FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

There has been talk of the FS/XX and SS/AH class running in Comp. What do you guys think. Many of these racer don't want to race in the bracket format of Stock and Super Stock. They would like to run more heads up type racing. I know Comp is not a flat out heads up class with handy cap starts and lifting at the other end most times, but it might be a better option for these classes.

When there is no Hemi Challenge or Factory Stock Showdown race, it would be a option to race Comp. Maybe some would race it all the time as they feel that FSS is out of there reach. Other questions would be, how do you think the current Comp teams would feel about it, and do you think it would give Comp a shot in the arm to make the class more popular.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

As I just finished posting about these classes, NHRA has announced that they can run Comp this season, wow what timing.

http://www.nhraracer.com/content/gen...358&zoneid=175

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

It’s a great idea. Been a long time coming

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Think it's a big boost for the FS/XX owners, particularly those west of the Mississippi. Comp is the top of the pyramid in sportsman racing IMHO and while they are a "unique" bunch of characters their innovation, hard work and passion is amazing. Believe they will welcome the new classes, bigger fields is better for all of them. Will be tough against the 8.47 index but is worth a shot. The 8.75 index for Hemi cars will make that even tougher but again, worth a shot. Would assume the personal indexing for Comp would not apply when they compete in their 'other' eliminators.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I was all for it, but that index is not fair to start. So I don't think they are helping comp

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Why not go all in. Slant the carbs and 5 speeds. 8.90 index would help.


Do we still run class in comp? or at USNATS?

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

From a fan's perspective, I don't want to have to sit through Comp to watch the SS/AH cars. On top of that, they give an index that will make them unable to compete - it's not like they don't know what these cars will run...as usual, I don't get what they are doing.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

This is great news as I have heard of potentially a few cars on the West Coast running the FS/SM class.

Maybe Bucky Hess or others can weigh in on this, as I haven't had a chance to look at the actual weight breaks / rules, but is the AS/SM the exact same rules as SS/AH? Index does seem a little hard if so....

Either way, I applaud NHRA as this may help some of the car counts and again shows the diversity of Comp - mixing some of the highly touted Hemi cars and the new FS cars, with the wide variety of everything else in Comp. Should be fun!

Cody Lane
SS/BS 601
Hancock & Lane Racing

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Hopefully it will help the car count for Comp at some of the national events. I asked this question to several of my friends that race Comp in D3 last year at Norwalk (addition of FS/XX) and they were in favor of the idea to help out car counts.
Ron

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

It is a start, but the index at 8.75 needs to be bumped up, no one has a chance of getting out of the 1st round. Would the FS cars be able to run a bigger tire? At least you could enter the Gators, lots of room left in Comp😁

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I like the idea. The index should be a little higher for each of the classes. Maybe 8.90 for the Hemi cars and 8.60 for the Factory cars. Just an idea.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

The problem I see is NHRA says FSS all rules apply so in comp
9 inch tire
no transbrake
no airshifter
3525 lbs or 3550 depending on brand
and having a second tune for Sunoco when most run VP
every one of those things is making them not competitive with the competition

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I think it's a positive "start". It addresses a couple issues. Number one - too many classes in Super Stock. Number two - short car counts in Comp. My thought is to continue on, and move other "Modified" classes in Super Stock to Comp to further clean up the SS class, and returning to the more conventional SS Cars. This could also lead to a cleansing in Stock, by making room for the current Super Stock style cars running in Stock to be moved to SS where they belong.....

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I think getting low 9, 8, and now 7 second cars out of stock eliminator is a very big step in the right direction if that's how this plays out.

Running a 150 mph plus car against 90-120 mph cars just isn't safe in my opinion. I can't imagine that guys running those cars are to thrilled having to run a 12 second car sitting on the limiter for 3 or 4 seconds. Seems like a lifetime.

