Fuel pump check

Lonnie Cox · 03-02-2013, 01:59 PM

Just want to cover all the bases while engine is out and on Dyno.

Fuel pump on pumped about 3/4 of a gallon after regulator in 30 seconds.

Acceptable or not?

350 cid, Quadrajet carb, I/SA

1/2 inch line,,

Holley blue pump

350/287nhra hp

Thank you all!

Kenny Wigington · 03-02-2013, 03:25 PM

Not on a quadrajet. That pump, although it's a good one, will not feed your motor, going down track. Look for #10 line from cell to filter and to pump on the regulator. #8 from reg to carb. I would suggest a Magnafuel 275, at least. BG280 , if it wouldnt let you down in a bad time, would be a good one.... Aeromotive and Magnafuel will have what you need and not kill your wallet. Weldon makes a VERY good pump too.

Alan Roehrich · 03-02-2013, 04:22 PM

Lonnie,
None of the "budget" pumps will feed a Q-Jet like yours. You need a lot of volume at a relatively low pressure to run a Q-Jet, and the budget pumps need a lot of pressure to create volume. A Q-Jet has a very small float bowl, and a relatively small single inlet, for the same CFM as a 4150 series 750 Holley, which has two large float bowls with two relatively large inlets.

Kenny is dead on with the MagnaFuel suggestion.

Honestly, for consistency and longevity, you can't put too big a fuel pump, regulator, and lines on a race car. We've had MagnaFuel's biggest pump and system on the orange 69 Camaro for 6 years. The worst problem we've ever had is a seal in the bottom of the pump after 5 years, including 1 year where the car barely ran. The entire kit to build their best and biggest pump was under $25, and Summit had it in stock.

Dean Oliver · 03-02-2013, 04:45 PM

Lonnie,

Kenny is right, that is not enough pump for your application. There are a surprising number of class cars that still run a Holley Blue or Black pump, most with results just like you described. I finally got tired of fighting these pumps myself and I switched to an Aeromotive SS pump thanks to Kyle Fickler when he worked there. These pumps aren't much more expensive than the cheap Holleys, but mine will flow just as well today as it did 5 years ago when I installed it. You can buy bigger and more exotic fuel systems, but this pump works great on small block Stockers. Always remember to be sure that you have good voltage at the pump, regardless of brand. Pump output is directly proportional to voltage input.

I have a relatively simple system on my 305 Stocker. From the fuel cell I run a -8 line to the pump, which is mounted rearward and lower than my cell. That way the g's of the car will actuallly help feed the pump. From the pump I have a -6 line to the regulator, and a -6 line from the regulator to the carb. Eliminate or reduce the number of 90 degree fittings in the system as best you can.

With regard to the regulator, I currently run the big port Holley dead-head style regulator. If you are still running the regulator that came with the Holley Blue pump, definitely plan on replacing it. The "Blue" regulator has an internal orifice of .220", and you obviously cannot afford to have a bottleneck in your fuel system of less than 1/4" like that. The big port Holley has an internal orifice of .437", and there are other brands of regulators that are just as good/big, including Aeromotive. I have my regulator mounted in front of, and slightly higher than my carb inlet, so that once I drop the fuel pressure down at the regulator the lower pressure line does not have to fight the g's of the car.

This system gives me a gallon in 26 seconds every time I have free flowed it since it was new 5 years ago. In actuality, once I got the system to less than about 35 seconds the car stopped picking up, so I know 26 is overkill for my little 305 but that's just extra security. My Racepak shows the fuel pressure to be very consistent from one run to the next, and my high gear average is normally 5.6 psi plus or minus 0.1 psi.

Dean

Richard Grant · 03-02-2013, 06:46 PM

This is good advice from these guys. You can't get too much pump or too big of a line. Use a high flow regulator with a high dollar pump and large lines. The bigger the better. You can't have too much but it's easy to have too little. I was told that we need 25 lbs pressure at the regulator and 6 lbs at the carb. To get that you need a quality pump and bigggg lines.

