Oil pressure question
 

433 12:1 BBC bracket engine that has 43 lbs of oil pressure crossing the 1/8 mile stripe at 6500 rpm. The engine has 150 runs on it and I always get an oil analysis from Blackstone that never shows any abnormal wear. I used to run HV pumps with lots of pressure cause I'm from the 10 psi/1000 rpm era so this worries me some. I run Brad Penn 10-30. The car is 3000 lbs with me and goes 6 teens in good air 1/8 and low 9.70's 1/4. Clearances are .0021-.0023 rods and I think .0025ish mains.

Am I living on the ragged edge? Should I run 40 weight? I have some straight 50 Valvoline racing on the shelf that I could add. I run 6 total. Thanks for any and all thoughts.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Personally I think you are fine with the oil pressure that you have. As long as the bearings have oil the engine will be happy. Your oil testing is showing that. depending on what your combo is 150 runs is usually on the outside of needing a freshen up.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Here are the typical questions , was that the pressure when the engine was new ? Are you sure the pressure gauge is reading correctly Other questions are what type of lifters do you run ? Are the lifter galleries restricted ? I am with you , would rather see 60 psi at speed.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I think that was the pressure when it was new, or at least it was very close to that. I have a Racepak but I don't log oil pressure yet.
I'm not sure the gauge is correct because I have a small copper line going to it. It's a SW mechanical gauge that is very old.
The lifter galleys aren't restricted but my pushrods are restricted to .028.
Lifters are Crower Hippo severe duty.
I learned that 10 lbs per 1k rpm was old school and over kill. I know that volume and pressure are different too. That's why I went with a standard volume pump but 40 at 6300 has me a little nervous. It might not be much higher at 7k when I run 1/4 mile. I need to start logging it or at the very least put a larger ID line to it.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

maybe take the oil pressure reading off the FRONT of the block instead of the back of the block as the front is the LAST place that sees oil in the system if it is not looking bad inside I would not be overly concerned-- maybe next pass look at the oil gauge and see what it reads say at half track and thru the lights too will give you an idea of what your pressure is at various spots on the track--- FED 387

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Ron… X2 on taking oil pressure from the front of the engine. Oil pressure reading will be after all internal leakage. MB

Re: Oil pressure question
 

The pressure is about 50 at 2500 against the converter, goes up to 55ish on launch, then drops to low 40's for the rest of the run. After the stripe it climbs up a little. I put a gopro in it for one pass a couple weeks ago.

I've taken it from the #1 main before, is that good enough or is it better to get from the end of that galley? Is -4 braided what most use?

The last race of the 2017 season I over reved it bad on one run and I'm waiting for the analysis from that oil now. I hit 8400 in 1st gear and somehow it stayed together. Maybe this analysis will paint a different picture.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Ron,
I have been running a Moroso Billet pump in my 350. I had one of the Melling pumps break off and kill the engine. No more Melling pumps for me. Could be an issue with the pump. The billet pump does not have a standard pick up. it pulls the oil right from the bottom of the pump.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Order up rebuild parts for your moroso billet pump and you will get melling parts.

BW

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Type of cam bearings? BBC - you have to pay very close attention to cam to cam bearing clearance, at least that's what I've found. When you drop pressure on a run its usually a windage issue, type of pan and amount of oil?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I was thinking amount of oil. Or, drain back issue. Returns blocked off? Personally, I would try adding a quart.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I like -3 for pressure gauges. It's more responsive than -4 due to the reduced volume in the line. If using a Racepak, why not go total electric and use a transducer?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I had an issue like this once and it was the distributor body not sealing.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Cam bearings are King's but I don't know part number. The pan is a 7 quart Moroso which is basically a stock pan with a deeper sump, nothing special. I run 6 quarts of Penn 10-30. It's possible that I have the pickup to close to the pan. I recently read a post that said it should be about 1/2" and I've always put mine at 1/4 to 3/8.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

[QUOTE=Ed Wright;569241]I was thinking amount of oil. Or, drain back issue. Returns blocked off? Personally, I would try adding a quart.[/QUOTE
My last oil analysis was the last 26 runs from 2017 and that oil sat in the car over the 2017 winter. I forgot to send it in until a few weeks ago and when I got it back it showed 5% fuel dilution. My only explanation for that is a couple start ups in pretty cold weather over the winter with no choke and a very lean idle circuit. I just sent in a sample for the first 31 runs this year and if the dilution numbers are still bad I'm thinking that could be the issue.

The oil is fresh now and if pressure doesn't improve, I'll add a quart and see what happens.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Did you bleed the oil guage? I've had air trapped in the line and gave weird readings, looked at everything untill it was found.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I run the pick up .310 off the bottom of the pan. I use coated Durabond cam bearings. The Durabond CH12 bearings go oval, never use these, especially if clearance isn't maintained. 6 quarts is fine if there's no excessive leaks. What is inside your pan?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I used to run a windage tray but after hearing many many opinions on the disadvantage/advantage of using this type, that type or none, I decided to not run one. The pan has the 2 layer sheet metal tray spot welded in just like the factory pans did. So that's all I have in it. Pressure stays up after the stripe but I don't run big numbers and ease off the throttle so there's not a lot of negative G's.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

