Lets Root Cause the Detriment of Class Racing

[Mike Volkman]

Pozzi brought up a good point in the AHFS thread that I believe needs expanded on. What are the root causes of why class racing is the way it is now verses 12+ years ago. Just brainstorming so don't shoot the messenger. Just reporting the facts as I see them and are echoed by many of those who were there. Also, is there any of these we can counter or ask NHRA to remove?

Would also like to say that having spoken to Lonnie and Ned, they both want to bring it back to racing as we know it but their hands are tied because 1) they aren't stk/ss guys - never claimed to be - and try to react to what he racers want or were told they want. They also know they need a stk/ss experienced person/people who know what's really happening and can read between the lines. It be no different if they threw me in super comp. Would take time to figure it out and then multiply that by all the classes and their agendas who believe they are most important. Tough job for anyone.

No particular order and a * indicates that there was probably a class racer pushing his agenda in the background. Feel free to add.

1. Bruce retired
2. No one with stk/ss experience who is willing to make the sacrifice so we can play. Try finding someone.
3. *Aftermarket heads, cranks, valves, etc. Some was needed, many not. Needed someone in NHRA to call BS.
4. NHRA people not being consistent in application of the rules. Some divisions allow, some don't.
5.No weight stickers so we can police our own.
6. *The alphabet cars - reminds me of IHRA at the close. What class is he or she in? Use to be class was identified by specific size decal on windows, before it went thru tech.
7. Changing class after tech card was turned in. I saw a racer jump on his scooter in the lanes and had his class changed because of the fast guy in it.
8. Bracket racers coming into class racing and wanting to change the rules to fit their needs. Just saying. We love you, want you and want you to try not to change what has worked for years.
9. *SRAC - members with their own agendas rather than trying to be impartial and what is good for the sport.
10.*Removing shipping weights and only allowing GT car to move 250 pounds from it. More hiding places, less heads up.
11. *Allowing Traditional SS vehicles to run GT when equipped with engine that came in the car.
12. *Bob Dennis - Get well Bob - No slam on Bob. Good guy that we named process after. Claiming a different combo because of a .001 difference in head gasket. Use to be you would claim the best package from what yr/model you had. Use to be basically 4 - 318 combos in SS - now over10.
13. Limited tech and tear down - lots of reasons for this
14. *AHFS - not going down this road
15. NHRA's inability to recognize a "soft" combo and gently, gently, gently bring it back into line.
16. *Stock with SS heads and cranks
17. SS - Separating FWD to RWD GT hp factors/ratings.

I'm sure there are more. Tired of typing. Feel free to add. And lastly, the disclaimer - Thread is not personal to any racer, friend, official, etc. I'm more interested in seeing what we can suggest to be changed.

[GUMP]

Mike,

Lots of good points.

I think that one of the biggest issues we face is that there isn't a lot of incentive to go fast (I am still after one of your hats). The points chase would be better if class wins, qualifying, and records had bonus points.

I agree that there are now way to many ways to dodge a heads-up run

[Frank Castros]

Has Lonnie Grimm made a positive difference?

[Frank Castros]

It's so complicated;
New age Electronics
Aftermarket Parts
AHFS mess
Bastardized Rule Book
Not enough Tech people to enforce it
SRAC effectiveness

Who has the answers?

Farmer, Cloy, Greg X and others are gone and can't be replaced.

What a ****ing **** show.

[Frank Castros]

Who was the National Tech Director 1985 to 1995?

[Robbie Draughon]

I say do away with half pound classes. Make them a whole pound to move classes. Then you do away with half the classes. No where to run from a heads up. Run sticks and autos together also.

[Mike Volkman]

Originally Posted by Robbie Draughon

I say do away with half pound classes. Make them a whole pound to move classes. Then you do away with half the classes. No where to run from a heads up. Run sticks and autos together also.

Especially in GT. Don't know if you actually do in SS. Or another idea is to put all the Fuel Injection cars together.

I seen where Billy or Mark wrote - go to Indy with all you got, regardless if hit Monday or not. The motivation back then was to take the record off the other guy because he went .01 faster than you did. Be nice to run as fast as you can all the time. I had a blast at Columbus - because you could go as fast as you wanted, Indy and at Galot because it was 1/8 mile. If we had a chance i'd still take a shot, hp or not.

[Brad Zaskowski]

Originally Posted by SDS Inc

Especially in GT. Don't know if you actually do in SS. Or another idea is to put all the Fuel Injection cars together.

I seen where Billy or Mark wrote - go to Indy with all you got, regardless if hit Monday or not. The motivation back then was to take the record off the other guy because he went .01 faster than you did. Be nice to run as fast as you can all the time. I had a blast at Columbus - because you could go as fast as you wanted, Indy and at Galot because it was 1/8 mile. If we had a chance i'd still take a shot, hp or not.

You forgot to put a * In front of your suggestion of putting all the efi cars together to have it marked for potential personal agenda…. How would that help anything except make more alphabet soup classes?

[Mike Volkman]

Originally Posted by Brad Zaskowski

You forgot to put a * In front of your suggestion of putting all the efi cars together to have it marked for potential personal agenda…. How would that help anything except make more alphabet soup classes?

5 reasons

1. Not my idea. NHRA originally did it back when in stock and then separated back once field was somewhat level. They set the precedent.
2. Then, did it again when the drag packs and gm's and fords came out because they were so much faster than the others (who complained to nhra then)
3. And, they forgot to take the other older fuel injectors with them when they separated
4. The great disparity between many of the fi and carb vehicles are my reasons. (I do always gripe personally about how the 89-L98 350 and the 350/300 in SS have all the same components except ones carb and the other fi - but fi is rated at 275(?) and the 350/300 is at 313 or 318 depending about on the head - which Emily does not run against). Coming out of same shop. 10# break is 430 difference. Cant see the logic there.
5. I like watching races where its not a slaughter by one vehicle under rated. Not sure any one does. In my opinion, as long as the guys are within .1-.15 there's a fighting chance.

Lastly - wont make more classes. Roll them in w the fgt cars.

And no, its not about me or the 3 cars - now 4 - we run here. Love the sport and want to see good competition.

For your info - we run both combinations.

Side bar - While we are at it. I get emails from both Kent (div 1 srac) and Crutch (div 2 srac) along with surveys asking what the racers think. Can you add me to your mailing list? Thanks.

And why make it personnel? Goal is trying to make it better for all of us.

Volkman
412.651.2356

[PozQB14]

Originally Posted by Robbie Draughon

I say do away with half pound classes. Make them a whole pound to move classes. Then you do away with half the classes. No where to run from a heads up. Run sticks and autos together also.

Nailed it, except for the sticks and auto's. Thats a tough one. But think about it. Forget points and money incentives. Just going to the next round or being able to get throught a tough field of cars. Its so simple and Lonnie can make this happen over night. 1.) No more half point weight breaks for Stock and Super Stock (stock 69 ZL1 cars are already heavy enough), put them at 7# in AA and continue down from there. And GT cars can only run GT and natural super stock cars can only run SS. BOOM! You'll have more heads up runs in one year than the previous 5 years combined.