Cheating [2-step And Buttons]

09-20-2007, 06:42 PM

When Was The Last Time A Racer Was Tossed For Cheating With A 2 Step And Button In Stock?? How Many Infactions Have Occured This Year?? This Should Be The Bais That Nhra Should Use To Make The Decision On The 2 Step Button,not The Opinion Of Racers That Choose Not To Use A Button.

Joe Mocci M/sa

Sean Ward · 09-20-2007, 07:34 PM

Heck i don't even have a line loc let alone a 2 step

tgriffith · 09-20-2007, 07:57 PM

Joe,,did you ever think that it may not be a cheating issue but an issue of either,,,, stockers didnt come with anything resembling a 2step/button controled leaving device,,,,,,OR the added advantage of correctly using one for the quicker cars,,,,,,,,for the majority of the ones using,,,,its just a go fast item,,,,for a minority that does use them correctly,,,it is nearly an unbeatable item that has a vast range of adjustability with just turning of knobs or changing a button or the combination of both

LNorton · 09-20-2007, 08:06 PM

Agreed,

A good way to prove what tim is talking about is to pull our your handy practice tree... Make 50 hits using your button. Make 50 hits with a foot pedal. Guarantee that your lights off the button are more consistent, and can be more easily adjusted than any footfeeder can.

Plus the fact that if you hit the flash well, all you have to do is adjust the car and keep hitting the flash.

Real race cars have 3 pedals!

stockracer · 09-20-2007, 08:17 PM

How many times have we been here? Nobody that I know of besides muncy has been caught cheating in a while! As far as a go fast item, I believe if you ask anybody who uses one, 90% loose 2-5 hundredths in the 60' And your right about flash racing, it takes some room for error out, So go do it! Try it for your self! And I personaly believe that foot braking is easier in a real car then on a pratice tree! Norton, dont be pissed, cant you flash race just as easy in a stick car? No different than a trans brake! jmo...

Ryan Horensky · 09-20-2007, 08:35 PM

I can hit the tree harder and be more consistent off the footbrake than I can off the two-step. I've been footbraking for 10 years. However, I would like to have the opportunity to try the two-step again in the future. If they are not banned first. Two steps are a part of stock and should stay. In my family I'm the young guy who doesn't want to use the two-step, because i'm more comfortable footbraking. My dad has used the two-step for 12 years and is comfortable driving that way. Let everyone do what they want and stop tryin to change everything. Every person has a preference. It doesn't mean you should start trying to ban things because you personally do not like them. That isn't fair to the other guys.

Ryan Horensky
1273 C/SA

Mike Mayhew · 09-20-2007, 08:41 PM

It was my good friend Al Peters that figured out the guy that was using a delay box in stock about 3 years ago at an NHRA national event. Don't remember the guys name. It's a pretty intersting story how AL figured it out. I'll tell ya at the track sometime if anyone is interested. Al gathered up the Emmons boys at the national event in Texas and they nabbed him.
But guess what. That guy had used the box in NHRA and IHRA and won in both bodies with it.
It took another racer to find it.
I just heard a story last weekend in Jackson about a SS racer that was caught with a box in a previous NHRA race. The story was from a guy that saw it first hand.

I've personally never called anyone a cheater. I don't even think about it at the track. I always feel if I do my job I can win. Can't think of a sole that I think would cheat with a box.
But every year or so someone is caught.
Sittin at home, just thinking about things, I guess it's easy to think that 'someone'...'somewhere' is doing......'something'.

Without a 2step it's 90% impossible to use a box. This is like what they say about locks I guess. It keeps honest people honest.
Maybe no 2step/button would take the temptation away from an honest racer. If only 1 "hidden-delay-device " person a year decides to do otherwise it's worth it.
I guess ?

Remember that 2 steps have only been legal for a few years. They were not legal longer than they have been legal ( in Stock ). So history isn't an accurate way to judge this I believe.
I can live with it either way.

