Hooking up an A Body Mopar

[bill dedman]

My bracket car needs help, but I'm not sure which way to go with rear suspension mods, and since the Stock Eliminator '67-76 A bodies with small blocks are very similar to what I run, power-wise, I thought I'd ask for some advice on making this thing hook.

Here's the car's specs: 904 Torqueflite-equipped 1972 Plymouth Valiant 4-door (just 14 pounds heavier than a '72 Duster, so should be very similar chassis dynamics; same 108" wheelbase, etc.) Race weight with heavy-*** driver 3,600. Engine is a near-stock, Vortech supercharged 360 Magnum running 10 pounds of boost; chassis dyno says 445 RWHP at about 5,500 rpm and and 470 RW torque. Redline is 6,000 for reasons of longivity. Best 1,000-ft. e.t. was 9.74 @106 mph. Best 1.8th-mile (same pass) was 7.59 @94. Those were with minimal bite (1.81 60-ft. time) No quarter-mile times available, but that equates to approximately 11.85 and 116mph, 1/4-mile.

The rear is an 8.75" Auburn Sure Grip, (new.), and the ring and pinion I have for it is a 4.10 ratio (will be installed, soon.) The times I gave you were done with a 3.55.1. The 4.10 will go in as soon as the Moser axles get here. No spool, just a NEW limited-sliip.

New slicks will be probably 28" tall. That will put me at the finish line of the 1,000-foot strip I run, just under the redline with the 4.10 gear. The tires I had when I ran it with the 3.55 were 26"-tall, B.F. Goodrich T/A Drag Radials. No burnout. No traction, either. It spun all the way through 1st gear, no matter what, but it was only 48 degrees... so, maybe that was why the VHT didn't seem to work.

Anyway, the 1.81 60-foot times I turned won't get it. Wheelspin is my enemy, so I need some advice as to which way to go with the mods.

What I have in use, currently insofar as "traction aids" are: stock, 5-leaf rear springs with three clamps each side, on the front section; pre-load air bag on right rear; adjustable pinion snubber, 1/2" gap; 90-10 shocks up front with stock torsion bars. KYB Gas-Filled shocks in back, non-adjustable. 8" wide BFG T/A drag radials at 16-pounds, on 7"-wide, 15"-diameter Centerlines. Spin city...

I know the tires have to go, and I am not averse to buying REAL drag slicks from Hoosier, or M/T... or, whoever, but this car has very limited lateral wheel-well dimensions (not like a Duster, which has more room), so they can't be 10.5's... those would hit everywhere, I'm afraid. They DO need to be 15"-wheel size and 28"-tall... no exception, because of the wheels I have and the gears I'll be running. Other than that, manufacturer and width can be anything, within the "fit" parameters, width-wise.

What I REALLY need to know is this: Is it possible to get this car to hook WELL, with "old-technology" super stock springs, or do I really need to bite the bullet and buy a set of Cal-Tracs or Slide-a-Link bars? This engine pulls really hard at low rpm's and will generate some reasonable (1,60?) foot times IF I can get it to hook.

I'd prefer NOT to have to put Cal-Tracs (or, the others) on it if I can get by with just the S/S springs as it's a street driven car and I really don't want all that hardware hanging down in view unless it's totally necessary. But, I WILL go that route if I have to. Also, will Cal-Tracs work with my stock springs (if I have to go that route), or should I use Cal-Tracs AND S/S springs??? I'm pretty ignorant about this stuff, as to what to use.

Can some of you A-Body Stocker gurus tell me which route to take with this thing? I'm lusting after a launch like the A-Body cars that run well in F, G, and H/SA bring to the strip, and am willing to spend a few bucks to get it. It's just a bracket car, so it will end up with a fiberglass hood, bumper, etc., and already has two big batteries in the trunk; none up front (the blower occupies the old battery space.)

It's a shame to have the power to go low-to-mid 11's in the quarter and barely be able to break 12-flat because of traction problems.

Any help on this issue would be greatly appreciated.

Recommendations, please.... ????????????????

Bill

[herbjr]

Quit screwing around and put the Calvert, mono leaf, rancho shocks and bars on. We did that on our car,

3800 LBS
12.05 108.00 1.52 in 60 foot first time out. Made 8 runs within .003 in 60 foot. My first set of mono leaf cal tracks set and I love them.

Its a Dodge Coronet Wagon. Or Ill sell you my SS springs off our duster so I can put the Mono's on that car.

Its a stock crate motor 360, 5.13 gear dana.
Herb Jr

[George Mirza]

Some of us are still using SS springs, but the Cal tracs are the way to go on an all out race car. For a few hundred bucks you can try 3200# or 3400# SS spring, Mancini Racing has a good selection. Make sure you get the aluminum front eye bushings and lube them up well so they pivot easily on the hanger bolt. Get some 2 and 4 degree pinion shims and try them to see what works best. These go between the spring perches on the rear end and the springs. Most guys are using the Rancho 9 way adjustable shocks, get the ones for a Dodge truck, or you can use a stock shock with a shock extension on it. Make sure the shock has enough travel and does not limit the amount the rear can drop. Simple way to check this is to put the car on jack stands under the frame and disconnect the shocks and let the rear end drop as low as it can go, then see if the shocks extend past the lower shock mount. Throw the pinion snubber away, if the springs work it will never touch the floor.

