New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Not sure how many of you are wanting or needing a beefy 305 SBC block for stock/superstock. I am currently in the process of building one for stock elem. I went through all of the paperwork etc a few weeks ago and recieved a email this morning from Bruce Bachelder NHRA Tech saying that early next week Dart block# 31151411 Little M 305 will be added to the approved list. I hope this will help some of the fellow racers out. :)

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Wow, That's Great Greg, Thank You for your work in getting this approved.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Thanks Pete, hope it helps some of the racers out.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Double wow and they only cost about TWENTY TWO HUNDRED DOLLARS!!!! Terrific bargain at that price--bet they are just flying off the shelves into the hands of racers (LOL)-FED 387

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

The reason I requested NHRA to approve the ''305'' block was due to the fact that other engine builders are spending the same money on the 350 block and sleeving it down to the 3.796'' bore. so why would you want to pay the same money for the block then have to put extra labor into it by boring to install the sleeves and pass that cost to your customer. A little background on me, I used to work for a engine builder that built comp elem engine, Ricky Klarr in Hattiesburg, Ms. Several years since I have been in the circut but now opening my on machine shop and starting up a stock elem car. after researching all of this I quickly found what some of the best stocker engine builders were doing this extra labor. with that being said it just makes sense to reduce your workload and save the customer a little money. sorry if anyone finds this not a great idea, but i sure as heck dont want to see a customer buy the 350 verson to only now have to spend extra $$$ to get the 305 bore!!! Now, I hope it makes some sense to you!!

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg,
Nice work on getting the Dart block approved. The small bore bowtie block is hard to come by and this is probably the best alternative.

rod

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

I have one of the little M 305 blocks. It's a really nice piece, as all the Dart stuff is. It would be great to see them make an SHP version as well; but I'm sure the cost of tooling up to do that needs to be justified. They aren't as strong as the little M, but the weight savings would be advantageous. Very glad its been approved Greg! Another option (probably more so for stock) might be the GM Performance block. Pretty much the same as a stock block, but has priority main oiling and .260" thick cylinder walls.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

I think dart 305 bore blocks were build for 305 spec. sprint car class. They had to use stock 305 blocks, they change the rules to allow dart blocks.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

X 2 on what Rod said....

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Thanks everyone for your positive feed back, I am hoping to get one built and start my dyno sessions by mid winter. its been proven time after time that thicker cylinder walls are worth a good bit. Thanks again everyone.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

I have noticed some of you have sent me P.M's in regards to the 305 &350 block. for some reason this site is not allowing me to respond to your private message. if you can please send send it to my personnel email. gregporcello@yahoo.com

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

GregP, have you let the site admins know about the PM issue? Sounds like a website glitch to me.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Not yet, but thanks for reminding me. I'll try that.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

wonderful product for those that need to take advantage of it!!! however for those that can do the work themselves and do not need to take advantage of this block its still a pricey item--FED 387

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Yes it is pricey, but as I mentioned they sale the same one but for a 350 and I still have to install the sleeves. this will have performance pros and cheaper labor wise for self use or resale.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Mr. FED , I am not sure if you are aware of this but, there are not many ...if any, good 305 production blocks in existence.GM does not manufacture any more Bow Tie small bore blocks so....that is not an option. A racer could sleeve a 307 small block Chevy ,but sleeves are not always the best way to go and sometimes come with their own problems. As stated earlier,Greg P......GOOD JOB.....from ALL the 305 guys.......M.J.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Yep, you can easily run well over $1,000 putting 8 flanged sleeves in a block, before you do anything else. And I won't waste time with anything but flanged sleeves in a race engine, they solve the vast majority of sleeve problems, once installed correctly, they'll outlive the block and be trouble free.