Grant Eldridge · 03-03-2013, 01:57 AM

Lots of good information posted here! I raced a 396 E/SA 325 or 350hp combination. I started with a Holley blue and #8 lines with the Holley regulator, just like the system described . Next I switched to Holley black, better Magnafuel deadhead regulator, #10 line, but the car still seemed not quite right on the top end. Finally, in my third system, I have an A-2000 Aeromotive pump, a return system with Aeromotive regulator and #10 lines both ways, and a #12 section from the regulator to the Q-jet to supply additional volume of fuel to the needle and seat. I know this sounds like overkill, but the Q-jet as explained above needs a lot of volume and not high pressure, or the float cannot overcome the higher pressure and the single needle will fail to seat, you will have flooding. This system will deliver a gallon in less than 15 seconds. If you spend the money once, and do a top notch system, you can then depend on it and concentrate on other things. I tried doing this the cheap way, guaranteed I wasted a lot of time and money re-doing the system several times to do it right. Plus, you can chase tuneup issues such as a slight top end miss or pop endlessly that are actually the result of lack of fuel volume. Just my two cents...

Grant Eldridge
E/SA 6650
National Record Holder 2006/2011

terry1 · 03-03-2013, 11:26 AM

It appears that the Aeromotive "SS" pump has the same specs as the Holley "Black" pump,which is what I am using now,with an Aeromotive reg.
I am thinking of upgrading my pump.It seems to me that the Aeromotive A 2000 would be a good/better choice than a "SS".
Any thoughts?

MEXJOE · 03-12-2013, 10:32 AM

What is the correct way to set-up this by pas system?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grant Eldridge

Lots of good information posted here! I raced a 396 E/SA 325 or 350hp combination. I started with a Holley blue and #8 lines with the Holley regulator, just like the system described . Next I switched to Holley black, better Magnafuel deadhead regulator, #10 line, but the car still seemed not quite right on the top end. Finally, in my third system, I have an A-2000 Aeromotive pump, a return system with Aeromotive regulator and #10 lines both ways, and a #12 section from the regulator to the Q-jet to supply additional volume of fuel to the needle and seat. I know this sounds like overkill, but the Q-jet as explained above needs a lot of volume and not high pressure, or the float cannot overcome the higher pressure and the single needle will fail to seat, you will have flooding. This system will deliver a gallon in less than 15 seconds. If you spend the money once, and do a top notch system, you can then depend on it and concentrate on other things. I tried doing this the cheap way, guaranteed I wasted a lot of time and money re-doing the system several times to do it right. Plus, you can chase tuneup issues such as a slight top end miss or pop endlessly that are actually the result of lack of fuel volume. Just my two cents...

Grant Eldridge
E/SA 6650
National Record Holder 2006/2011

03-02-2013, 03:25 PM	#2
Kenny Wigington Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Cumming,Ga. USA Posts: 967 Likes: 36 Liked 60 Times in 12 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check Not on a quadrajet. That pump, although it's a good one, will not feed your motor, going down track. Look for #10 line from cell to filter and to pump on the regulator. #8 from reg to carb. I would suggest a Magnafuel 275, at least. BG280 , if it wouldnt let you down in a bad time, would be a good one.... Aeromotive and Magnafuel will have what you need and not kill your wallet. Weldon makes a VERY good pump too. __________________ 2894 STK

03-02-2013, 04:22 PM	#3
Alan Roehrich Veteran Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Murfreesboro TN Posts: 5,116 Likes: 1,573 Liked 1,830 Times in 415 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check Lonnie, None of the "budget" pumps will feed a Q-Jet like yours. You need a lot of volume at a relatively low pressure to run a Q-Jet, and the budget pumps need a lot of pressure to create volume. A Q-Jet has a very small float bowl, and a relatively small single inlet, for the same CFM as a 4150 series 750 Holley, which has two large float bowls with two relatively large inlets. Kenny is dead on with the MagnaFuel suggestion. Honestly, for consistency and longevity, you can't put too big a fuel pump, regulator, and lines on a race car. We've had MagnaFuel's biggest pump and system on the orange 69 Camaro for 6 years. The worst problem we've ever had is a seal in the bottom of the pump after 5 years, including 1 year where the car barely ran. The entire kit to build their best and biggest pump was under $25, and Summit had it in stock. __________________ Alan Roehrich 212A G/S