OK, I'm going to step right into the line of fire here, and ask what's so bad about the oil pressure figures you're seeing? If you've got enough pressure, and more important, volume to keep everything lubricated (i.e. you're not burning cam bearings, pushrod tips or rocker arms), why are you worried? Ask the majority of Stock and Super Stock guys what kind of pressures they see from the starting line to the traps and I think you'll relax. I haven't seen 50 psi for decades, at any time.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I don't think he has low oil pressure, but changing like that going down the track? I doubt anybody would think that is normal.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I see your point Ed. Didn't catch that on the first read-through. The question is why does he have 50psi at 2500 RPM on the starting line, then 40-something for essentially the remainder of the run... right? I still tend to think he doesn't have a problem. There's nothing physical to indicate one. Oil sampling shows nothing, and he isn't hurting parts. Also, he doesn't really know if the current circumstances are new or have always been there. If there is any potential "fix" to try, it would be to add a quart and see what changes, if anything. One clue is that he says pressure comes back up at the finish line (I assume after he lifts).

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Already told him I would add a quart to see if it was a supply to the pump issue. The first response I made. I have seen the pickup too close to the bottom of the pan, along with thick oil cause it also.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Blackstone commented that my aluminum, chrome, and iron are higher than they like to see.
Aluminum was 55, average is 53 and it was 49 previous
Chromium was 9, avg is 8 and was 9 previous
iron was 73, avg is 74 and was 63 previous

So it looks like I'm hurting stuff unless this is part of the damage from a couple starts over the winter with cold oil. My sample from the first 31 runs in 2018 is at the lab and I'm desperately waiting for results. Compression on the 6 cylinders I could get a gauge in were all 188 to 194. I didn't do a leak down.

One bothersome thing is that the oil doesn't test well for viscosity at 210F. I'm beginning to not like Brad Penn 10-30.
SUS viscosity at 210 is 55.4, should be 58-65 and was 55.4 previously.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I have never had my oil checked. My filters are always very clean, bearings always look new. I use Valvoline 10W30 race oil. Royal Purple 0W10 if I need to be faster. New oil & filter each race. Always cut my filters open looking for metal, etc.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Ed, you really change your oil and filter after every race?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Yes sir.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Thanks Ed, is that Valvoline part number 822388? I know they have a Not Street Legal oil and a synthetic racing too, right?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Ron, what are you using for an oil filter? Is the bypass blocked off? -Al

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Only part number I see on the bottle is VV205. Says high Zink & Not Street Legal on the bottle.
I used to pay a lot more for Royal Purple, I have seen zero difference in bearing, pushrods ends or ring/cylinder wall wear, or conditions.

NAPA Gold 1061 oil filter. Has no bypass. Used AC & Fram filters before that, they did have a bypass. Found more crap in my bearings then. Stays in the filters now.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Never implied that you didn't already recommend that, Ed. Just agreeing with you that the simplest (and therefore, most sensible) thing to do is add a quart and see what he gets (if anything). You're the man, buddy! Not trying to steal your thunder.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Yes, VV205 is the same as 822388. I use the Wix 51061 which is the same as the NAPA Gold 1061. Is the spring thing in the bottom of that filter some type of a bypass? I know they say there's no bypass and I've never taken the time to actually try to figure it out.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Yes, WIX makes NAPA filters. I guess if the filter clogged up, the Spring would allow the element to move back to allow it to bypass. I also have an Allen plug in the filter mount bypass hole.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I found some vv205 for 5.80 per quart. That's cheap enough to scare me away. I gotta call Valvoline and learn how to tell if it's a Chinese knock off before I put it in the engine. Maybe I could send in a sample to see if the numbers match Valvoline's.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Let us know what you find out. Has been fine in mine.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Valvoline VR-1 racing oil comes in multiple viscosities from 30W to 60W straight and 10W-30 and 20-50W multi grade--- A good going price is between about $7-9 per quart--- you have to shop around Most of the big box auto parts stock it or can get it quickly---Google VR-1 on Valvoline website you can read all about it--FED 387

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Hold on to your socks and have a look at this price!!
https://www.carid.com/valvoline/vr1-...mpn-vv205.html

Re: Oil pressure question
 

I just walk into the NAPA a few blocks from here to buy it off the shelf. No mail order BS.
My cylinder walls, bearings, and Intake pushrods ends do as well as anything I have used. I will keep using it, thanks. With 1015 lbs open pressure and 1.8-1 rockers, not all oil I have used has done as well. Ron says it's cheap Chinese crap. :-)
I use 10W30 @ 40 psi.

Re: Oil pressure question
 

Surprised that this is a high zinc and phosphrous oil , yet the ad says its compatible with production cars . I thought this type of oil was not good for catalytic converters and some sensors . Good price , has there been problems with knock off oil for sale ?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

On the bottle is also clearly says it is not Street Legal. Not compatible with cat converters for one thing.

What do you use?

Re: Oil pressure question
 

For the street I use Mobil 1 5-30 which is a Dexos equivalent . Lately for racing I have been using Joe Gibbs racing oil , and Wix racing filters . I have not had any oil related problems with either oils . The Mobil 1 oil works fine as a racing oil in my 454 Super Stock engine , but changed to the Joe Gibbs stuff just so my break-in oil was the same brand as my race oil .