Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

There was a wreck in round one in super stock where it's pretty clear excessive braking caused the driver to wreck and contact the wall past the finish line which is a clear rule violation but the division director says since he sees no skid marks before the finish line he won't dq the racer even though he admitted it was excessive braking. We all get on the brakes too hard occasionally but the rule is you wreck you're out, I've been Dq'ed for it myself. If the cars were in opposite lanes it would've been even worse. I can't seem to upload the pictures here but I've made a post on my Facebook and it's set to public so everyone can see for themselves. If you aren't my friend on Facebook you can search Allen Sherman and find me...at this point the racer who lost, Stan Holt isn't worried about the round win aspect as much as the precedence being set by allowing this to happen when it could've been way worse for both drivers...

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

I had the thankless job being race director at speedworld and tire smoke, skid marks, or wrecking was a dq. Happened twice and the 2 drivers were po'd. But the racers as a whole excepted the decision as being the correct one. The rule at my track was always announced and not a hidden rule.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Totally agree Jeff, also this is rule is clear in black and white in the NHRA rule book section 2 page 8 under race procedures. Should be an immediate dq since the division director stated in front of several witnesses that he knows excessive braking caused the wreck but his personal ruling in the past has been of no skid marks were found before the finish line he didn't dq, that's unacceptable to interpret a rule that is clearly stated and there's video and picture evidence showing the car sideways before the finish line and the nose of the car dropping when he braked before the finish.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

1 tire company won't smoke on excessive braking making it harder to determine excessive, but car in wall makes it a no brainer. Vegas has live timing at tower, maybe can be replayed on Internet.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

I have pictures and video for proof, they've been sent to the powers that be with no response as of yet.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

welcome to D 7 where the DD enforces the rules on the fly....
..

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Tell me about, Mike. Using Freeze in a can is clearly illegal too..But apparently it's okay now , late at night, right behind the tower.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Finish line braking is rule, that is rarely inforced, lucky Mr Holt was spared being crashed.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Since this is a safety issue, should be a no-brainer. I thought NHRA always preaches safety. Do we need someone to die because of this for it to stop???

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Oh come on Mark, no self respected racer would do that as it's clearly in violation of the rules .......

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

I've often wondered why the computer dust off spray was deemed illegal to begin with. How isn't that better than ice on the track?

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

I think in the Top Stock days, we frightened the officials by empting 4 to 6 cans right before we pulled into the water box. Looked like a smokey burnout under the hood. And I think NHRA followed suit.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

So the Hughes kid got DQ'd on a bye run at 3 cars cause they suspected he knew he had brake problems when they had proved via racepak he had brake pressure when he staged, but this guy doesn't because there were no skid marks but you can clearly see in the video what happened? I am sorry, I don't get this at all, just my .02

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Probably because there's more profit for the track in a bag of ice since most tracks charge 10 bucks for a bag of frozen water!

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

LOL!! The frozen water business is definitely high profit at the track! But I totally agree with fletch, the spray was way less mess

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

I agree with fletcher. The can is less of a mess than ice but in Div 7 they don't mind. Last year in a heads up, my opponent dropped dry ice all over the track and he wasn't dq!!!

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

West coast Rules. Lol

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Been guilty of hitting the brakes too hard at the stripe and been in the other lane way to many times than I can count when someone did the same to me. There are ways to ride the brake through the lights where you don't lock them up, just as there is a way to whack the throttle. If you know your car well enough, drive the race smart, most of the time this won't or shouldn't happen.

That being said, it isn't only Division 7 that has had issues with non-DQ's for excessive braking. 3 out of 4 years at the Summit Finals I was in the other lane when someone locked them up in the lane next to me. Thankfully they didn't lose control of the car and nothing bad came out of it besides a huge smoke show. The fact remains is it is up to the discretion of the DD, and they sometimes/most times get it wrong. We have had issues here in Division 1, specifically at the Summit Finals, over the span of consecutive years where this has been an issue. Me, personally, was in the other lane when someone locked them up 3 out of the last 4 years I ran the event, and only in one instance, when a more than adamant plea was made to the DD, was someone tossed. I count myself lucky that those times all it ended up being was a big smoke show, but you all know the deal. It's the law of averages, and our luck sometimes isn't that good to get away with it time and time again. The problem is, this type of racing is always going to have this type of driving in it. One driver's style varies greatly from another's, but in the interest of safety, not competition, there needs to be a consistent precedent set, even if it means I am the one first race of the year yext year that does it and gets tossed. It's my fault, not the rules' fault.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Somebody send an email to NHRA before all the Pomona meetings. Include the DD's as I think they got the final say at Divisionals. What we decide here usually don't go much further than here.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Way better from a fluid on track perspective! Remember doing it at Joliet once on a Nova after pushing it from the near end of the pits. Don't recall doing it on Tom and Carol's Top Stock car. Remember IHRA giving Morgan a real hard time on it at a race, still don't know why cant believe an aluminum intake can wick that much heat. Real world, someone would have to test back to back to see if the aerosol cans actually work in 95 degree sunshine by the time you stage or if it all just a placebo.

As to the braking issue, didn't Bruno smack the wall in Chicago a few years back? I think who ever was driving his Camaro this year didn't hit anything but had it get loose at the stripe. I did it once at Union Grove on grudge night with a Turbo Regal. Dialed 14 something against a 9 or 10 second Modified Eliminator Bug. I'm way down track looking back and forth in the mirror waiting for his green light and coasting near 1000' and finally realize they dialed me in at 19 seconds. Looked like 14 at the line... I hit the brakes and he said it looked like tire smoke billowing but being on four stock Goodyears it was just like driving on a Chicago expressway, no issues. I did learn a lesson and just dialed it in at 19 seconds after that. Nice and cool going down track in July with the A/C working

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed-----Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
6 David Rampy 1781 Dan Fletcher
E5 0.026 10.203 129.47 ****WINNER**** 0.009 10.401 117.41
GT/HA Dial: 10.18 (+/-): 0.023 FSS/I Dial: 10.37 (+/-): 0.031
Prior rounds:
E4 (D Keen ) 0.011 10.152 0.002 (A Emmer ) 0.017 10.360 0.040
E3 (M Cotten ) 0.011 10.135 0.005 (A Stanfield ) 0.022 10.311 0.001
E2 (T Janes ) 0.014 10.203 0.043 (D Barcelon ) 0.033 10.351 0.011
E1 (D Bridgewate) 0.006 10.154 0.024 (K Angeles Pa) 0.016 10.356 0.026
Qualified: #9 10.157 -0.893 #56 10.242 -0.208

Dan Fletcher leaves first with a nine light and smokes the tire in the light to not break out.MOV: 0.0095 seconds (approximately 22 inches).

Nothing against Dan but?

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

They usually don't say anything to you at national events. You used to get one warning also.

Re: Las Vegas super stock wreck, no DQ, pictures included
 

With that being said, that good info for everybody cuz we all know how some thing get blown up on here. Congrats to Dan on another win, one the best sportsman drivers out there. Tom