03-02-2013, 04:45 PM	#4
Dean Oliver Junior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Stuttgart, AR Posts: 53 Likes: 1 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check Lonnie, Kenny is right, that is not enough pump for your application. There are a surprising number of class cars that still run a Holley Blue or Black pump, most with results just like you described. I finally got tired of fighting these pumps myself and I switched to an Aeromotive SS pump thanks to Kyle Fickler when he worked there. These pumps aren't much more expensive than the cheap Holleys, but mine will flow just as well today as it did 5 years ago when I installed it. You can buy bigger and more exotic fuel systems, but this pump works great on small block Stockers. Always remember to be sure that you have good voltage at the pump, regardless of brand. Pump output is directly proportional to voltage input. I have a relatively simple system on my 305 Stocker. From the fuel cell I run a -8 line to the pump, which is mounted rearward and lower than my cell. That way the g's of the car will actuallly help feed the pump. From the pump I have a -6 line to the regulator, and a -6 line from the regulator to the carb. Eliminate or reduce the number of 90 degree fittings in the system as best you can. With regard to the regulator, I currently run the big port Holley dead-head style regulator. If you are still running the regulator that came with the Holley Blue pump, definitely plan on replacing it. The "Blue" regulator has an internal orifice of .220", and you obviously cannot afford to have a bottleneck in your fuel system of less than 1/4" like that. The big port Holley has an internal orifice of .437", and there are other brands of regulators that are just as good/big, including Aeromotive. I have my regulator mounted in front of, and slightly higher than my carb inlet, so that once I drop the fuel pressure down at the regulator the lower pressure line does not have to fight the g's of the car. This system gives me a gallon in 26 seconds every time I have free flowed it since it was new 5 years ago. In actuality, once I got the system to less than about 35 seconds the car stopped picking up, so I know 26 is overkill for my little 305 but that's just extra security. My Racepak shows the fuel pressure to be very consistent from one run to the next, and my high gear average is normally 5.6 psi plus or minus 0.1 psi. Dean

03-02-2013, 06:46 PM	#5
Richard Grant Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: West Monroe, La. Posts: 301 Likes: 9 Liked 13 Times in 7 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check This is good advice from these guys. You can't get too much pump or too big of a line. Use a high flow regulator with a high dollar pump and large lines. The bigger the better. You can't have too much but it's easy to have too little. I was told that we need 25 lbs pressure at the regulator and 6 lbs at the carb. To get that you need a quality pump and bigggg lines. __________________ Richard Grant 4988 STK

03-03-2013, 01:57 AM	#6
Grant Eldridge Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 124 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check Lots of good information posted here! I raced a 396 E/SA 325 or 350hp combination. I started with a Holley blue and #8 lines with the Holley regulator, just like the system described . Next I switched to Holley black, better Magnafuel deadhead regulator, #10 line, but the car still seemed not quite right on the top end. Finally, in my third system, I have an A-2000 Aeromotive pump, a return system with Aeromotive regulator and #10 lines both ways, and a #12 section from the regulator to the Q-jet to supply additional volume of fuel to the needle and seat. I know this sounds like overkill, but the Q-jet as explained above needs a lot of volume and not high pressure, or the float cannot overcome the higher pressure and the single needle will fail to seat, you will have flooding. This system will deliver a gallon in less than 15 seconds. If you spend the money once, and do a top notch system, you can then depend on it and concentrate on other things. I tried doing this the cheap way, guaranteed I wasted a lot of time and money re-doing the system several times to do it right. Plus, you can chase tuneup issues such as a slight top end miss or pop endlessly that are actually the result of lack of fuel volume. Just my two cents... Grant Eldridge E/SA 6650 National Record Holder 2006/2011

03-02-2013, 01:59 PM	#1
Lonnie Cox Junior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 88 Likes: 0 Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Fuel pump check Just want to cover all the bases while engine is out and on Dyno. Fuel pump on pumped about 3/4 of a gallon after regulator in 30 seconds. Acceptable or not? 350 cid, Quadrajet carb, I/SA 1/2 inch line,, Holley blue pump 350/287nhra hp Thank you all!

03-03-2013, 11:26 AM	#7
terry1 Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Moncton, N.B. Posts: 276 Likes: 24 Liked 24 Times in 13 Posts	Re: Fuel pump check It appears that the Aeromotive "SS" pump has the same specs as the Holley "Black" pump,which is what I am using now,with an Aeromotive reg. I am thinking of upgrading my pump.It seems to me that the Aeromotive A 2000 would be a good/better choice than a "SS". Any thoughts?