Now that the rear is right it's time for the front, I won't get into it, but 6cyl torsion bars or the Mopar drag bars are a good choice. V8 bars have to much spring and will unload the back tires and cause spin after the launch.

Good luck, let us know how it works out.

George Mirza 1236 E/SA '71 Duster

[Jeff Teuton]

Send me the chineese ss springs. My anchors have been eaten away by the salt water for my boat. Get the Cal Tracs;, mono leafs, shocks, and go fishing. 1.81. That's really bad.

[bill dedman]

Thanks guys.... Cal Tracs/mono-leafs it is... I won't waste my time with the "old" technology this time.

John Calvert is a genius, I guess....

For right now, I'll leave the front torsion bars in; that'll be a project for next winter. I think they're the 340 bars because this car was originally a 318 with factory air. I think they put the 340 bars in those cars.

I have them "unwound" to the extent that the rubber bumpers are just touching (set very low.)

Any suggestions on tires? I need something S-T-I-C-K-Y.... I'm tired of these turbo Buicks eating my lunch...

Thanks again to all of you for all the good advice!!!

Bill

[Qwik426]

"I won't waste my time with the "old" technology this time.

John Calvert is a genius, I guess...."

John's "new" technology ain't exactly new. It's been around a while. But I do get your point.

[treessavoy]

Originally Posted by Jeff Teuton

Send me the chineese ss springs. My anchors have been eaten away by the salt water for my boat. Get the Cal Tracs;, mono leafs, shocks, and go fishing. 1.81. That's really bad.

Had a friend who ran a super gas camaro using only the '68 SS springs and shocks. I'm still running the one's I bought in the '70's on my '64 Savoy.

When did they go overseas for the cheapies they sell now?

Jim

I use an entire '69 camaro with a ZL1 for a boat anchor, it'll only rust so far!

[bill dedman]

Terry,

Here' my engine:

STOCK 360 Magnum short block EXCEPT for the cam.

The cam specs are: 214-218@ .050"-lift, ground with 114-degree lobe separation. Gross lift at valve .525"

Ground by Engle for Hughesperformance, a Mopar-only vendor with a dyno. HE says it's a good supercharger cam. Very little overlap. Stock hydraulic roller lifters with 300# open, Crane aluminum roller 1.6:1 (stock ratio) rockers.

Heads; OEM 318/360 Magnum cast iron 1.94".1.60" with a 3-angle valve job and minimal valve bowl work; NOTHING else. TRUE compression with stock, dished, hypereutectic pistons: 9.00:1.

Intake manifold: Professional Products 180-degree Air Gap ripoff, untouched

Carb: Holley 4150, 750 double-pumper from the Carb Shop, modified for blow-thru up to 15 psi. ($900.00!!!)

Ignition: MSD Boostmaster with MSD Blaster coil (all analog; no multiple spark discharge)

Exhaust: TTI stepped headers (1-5/8" into 1-3/4") with 3 1/2" collector; 2.5" street exhaust with Dynomax Super Turbo mufflers


Snowperformance BoostCooler alcohol injection system coming on at 3 psi of boost.

Fuel: Avgas... probably 106-110 octane. Doesn't ever detonate, even at 10 psi of boost.

Transmission: Len Schneider built 2.45 low 904 with a 2500rpm stall 318 converter (cheap!) As much low end torque as this thing makes, the last thing it needs is a hi-stall converter. Pulls like a freight locomotive at 2,500....

Idles fairly smoothly at 475 rpm and makes 12 inches of vacuum for the power brakes at that speed.

160-degree thermostat

M-P "curved" OEM-type distributor.

3.55:1 Auburn limited slip, 8.75", soon to be 4.10:1.

Moser axles coming very soon.

When I put this engine together, a supercharger was nowhere on the horizon; I'd never even considered one. I wanted a car my wife could drive and she hates ragged idles; that's how that short-duration cam got in there. But, it only ran low 13's without a blower (I even had 340 exhaust manifolds on it), and that wouldn't get it. I spied a Vortech V-1, S-Trim new in the box on Ebay for a grand, and decided that that was the crutch I needed to pick this ol' tub up a bit.

It picked it up about a second and a half and 17 mph....

It cost me a lot (about 4 grand) by the time I put the new half-inch fuel system with 2 pumps on it (main pump and a backup; I don't trust electric fuel pumps.)

I have a 4" arm and a new set of rods for it... saving for some JE slugs right now. 402 cid will work.

In the meantime, I can have some fun with it as it sits, IF I can get it to hook.

That's what this is all about...

Thanks for your time and all the good info! The cam is gonna stay, at least for now. Driveability around town is like a 2bbl 318... I like that.

Bill