So, go buy a block, $100, plus your time hunting it down, assuming you only have to buy one to get a good one. Hot tank and inspection, another $100. Align hone, $150. Index the lifter bores, plus bushings, $450. Square the deck, and set deck height to spec $300. Install 8 flanged sleeves (sleeves $100+ each) and bore true, $450. That aftermarket block is starting to look real nice for anything under $2200.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Alan, thanks for explaining it Like that as well,lol. People look at the initial cost and think that's high, but after all the machine work and hoping you got a good one to begin with,well let's just say it's a heck of a lot easier to order it ,bore to the needed cylinder size , then hone to finish and be done,lol

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

MJ is correct. The other option is to fill a 305 block, but that wouldn't be my first choice. I am not a big fan of a sleeved block, either. If I were building a new piece my first choice is a small bore bow-tie and my second choice would be the dart 305. My reasoning is the bow-tie has a thicker cyl. wall than the dart block.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

FYI

Just know that the Dart block is approx 50+ lbs heavier than a stock block.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

The bow-tie block is 25lbs heavier than a filled stock block.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

The extra weight would be a negative if not willing to take advantage of more stable cylinder walls for better ring seal and overall stronger block that probably doesn't move much at all at this power level.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

What's the Part number for the Small-bore Bow Tie Block?

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Correct me if i am wrong anybody, but best to my knowledge the bow tie small bore thats was actually accepted for Stock elem is no longer made.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg,
10051182 is the part #.

rod

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Hey Rod, is it still being manufactured? I thought it was discontinued...

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

I was looking around and found a Bow Tie block#10051182 on eBay for $2,800 while the Dart Little M is $2,400. granted the little m is a little heavier I will stick with it.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg,
The bow-tie block has been discontinued some years back. I bought one for a spare. from Allen Patterson and he brought it to Indy this year for me. If money is an issue I wouldn't hesitate to use a stock filled block. My back-up motor ( stock 627 block filled) is within 4 hp of my bow-tie block. Good luck with your build.

rod

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Hey Rod, I figured they were discontinued a while back as I mentioned above. it would be nice to save a little weight with one but as we said they are hard to find. thats why I went to NHRA in regards to approving the Dart and was lucky they did,lol

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Good job doing all the leg work for those that want or need a block like this, hope it all works out well for you.

For a from scratch 305 stocker combo, I would prefer to use a new 350 based sleeved block, which I know puts me in the minority.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg P sent u a PM several days ago FED387

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Sorry I never got it, if you like just send it to my e-mail. gregporcello@yahoo.com I have been having trouble with this site sending and receiving messages.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Thanks Rick... But I guess I failed to mention too one of the other reason I wanted the block approved was due to I plan on moving this same combo into Superstock in a year or two and felt like that engine would more likely need the beefy block. but also as I mentioned there are many stocker engine builders already using the little M 350 and sleeving it down to a 305. this way it cuts out a lot of extra work to the block.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg, I understand why you and others would want the Dart 305 block for either stock or super stock. I would still use either the larger bore Bowtie or Dart block and sleeve it down to 305 bore size in either instance, there's some power to be found in what is being referred to as extra work and it's associated cost. I'm not trying to convince anyone that the new approved Dart 305 block isn't a good way to go, for most it is and I'm sure they will work out just fine.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

The shop that does my machine work does pro stock stuff too, so I'll see if I can get some machine numbers for you the next time I'm there.

Like I already said, I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything, just offering my angle on how I would go about it and nothing more. Continued good luck with your stock/super stock engine bulids and selling more blocks.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Where I work we have a lighting program we own and have these lightened for the sprint car guy's. We sent it to a shop that does the machine work for us. It is a $1,550.00 plus the freight to me and back to you if anyone is interested.

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Greg just needs to be thanked for all the work he went through to get the block approved, whether anyone wants to use this option id an individuals choice. good job Greg

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

x2

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Thanks..

Re: New Approved 305 Stock/Superstock Block..
 

Just bringing this back to show some real data for anyone interested.

http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/a...127_193247.jpg
Stock 305 block. Filled with Hard Blok. 3.800" bore.

http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/a...127_193315.jpg

http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/a...127_193418.jpg
Dart Little M 305. Ready to assemble. 3.800" bore.

http://i890.photobucket.com/albums/a...127_193437.jpg

Of course the extra water has to be taken into account as well.

Jeremy