LNorton · 09-20-2007, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stockracer

How many times have we been here? Nobody that I know of besides muncy has been caught cheating in a while! As far as a go fast item, I believe if you ask anybody who uses one, 90% loose 2-5 hundredths in the 60' And your right about flash racing, it takes some room for error out, So go do it! Try it for your self! And I personaly believe that foot braking is easier in a real car then on a pratice tree! Norton, dont be pissed, cant you flash race just as easy in a stick car? No different than a trans brake! jmo...

The car is too slow to leave on the flash. The weight break we run in is equal to P/SA. In pure stock we are also restricted to all stock suspension components except for shocks.

The beginning of all of this can be traced back to the LED bulbs. With them it was easy to leave between bulbs, but now it is darn near impossible.

tgriffith · 09-20-2007, 09:03 PM

Lee,,,have you ever thought about blinding the tree and leaving on the second bulb?????,,,I know,,,I know,,its too quick,,,,BUT how about second gear at about 2500???? or even 3rd gear (if possible),,,,it could be worked out,,,VAN is doing it now and he is nearly perfect every pass in the Burb,,,,I seen a string of .00`s to .01`s that would make your mouth water,,,your car is fast enough to run under the index with no problem even leaving in 2nd and maybe 3rd,,,,,,need to try it at a frid test if it wont tear any thing up

you racers that have a heavy slow car can use a 2 step off the 2nd bulb leaving out of 2nd or third gear,,,,kills only about .5 to .60 tenths and still have the option of Flash racing like the faster cars......if 2steps/buttons stay legal,,,,,thats our intentions,,,,,,going to get a huge wagon that runs about 1.00 under and leave out of high gear,,,,,it will work ---or maybe a turbo car--who knows???

Mickey Whaley · 09-20-2007, 09:33 PM

I'm not taking up for anyone who has or was caught cheating. by the way if you know someone please post a name for the real racers to see?? i would like to know, not just talk about someone doing it just post their name and be done with it. As cheaters go at the Gainesville Nat'l event every winner in the first round was driven up on ramps and checked for line locks hooked to buttons by mr collins who takes sides with no one and not a single person was bounced so i know that the entire stock class was looked at, i dont know if every division does this but DIV 2 did no cheaters.

09-20-2007, 06:42 PM	#1
stk1424 Guest Posts: n/a	Cheating [2-step And Buttons] When Was The Last Time A Racer Was Tossed For Cheating With A 2 Step And Button In Stock?? How Many Infactions Have Occured This Year?? This Should Be The Bais That Nhra Should Use To Make The Decision On The 2 Step Button,not The Opinion Of Racers That Choose Not To Use A Button. Joe Mocci M/sa

09-20-2007, 07:34 PM	#2
Sean Ward Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Grand Island FL. Posts: 389 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Heck i don't even have a line loc let alone a 2 step __________________ Sean Ward NHRA s/ss/comp#2882 SW4 MOTORSPORTS

09-20-2007, 07:57 PM	#3
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Joe,,did you ever think that it may not be a cheating issue but an issue of either,,,, stockers didnt come with anything resembling a 2step/button controled leaving device,,,,,,OR the added advantage of correctly using one for the quicker cars,,,,,,,,for the majority of the ones using,,,,its just a go fast item,,,,for a minority that does use them correctly,,,it is nearly an unbeatable item that has a vast range of adjustability with just turning of knobs or changing a button or the combination of both

09-20-2007, 08:06 PM	#4
LNorton Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: RacerTees.com Posts: 505 Likes: 0 Liked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Agreed, A good way to prove what tim is talking about is to pull our your handy practice tree... Make 50 hits using your button. Make 50 hits with a foot pedal. Guarantee that your lights off the button are more consistent, and can be more easily adjusted than any footfeeder can. Plus the fact that if you hit the flash well, all you have to do is adjust the car and keep hitting the flash. Real race cars have 3 pedals! __________________ Lee Norton - N229 STK IHRA H/FIA - NHRA O/SA RacerTees.com

09-20-2007, 08:17 PM	#5
stockracer Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 79 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] How many times have we been here? Nobody that I know of besides muncy has been caught cheating in a while! As far as a go fast item, I believe if you ask anybody who uses one, 90% loose 2-5 hundredths in the 60' And your right about flash racing, it takes some room for error out, So go do it! Try it for your self! And I personaly believe that foot braking is easier in a real car then on a pratice tree! Norton, dont be pissed, cant you flash race just as easy in a stick car? No different than a trans brake! jmo...