Hemi cars are going to need a weight break with that index. They would all need to be 8.20 cars just to be fifty under, and fifty under doesn't cut it in comp anymore. They're on the ragged edge as it is. I'm not sure they could get to -.70 under unless there was a big weight break and other changes allowed.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Wonder if this pairing had any effect on the decision?


Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed Car#-Driver(Opp'nt)-RT-----ET-- Speed
7947 Bill O'Connor 7167 Ryan Priddy
E1 ****WINNER**** 0.125 16.434 78.95 0.011 8.879 107.04
EF/S Dial: 16.46 (+/-): -0.026 FS/AA Dial: 9.39 (+/-): -0.511
Qualified: #8 16.511 -0.939 #37 8.592 -0.808

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

How about the FSS cars at 8.47 that would be 7.97 faster then any FSS car ever ran last year, does that seem fair? And add in they must run a 9 inch tire and no trans brake or airshifter and 3525 lbs

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I called div 1 director to thank him for getting an index in comp , but explained that it was to hard even in mineshaft we could barely go .5 under . And he said "We don't want to bring in new classes and scare off existing comp racers. Hemi cars still have SS where most Comp cars dont have a different category to go to".I was hoping if it was higher a bunch of ah guys could support and save comp. but I guess they really don't want us or need us. nhra is clueless

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Pawuk went 7.92 and Pritchett went 7.93 last year, so -.54 under in good air. Not to mention the 7.70s-7.80s runs made in testing with the new COPO and Cobra Jet combos these past couple weeks (granted, in really good air). These cars have continued to pick up a lot of ET every year, and it appears that 2019 will be more of the same. It may be a little tough right now, but it's at least in the ball park. The last thing comp needs is another AA/SM situation when a new class just demolishes everything else out there.

The AH index does seem super tough though. The quickest AH run in 2018 (at the Gators, no less) would only be -0.45 under the 8.75 index.

I love comp and hope this increases the field size.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I think it's a great option. Key word is option. Some cars and teams will be competitive right away, some may have a learning curve and others will stay where they are.
I also think the current Comp teams will welcome the new racers. The fuller fields, more car counts can help keep Comp alive. It is the classic, first to the finish line wins type racing that drew most of us to Drag Racing.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

This is a good move for all but two things, at first it will be hard to accept the new FS cars mixing it up with the regular group but given the diversity of the class it won't take long to for them to fit in. Second, the AH cars got a very less than favorable index and probably the only way that will get moved is after they show that they are not competitive, which means they show up to race and know their taking a beatin for how long ???? Don't see that happening.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I know one AH car that is going to show up and take a beating at every race all year. Sure, the AH/SM index is tough and a little unreasonable, but it is better then running A/SM. Hopefully a correction will happen, but even with personal indexes in comp, they shouldn't and won't gift new classes as 70+ under players at the start.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

^^ I agree

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

That's a step in the right direction.Maybe bring back some of the old Modified classes. Be nice seeing gassers, lower class M/P cars, etc. When I quit racing Stock in 2010 I had a few 4+ second handicaps F/S cars were in the mid 9's) it really got your attention when they came by you at the stripe at 60 mph.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I agree with Bucky. Bob Book also just put a nice observation out there also. Out of the 38 SS/AH cars that were out last year only 5 were able to get under 8.40 and 3 of those were at Gainesville where the conditions helped big time. NHRA needs some racers involved with some of their decision making. There are some great technical as well as business people racing that would be happy to lend there expertise. If they really want to keep the 68 Hemi cars racing, let the ones in comp have the option to go to rack & pinion steering and get the center/drag link out of the oil pan .

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Is the Warfish for sale? If so - problem solved!

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I cant imagine all Comp racers are thrilled with a bigger field as well as making room for the new darlings of Sportsman racing. I would think NHRA would go out of their way to make FS cars very competitive, very quickly, in their new Eliminator. AH index probably needs to be 8.90-.95. Should be interesting.
Mike A114

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I don't think NHRA will let the FS cars take a beating for long....
Mike

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

you are right on Andrew, AH needs to be about an 85 , FX 8.47 is a little easy with the new blowers.
PS how will they run with Sunoco?????

