Buttons in Stock

[Gary Smith]

This weekend I ran my late father's '65 Mustang at a local Ford event. Although just a few passes, I can comfortably admit launching a 2 step controlled clutch car vs. a "two foot" launch in an automatic has some similarities. I also heard enough talk from other racers this weekend about certain div 1 stock racers who are cheating with electronics.

So, until I see one of these certain racers drive a clutch car that LEAVES WITH A PEDAL, and see .001 - .009 lights on a regular basis, I say ditch buttons on automatic cars only, letting the stick racers keep 2 and 3 step launch controls.

[Michael Beard]

>> and see .001 - .009 lights on a regular basis

While I prefer footbrake style racing, there is nobody cutting ".001 - .009 lights on a regular basis", anyway. Someone has already posted average reaction times for a number of 'name' drivers, and they are typically high teen to low twenties range. As well they SHOULD be.

Practice trees are available from a number of sources. I recommend the hand-held unit from Biondo. I keep one with me. If you need help with setup, refer to the Reaction Time Clinic and Practice Tree articles on www.staginglight.com/guide/

[tpoh815]

and who are you again?

[tony wood]

MICHEAL is a very respected stock racer on the IHRA circuit. look at the people chasing points. im sure you heard of berrtozi, folk & and if you read the top three you will find beard.

[Gary Smith]

Originally Posted by Michael Beard

>> and see .001 - .009 lights on a regular basis

While I prefer footbrake style racing, there is nobody cutting ".001 - .009 lights on a regular basis", anyway. Someone has already posted average reaction times for a number of 'name' drivers, and they are typically high teen to low twenties range. As well they SHOULD be.

Practice trees are available from a number of sources. I recommend the hand-held unit from Biondo. I keep one with me. If you need help with setup, refer to the Reaction Time Clinic and Practice Tree articles on www.staginglight.com/guide/

Sorry Mike, let me re-phrase what I meant: it's the really quick foot brake lights within a tight range that I can't fathom. Yes, I'm fully aware the value of seat time. But I've been around long enough to know there's nobody that good that often on so many tracks. What's more bizzare is how few of these individuals there are out there.

It would seem possible for me to find some of the variables (i.e. staging habits, weather, rollout, etc.) that could garner consistent .02 - .03 lights. I'm thinking this is after at least 30 -40 passes in the same lane at the same track. But leaving with a button removes many of these variables IMHO.

[Ed Fernandez]

Originally Posted by Gary Smith

This weekend I ran my late father's '65 Mustang at a local Ford event. Although just a few passes, I can comfortably admit launching a 2 step controlled clutch car vs. a "two foot" launch in an automatic has some similarities. I also heard enough talk from other racers this weekend about certain div 1 stock racers who are cheating with electronics.

So, until I see one of these certain racers drive a clutch car that LEAVES WITH A PEDAL, and see .001 - .009 lights on a regular basis, I say ditch buttons on automatic cars only, letting the stick racers keep 2 and 3 step launch controls.

And jut who are these Div. 1 racers who are cheating?It
always seems that Div. 1 hastheso called cheaters,no other div. Where were the infamous Dirty Dozen from?How about a certain Div. 7 racer who's gone under under the radar at Indy for pistons and short block?Yeah only those round going Div. and Nat'l. champions from Div. 1 are cheaters.Right Ed O????????????????

Ed F.
NHRA #15
IHRA #1945
T/SA

NED We're #1

[Alan Roehrich]

Eventually some of these people should look at what they're saying, and realize how hilariously deluded they are.

Guys like Bertozzi, Zane, Fletcher, Biondo, and Rampy get more seat time and more shots at the tree in a week than most people get in a month. They LIVE with it. They race nearly every weekend, and some times two entirely different races in a weekend. They have talent, and they spend half of their waking hours developing and refining their talent. As a benefit of that talent and that work, they get the best chance at having the best equipment, and the best backing. And there probably aren't too many tracks in the country that they HAVEN'T been on for 40 passes or so, at least.

It's like football. If you take one of the most talented quarterbacks, give him one of the best offensive lines, a real good running back, and a couple of good receivers, give them plenty of practice together, then you're going to score some touchdowns. Put that group against an average defense, that gets 1/3 the practice, and the offense is going to score big, and score often. Put a talented driver in the best equipment, with plenty of backing and a good crew chief, let him drive that equipment EVERY weekend, and he's going to beat the average racer like a drum.

I just love when people TALK about who is cheating. Every where you go you'll find people who just KNOW the fast guys are cheating, and they just KNOW the winners are cheating. But they have ZERO proof, and they won't put up a dime to see what is in the "cheated up" car. Talk is CHEAP, when you can PROVE some one is cheating, put your money where your mouth is, tear them down, prove it, and THEN you can say "I told you so".

[Jack McCarthy]

question ?

i saw my first one at indy yesterday, heard rampy sells / uses it ????
what is up with the brake pressure activated two step switch in the brake line ??
it is definitely adjustable... is it legit ???
not any "automotive type" switch ive ever seen ???

just another starting line AID i guess... legal electronic aids in a no electronic class

jack mccarthy

[Alan Roehrich]

As far as I know it is legal, I know a couple of people that use them, we don't.

If it is JUST a pressure switch, I suppose you could adjust it to make or break at a certain pressure, but I don't see where you can adjust it for a delay.

And actually, there are a lot of trailer brake systems that use a pressure switch in the brake line, and they are adjustable for pressure. So a brake line pressure switch can be classified as an automotive part.

I suppose, if you were so inclined, and had plenty of time, you could put a brake pressure gauge in the car, figure out the minimum pressure it takes to hold the car on the line, and set the switch to turn the two step on and off at that exact pressure. I suppose you could disguise a line lock solenoid as a brake pressure switch, if you looked hard enough to find the pieces.

I know a few people who use the factory brake light switch. I know others who use a button in the brake pedal itself.

I know a few who use a switch on the pedal or the brake light switch and a switch on the steering wheel. But the switch on the steering wheel doesn't work like most people think it does. If you think you can just release the switch on the steering wheel and it will launch the car, you are mistaken. If you have an A, B, or C car and you try that, what will actually happen is you'll blow the tires off the rims, it'll just spin. Further, it'll never react at the same time or the same way, because your leg won't move the same way. And you can't use the brakes to set the car in the lights, get on the two step, and let off the brakes, either, the car will move. The REAL reason a lot of people put a switch on the steering wheel is so they don't accidentally re engage the two step later by stepping on the brake.

By the way, I've had a look at the inside of a couple of transmissions from the winners car's, one way or the other. There's NOTHING in them, except drums, bands, and planetaries. No brakes, no delay devices, no tricks, no nothing but plain old transmission parts.

[Dave Goob Cook]

Hydraulic brake lamp switches have been used since hydraulic brakes were a new thing, just a single pole, single throw hydraulic pressure activated switch.
Look through a NAPA catalog.