme and stupid examples, BUT the point is, there are people out there that aren't sittin' pretty in life, but have the will and desire to compete. If you think back, maybe a lot of you used to BE that guy. If a guy only has the money to only run one race, and that's what he wants to do, there's no reason to dissuade him.

You have tech, you have wristbands, you have credit cards, you have open checks, there's any number of possible ways to have a checksum to handle single-day entries. H*ll, you can hold his driver's license.