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

So do the FS cars try to Q for FS and default to Comp at the Same race or do they have to declare and qualify for Comp at the start?
Do SSAH cars get to run class then fold into Comp instead of SS?

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

I bet dyno's are running at the shops now with Sunoco in the tanks,LOL

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

The factory car killer, aka the Gremlin would hate to see those F/S leave stock....there is a full cage in the Gremlin now though.....Ed was living a bit dangerously.....

I think its actually the perfect idea. 10 years ago when the initial drag pak applications went out, running one in Comp was part of the idea.

If I had a new F/S car I'd want to do this, no more playing weather god to predict the dial, running people like myself in a god forsaken Gremlin that dials 13 something, just set the car up for kill, kill the tree and play the game downtrack.....whats not to like?

If you own a new FS car, you already have cubic $ into it, this gives you a additional playground to play in....With primo parking at National Events as a free bonus.

Re AH cars if adjusted it too would be a great place for them.

Eric

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Stockers and Pro Mods in the same class. Should be fun!

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

And, with the essentially non-existent tech/tear-down policy that's in current favor, keeping a lid on those cheating stockers won't be much a real problem. Why worry about the indexes when the only enforcement is a P&G? We'll have mid-seven second AH cars in no time. Could the FS cars run in the sixes?

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Think your in left field here. Just for starters: there are other Comp competitors other than AH and FS cars that are legal. When NHRA tech checks, they do more than P&G.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

My statement may have been unclear but, to restate it more specifically, the thorough teardown of a Stock Eliminator car takes at least ten times as long as is required to P&G a Super Mod or a Street Roadster. All FS cars running in Comp will need to be thoroughly inspected and qualifiers should be subjected to a full teardown. Current practice with regard to teardown is that it happens only a few times per year under the best of circumstances and that's not enough to keep everyone within the fences.

A thorough teardown requires the engine out of the car and the oil pan off. Crankshafts should be inspected, tops of pistons will need to be inspected, cylinder head chambers and runners need to be poured, casting numbers on cylinder heads and camshaft lift need to be verified, blower specifications confirmed, and throttle bores measured. All that is just the tip of the iceberg for making sure that any Stocker is legal. Even a run-of-the-mill Stock teardown involves all those things and more minus the removal of the oil pan. If there is not even at least a remote possibility that these variables will be subjected to inspection it won't be long before the FS cars will be capable of running more than a second under the proposed index and the only thing separating them from a thinly disguised Pro Mod will be the tires. If they get a big tire... I don't think that the Honor System will suffice!

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

You nailed it Chuck dead on the money !

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

The sad part of it is that it's not happening all that much in Stock either.

The sadder part is that they're probably more likely to get torndown in comp.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

It's taken me a while to reconcile my opinion on the incorporation of these cars in to Comp. Specifically the rules (or lack of) for FS/XX, and the tech/teardown procedures needed for both of these classes. Both classes have been showcased in shootout formats for some time. Both classes have (in there own ways) exceeded the NHRA standardized practices for their accompanying Eliminators.

So I suppose bringing two more classes into Comp, with their current "Run What You Brung" formats should not burden the tech department too much. I could envision P&G, cam lift, throttle body, supercharger, and tires as the primary focus of tech for FS/SM. As for the Hemi cars? They are already Comp-style Super Modified Body/Chassis as it is. Need more counterweight? Just pull the dash and tunnel to get to the bellhousing access window. Except for pouring runner and chamber volumes how could you do any less than they currently do to their engines?


I can see where moving those two classes to Comp could possibly improve their respective Eliminators by slowing the rules "creep" that these classes foment.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

Water seeks its own level.

Re: FS/XX - SS/AH In Comp ?
 

or not get torn down at all !