09-20-2007, 08:35 PM	#6
Ryan Horensky Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Sugarloaf,PA Posts: 201 Likes: 19 Liked 109 Times in 18 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] I can hit the tree harder and be more consistent off the footbrake than I can off the two-step. I've been footbraking for 10 years. However, I would like to have the opportunity to try the two-step again in the future. If they are not banned first. Two steps are a part of stock and should stay. In my family I'm the young guy who doesn't want to use the two-step, because i'm more comfortable footbraking. My dad has used the two-step for 12 years and is comfortable driving that way. Let everyone do what they want and stop tryin to change everything. Every person has a preference. It doesn't mean you should start trying to ban things because you personally do not like them. That isn't fair to the other guys. Ryan Horensky 1273 C/SA

09-20-2007, 08:41 PM	#7
Mike Mayhew Banned Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Savannah Ga. Posts: 124 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] It was my good friend Al Peters that figured out the guy that was using a delay box in stock about 3 years ago at an NHRA national event. Don't remember the guys name. It's a pretty intersting story how AL figured it out. I'll tell ya at the track sometime if anyone is interested. Al gathered up the Emmons boys at the national event in Texas and they nabbed him. But guess what. That guy had used the box in NHRA and IHRA and won in both bodies with it. It took another racer to find it. I just heard a story last weekend in Jackson about a SS racer that was caught with a box in a previous NHRA race. The story was from a guy that saw it first hand. I've personally never called anyone a cheater. I don't even think about it at the track. I always feel if I do my job I can win. Can't think of a sole that I think would cheat with a box. But every year or so someone is caught. Sittin at home, just thinking about things, I guess it's easy to think that 'someone'...'somewhere' is doing......'something'. Without a 2step it's 90% impossible to use a box. This is like what they say about locks I guess. It keeps honest people honest. Maybe no 2step/button would take the temptation away from an honest racer. If only 1 "hidden-delay-device " person a year decides to do otherwise it's worth it. I guess ? Remember that 2 steps have only been legal for a few years. They were not legal longer than they have been legal ( in Stock ). So history isn't an accurate way to judge this I believe. I can live with it either way.

09-20-2007, 09:03 PM	#9
tgriffith Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 187 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] Lee,,,have you ever thought about blinding the tree and leaving on the second bulb?????,,,I know,,,I know,,its too quick,,,,BUT how about second gear at about 2500???? or even 3rd gear (if possible),,,,it could be worked out,,,VAN is doing it now and he is nearly perfect every pass in the Burb,,,,I seen a string of .00`s to .01`s that would make your mouth water,,,your car is fast enough to run under the index with no problem even leaving in 2nd and maybe 3rd,,,,,,need to try it at a frid test if it wont tear any thing up you racers that have a heavy slow car can use a 2 step off the 2nd bulb leaving out of 2nd or third gear,,,,kills only about .5 to .60 tenths and still have the option of Flash racing like the faster cars......if 2steps/buttons stay legal,,,,,thats our intentions,,,,,,going to get a huge wagon that runs about 1.00 under and leave out of high gear,,,,,it will work ---or maybe a turbo car--who knows???

09-20-2007, 09:33 PM	#10
Mickey Whaley VIP Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 1,220 Likes: 0 Liked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Cheating [2-step And Buttons] I'm not taking up for anyone who has or was caught cheating. by the way if you know someone please post a name for the real racers to see?? i would like to know, not just talk about someone doing it just post their name and be done with it. As cheaters go at the Gainesville Nat'l event every winner in the first round was driven up on ramps and checked for line locks hooked to buttons by mr collins who takes sides with no one and not a single person was bounced so i know that the entire stock class was looked at, i dont know if every division does this but DIV 2 did no cheaters.

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